Query: RAMC Doctor?

[verdun]

I am trying to find out about Charles Edward G. Bateman's military career.

I have his family details and background history from Ancestry. He was born c.1863 and was a doctor in Norfolk. Members of his family believe that he served in the Great War as a doctor, therefore presumably in the RAMC? Can his unit be confirmed from the attached photo?

Meanwhile, I can find no Medal Index Card, suggesting that he had no medal entitlement, because he did not serve overseas and, therefore, probably worked in a military hospital in the UK. Would this be a reasonable assumption? Also, the photo appears to show the rank of Captain. Is that correct and would that be an honorary rank for someone who enlisted to 'do his bit' well above the age limit?

Any ideas about this man's military story would be gratefully received. Many thanks to all/anyone who can help.

[bingoworlddk]

Hej Peter51

Found a C. E. G. Bateman in the December Army List as T/Captain, 1. Mar. 1917 (page 1710c) in the Royal Army Medical Corps.

and again in the November 1916 Army List (1710c) as T/Lieutenant, 1 Mar. 1916, R.A.M.C.

I have so far only found his 1917 entry in the London Gazette (issue 30016 page 3480)

( https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/30016/supplement/3480 )

Could this be your man?

Steen

[David_Underdown]

Officers had to actually claim their medals, so absence of a card doesn't necessarily mean there was no overseas service. Unfortunately very few service records survive for men who had temporary commissions in RAMC, so it may be difficult to determine the extent of his service.

[HarryBrook]

Gazetted temporary Lieutenant March 1 1916 (Charles Edward Gooderson Bateman)

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/29519/page/3182

Relinquished his commission and retained the rank of Captain February 28 1919

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/31313/supplement/5296

[HERITAGE PLUS]

Awarded a Belgian Order:

https://www.haileybury.com/medals/belgium.htm

Dave

[verdun]

Many thanks, Gentlemen. This is brilliant work and definitely the right man. I tried searching for an officer file on the National Archives website and drew a blank, so the London Gazette information is really helpful.

Also, I didn't realise officers had to claim their medals. The family said they 'remembered some medals' (now missing, sadly), but I had assumed these must have belonged to someone else because there was no MIC. Now, it seems likely that the medals probably were his, because the family also believed that he served at a hospital in France or Belgium.

I wonder if any other members might know more about his war service through other, related documentation? Fingers crossed and many thanks once again.

Finally, I'm assuming that the date of his commission (March 1st 1916) indicates voluntary service and that he simply responded to the need for medical personnel.

[Magnumbellum]

Bateman's service could only have been voluntary, on two grounds:

1) His gazetting of rank, 1 March 1916, was the day before conscription came into effect on 2 March 1916.

2) At all times throughout the war he was over the maximum age for conscriptiion.

It is possible that his decision to offer his services was influenced by the introduction of conscription, and the feeling that if younger men were being compelled, the least he could was to volunteer. Conscription was in the air from late 1915.

[verdun]

Yes, of course, I was forgetting his age. Born c.1863, he was over 50 when the war started. I'm guessing he was driven by that great sense of Victorian 'duty', so often nurtured at public school back then; he was educated at Haileybury.

Am now also wondering... if the medals that the family had were his, would that still allow for the absence of a Medal Index Card? I had always assumed that MICs were created to show the entitlement of medals. Indeed, as the National Archives website states: "They record the medals that men and women who served in the First World War were entitled to claim."

So, if he did serve overseas (and was therefore entltled to the BWM & VM), why would there be no Medal Index Card in this man's case?

[kenf48]

The index cards were created from the Rolls so the definitive check would be to browse the Officer Roll for the RAMC but acknowledging officers applied for their medals if there was an entitlement they usually did so.

In 1911 he was living/practising at Lyminge near Folkestone, he was still there in 1913, in 1919 he was living in Folkestone. In 1914 250,000 Belgian refugees and wounded soldiers landed in the town. It was also the main transit port and hospital centre, for troops from all Allied nations. There is an active study and campaign group (Step Short) for the town who may be able to help.

The decoration was also awarded to those who assisted in the rebuilding of occupied Belgium, which would allow him to work in the country but outside the qualification period for the campaign medals.

More questions than answers but somewhere else to look.

Ken

There's a description of the medical services in the town I this online book but I can't see his name

https://archive.org/details/folkestoneduring00carliala

[verdun]

Another piece in the puzzle and really helpful research. Many thanks Ken - and to all others who have contributed to this story so far. Much appreciated!!! Peter

[kenf48]

You're welcome.

There is an article in the Times dated October 13 1914, under the headline ' A town of refugees' it describes the work of the Folkestone Refugee Committee which was comprised of mainly French or Flemish speakers. It goes on, "A doctor who has been helping them describes what he has had to do as some of the most pathetic work he's ever known. Some of the children have been so long without food they cannot take it when offered to them until they have received medical attention."

Unfortunately the doctor is not named (that would be too much to hope for!) but at least it shows doctors were involved in attempting to alleviate the suffering of the Belgians and avert a 'humanitarian crisis'.

I've also had a look at the BNA and whilst there are articles detailing Belgian awards presented by the Belgian Vice -Consul who was based in the town in the Folkestone Hythe etc Herald he remains elusive. I'm having to husband my few remaining credits.

At the risk of stating the obvious as he's wearing Captain's rank that dates the photo, do you have the original? Often there's information as to the studio on the back or in the margins may not tell us much more but more tiny pieces!

Ken

[verdun]

Another interesting snippet! Many thanks again. Sadly, I don't have the original picture, just a p/copy that I scanned. It is, nevertheless, a marvellous image of a very distinguished looking gentleman; one that seems to capture the essence of the Victorian and Edwardian establishment.