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roytoner

terms of service for reservists called up in 1914

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roytoner

hi all, when reservists were called up was that for the duration of the war or perhaps until their time in the reserve was due to be completed? Or something else entirely? I have a reservist who was called up on the outbreak of war and then was discharged in January 1916. He rejoined the army later that year. I don't know if he was discharged due to injury or another reason.

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ss002d6252

The reservists in 1914 were called up to complete the balance of their reserve period + 1 year wartime extension. When did he originally join the army and what branch ?

His re-enlistment was either conscription or a voluntary enlistment before he was conscripted.

Craig

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tullybrone

Just to expand on Craig's post -

My gf was a recalled reservist in 1914. His 12 year commitment should have ended Sept 1917 but there was a condition on his original enlistment that he should serve a further year if a state of war existed.

That obligation was superseded by the conditions of the Military Service Act - service for the duration. He was awarded a £20 bounty plus a months home leave in September 1918 under the MSA as he continued into his 14th year of service.

If a reservist or regular or Territorial soldiers service expired before the MSA he would be discharged time expired.

Regards

Steve Y

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Guest

If your reserve service expired before the end of Jan 1916 you were allowed to go. The diaries are full of examples of men being discharged 'time expired' in 1914 and 1915. However once Conscription came in at the end of Jan 1916, a man who had been discharged time expired who was still within the age bracket would be conscripted. MG

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roytoner

thanks Steve,Craig & Martin.

His service record exists but only for the service beginning later in 1916.That just states that he was discharged in January 1916 and states his unit up to then. There is no mention of his pre 1914 service but I know he was a reservist through his short obit in the Oldham Chronicle. He was 40 or 41 when rejoining the army in August 1916 and had two or three young children at that point - does this make it more likely he rejoined of his own volition or where they conscripting such men in 1916?

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Guest

thanks Steve,Craig & Martin.

His service record exists but only for the service beginning later in 1916.That just states that he was discharged in January 1916 and states his unit up to then. There is no mention of his pre 1914 service but I know he was a reservist through his short obit in the Oldham Chronicle. He was 40 or 41 when rejoining the army in August 1916 and had two or three young children at that point - does this make it more likely he rejoined of his own volition or where they conscripting such men in 1916?

I suspect he may have been caught in the conscription net when the age limits were raised or the terms changed (married men were conscripted slightly later) I cant recall the exact dates and ages but as the war progressed the 'qualifiers' for Conscription changed. Also single men in each cohort were called up first, then married men which might also have had an impact.

I may have the changing terms somewhere. MG

Edit.

The Military Services Act

Jan 1916 - Conscription for single men aged 18- 41

May 1916 - Conscription for married men aged 18-41

1918 - age raised to 51.

All the above had exemptions for widowers with children, specialist skilled workers etc.

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ss002d6252

thanks Steve,Craig & Martin.

His service record exists but only for the service beginning later in 1916.That just states that he was discharged in January 1916 and states his unit up to then. There is no mention of his pre 1914 service but I know he was a reservist through his short obit in the Oldham Chronicle. He was 40 or 41 when rejoining the army in August 1916 and had two or three young children at that point - does this make it more likely he rejoined of his own volition or where they conscripting such men in 1916?

What was his name and service number ?

Craig

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roytoner

thanks guys, this site is such a mine of fantastic information.

Craig, his name was John Thomas Crawford and service number 26439, Royal Field Artillery. Service record exists but can't find anything prior or any pension records. He was killed serving with the 58th DAC, he was previously with 29th DAC

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Guest

thanks guys, this site is such a mine of fantastic information.

Craig, his name was John Thomas Crawford and service number 26439, Royal Field Artillery. Service record exists but can't find anything prior or any pension records. He was killed serving with the 58th DAC, he was previously with 29th DAC

29th Div was in Egypt, Gallipoli (detachments) and Salonica in 1915. On the way to Salonica in Oct 1915 on the SS Marquette the ship was torpedoed with significant loss of life. Most of 29th DAC was on board (three of the four Sections - some 441 Other Ranks) 107 perished from 29th DAC.

Diary is WO 95/4308.

