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ddycher

Indian Schools of Musketry

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ddycher

All

Does anyone have any details of the Indian Schools of Musketry at "Packmahbi", Changla Gali and Sataba ?

Regards

Dave

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Simon_Fielding

Pachmarhi!

 

 

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Maureene

Changla Gali was small cantonment in the hills between Murree and Abbottabad, now Pakistan

http://dsal.uchicago.edu/reference/gazetteer/pager.html?objectid=DS405.1.I34_V10_179.gif

Sataba is an incorrect transcription and should be Satara ( http://wiki.fibis.org/index.php/Satara )

Google Books reference

https://books.google.com.au/books?id=fIO-BAAAQBAJ&lpg=PA303&ots=1jA0RCwgD4&dq=School%20of%20Musketry%20Satara&pg=PA303

There were also Musketry Schools at Bellary and Secunderabad, and a Machine Gun School at Campbellpur, now called Attock, Pakistan. There was a Machine Gun School at Ahmednagar established c 1922, in conjunction with the Royal Tank Corps School, Ahmednagar

Cheers

Maureen

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ddycher

Both

Many thanks for this. Am trying to trace which School of Musketry men from the Punjab would have attended. Any ideas ?

Regards

Dave

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ddycher

Found it.

In 1915 TF troops were allocated to the 1st regular Musketry Courses at Satara. Extra courses were laid on at Satara, Pachmarhi and Rawalpindi in January and April

Regards

Dave

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Maureene

I suspect that the courses at Changla Gali and Rawalpindi were connected, or possibly even the same location, as they are situated in the same general area. Quite possibly Changla Gail was the summer location (it was situated in the hills where it was cooler- in winter there would be snow) and Rawalpindi the winter location.

Cheers

Maureen

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ddycher

Thanks Maureen.

Had not made that connection. Will look into it further.

Regards

Dave

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ddycher

All

Spent a fascinating day plotting the training of the TF battalions after their arrival in India. Particularly wrt musketry. What got me started on this was some damning comments I read on the lack of basic musketry skills in the TF units arriving in India. This was bad enough for Aylmer the then AG to insist that all newly arrived TF men were to run through the Elementary Course in musketry irrespective of how long men had been in the TF or their previous efficiency certificates.

Any one seen similar derogatory comments on arriving TF Bn's before ?

Regards

Dave

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ddycher

Maureen

You are correct Indian Army List of 1919 confirms that Pachmarhi was the Central School and there were Branch Schools at Satara and Rawalpindi - Changla Gali.

Thanks for helping make the connection. Tidies things up a bit.

Regards

Dave

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Tejpal

Just to bump this thread....

 

As per the Indian Army List, what did (56) "musketry certificate (Indian ranks)" entail exactly? Was it a prerequisite for promotion to the officer ranks? How did this differ from (54) "passed musketry course for volunteer officers"?  Many thanks.

Screenshot_20180321-122815.jpg

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Maureene

"Volunteer Officers" were Officers of Volunteer Regiments, later called auxiliary regiments, which were part time Regiments, whose officers and soldiers were British or Anglo Indian (also called Eurasian). See the FIBIS Fibiwiki page Auxiliary Regiments

https://wiki.fibis.org/w/Auxiliary_Regiments

 

I do not know how the courses differed, but I expect there would be a difference in a course offered to a full time  Indian ranks soldier,

(a sepoy) and a part time British Officer.

 

I think the Indian other tanks who eventually became officers were regarded as elite soldiers, so perhaps they would be expected to hold a musketry certificate, but I do not know if this was a requirement.

 

Cheers

Maureen

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Tejpal

Thank you Maureene. 

Have you seen any certificate's entitled "Musketry Certificate (Indian Ranks)"?

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Maureene

Tejpal, No, I haven't.

 

Cheers

Maureen

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Tejpal

 

 

Thank you Maureene. 

 

I have been looking online but I haven't seen any either, which is a shame. 

 

I came across some files on the National Archives of India regarding musketry, dated 1897-98.

 

According to the files I found, regiments based in Punjab underwent instruction in mustketry in Changla Gali. This includes VCO's from the 23rd, 32nd and 34th Punjab (later Sikh) Pioneers. 

 

Furthermore, regiments of the former Bengal Presidency underwent instruction in mustketry in Pachmarhi.  Likewise, regiments of the former Bombay Presidency underwent instruction in mustketry in Deolali. 

 

The photos above show Capt. Christie and Capt. Gabbett, from the 32nd and 23rd Sikh Pioneers respectively, at Pachmarhi, when I would have assumed they would have been based in Changla Gali based on files I have seen. 

 

If you had any thoughts on that, I'd appreciate it very much.

 

( I wasn't sure if I was permitted to upload the aforementioned files here's). 

 

 

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Maureene

The officers in the photograph above  at Pachmarhi, were British Officers. British Officers were the senior officers in a regiment

 

I would simply take the course at Pachmarhi as a gathering of senior staff, whereas the others  in the regiment would attend courses more locally .

 

When I was working (nothing to do with the Army) senior staff frequently had different training courses in different locations to the rest of the staff.

 

Cheers

Maureen

 

 

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