MG

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ss002d6252

hi all, when reservists were called up was that for the duration of the war or perhaps until their time in the reserve was due to be completed? Or something else entirely? I have a reservist who was called up on the outbreak of war and then was discharged in January 1916. He rejoined the army later that year. I don't know if he was discharged due to injury or another reason.

Are you sure he was re-called at the outbreak of war ?

His (£3 net, £5 gross) war gratuity was paid for 12 months (or less) war time service.

The £2 service gratuity he got would also indicate no more than 24 months service. This can be further tightened up with reference to the war gratuity.

Call up in Aug 16 to his death in May 17 would give 10 months service which would indicate no more than 2 months qualifying war time service prior to Aug 16. He was 36 when he was conscripted (as per his records).

Craig

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roytoner

Are you sure he was re-called at the outbreak of war ?

His (£3 net, £5 gross) war gratuity was paid for 12 months (or less) war time service.

The £2 service gratuity he got would also indicate no more than 24 months service. This can be further tightened up with reference to the war gratuity.

Call up in Aug 16 to his death in May 17 would give 10 months service which would indicate no more than 2 months qualifying war time service prior to Aug 16. He was 36 when he was conscripted (as per his records).

Craig

thanks Craig. Yes I've been a bit puzzled by this man - his service record has next to no info on previous service but the Oldham Chronicle reported that at the outbreak of war he was a reservist on pension and that he went out with the BEF and then later to Gallipoli. After that to Egypt before Western Front. It also says he was 41 but census records do indicate he was younger. His medal card doesnt have the Star though so that would support the idea he hadnt been anywhere in 1915 but it does state 29th DAC and his discharge and he must have been overseas to have been with them.

Thanks Martin, I found the Marquette info the other day - never heard of that one before. All adds to the mystery of putting this man's info together!

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ss002d6252

The error rate on the gratuities is exceedingly low so I trust that it is right (I've seen very few errors but that's not to say there wasn't one)

I'm not sure a reservist received any pension - apart from a discharge for illness or injuries I thought a man only got a pension after 21 years service.

I wondering if he was a time served soldiers who re-enlisted, discharged after a couple of months and then was later conscripted - it seems to be the only thing that would fit the military records evidence at the moment.

A further option , based on the gratuity, is that he had a period either on desertion or on civilian work (munitions etc) as these periods did not accrue gratuity entitlement.

Craig

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Muerrisch

Pension ages other ranks, 1914 Pay Warrant:

after 14 years eligible service if discharged invalided

after 14 years ditto ..................................... on reduction of establishment, except reservists who have rejoined colours

after 18 years if discharged for benefit of public service

after 21 years.

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ss002d6252

Pension ages other ranks, 1914 Pay Warrant:

after 14 years eligible service if discharged invalided

after 14 years ditto ..................................... on reduction of establishment, except reservists who have rejoined colours

after 18 years if discharged for benefit of public service

after 21 years.

Thanks Grumpy.

Craig

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ss002d6252

I also couldn't see anything obvious for a 14-15 star for him to show a date of entry before the end of 1915.

Craig

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roytoner

thanks for all the input, it's greatly appreciated

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jaybee9

A very helpful thread, thank you.

I had wondered why some of my reservists came home at the end of their initial time of service whilst others were compulsorily transferred to serve with another regiment. I now know to factor in the date and also the age of my man.

jaybee9

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Chris_Baker
...

The Military Services Act

Jan 1916 - Conscription for single men aged 18- 41

May 1916 - Conscription for married men aged 18-41

1918 - age raised to 51.

All the above had exemptions for widowers with children, specialist skilled workers etc.

See http://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/soldiers/a-soldiers-life-1914-1918/enlisting-into-the-army/the-1916-military-service-act/for accurate details

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jaybee9

Thanks for the link.

jaybee9

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Guest

Chris - the LLT states 19 year old to 41 etc....Hansard debates in May 1916 and the first and second reading of the original bill indicated the lower age threshold was for men who had achieved the age of 18 on 15th Aug 1915... The IWM has a poster also showing 18 year-olds click Ditto NAM click. Was there a later amendment?

And an original copy shows 18 years was the lower threshold click

post-55873-0-87078200-1462291790_thumb.j

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Ron Clifton

I think the LLT has confused the provisions of the Military Service Acts with the wording of the original poster for "Kitchener's appeal" which stipulated men aged 19 to 30.

Ron

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