Andy Wade Posted 11 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 11 May , 2015 Yes, it is made of wood (possibly Austrian Oak?). I took some more pictures yesterday in better weather. Here's the front view: ...and here's the rear face: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard_Lewis Posted 11 May , 2015 Share Posted 11 May , 2015 Excellent work! Bernard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkshire Dragoon Posted 11 May , 2015 Share Posted 11 May , 2015 Well done Sir ... So good to see a piece of Yorkshire heritage saved. And well done to the person who saved the memorial in the first place. Tim B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
985acoy Posted 11 May , 2015 Share Posted 11 May , 2015 Well done andy. good to see people still care,nice one mate 985 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Thompson Posted 11 May , 2015 Share Posted 11 May , 2015 Well done Andy, just like me a couple of months ago saving Batley WMC Roll of Honour and is now in storage at my house until the local parish church gets permission to re mount in there. Cheers Roger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Wade Posted 11 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 11 May , 2015 Nice one Roger! We're on our third 'rediscovered' memorial in two years, they're popping up all over the place! Not that I'm complaining of course... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkshire Dragoon Posted 16 May , 2015 Share Posted 16 May , 2015 Roger ... Any idea what happened to the Carlinghow Working Mens Club Roll of Honour, both of my great uncles are mentioned on it. John Arthur Bickerdike Oliver Kemp Cheers Tim B Well done Andy, just like me a couple of months ago saving Batley WMC Roll of Honour and is now in storage at my house until the local parish church gets permission to re mount in there. Cheers Roger. Roger ... Any idea what happened to the Carlinghow Working Mens Club Roll of Honour, both of my great uncles are mentioned on it. John Arthur Bickerdike Oliver Kemp Cheers Tim B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falloden Posted 16 May , 2015 Share Posted 16 May , 2015 With all the publicity commemorating the Great War at the moment how could anyone regard such a memorial as rubbish ? Congratulations on the rescue Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Thompson Posted 16 May , 2015 Share Posted 16 May , 2015 Hello Tim B, I have posted a PM for you. Cheers Roger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianw Posted 16 May , 2015 Share Posted 16 May , 2015 Great news. As noted, how duing the centenary could such a thing be put out for the bins? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Wade Posted 16 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 16 May , 2015 Update:I have managed to rule out one of the houses that are up for sale, the one we thought it was, is still in the frame and it's likely that it was a rented property. The owner of the ruled out property rang me after I contacted the estate agents and he stated that it definitely didn't come from his property as it had been vacant since October last year and completely empty as he'd had it redecorated to get it ready for sale. I appears that when the last tenants left the other house, someone acting on behalf of the landlord paid a couple of lads to get all the remaining furniture and everything else outside ready for collection and that's what they did, then whoever collected all the furniture (possibly a second hand furniture dealer) didn't have a use for the memorial so they left it. Apparently it had been standing outside for at least a week and it's possible the landlord didn't even know it was in the house. Hopefully we will find out more next week. I've also had a response from the local museum. They don't meet to discuss new admissions until August so I'm expected to hold on to it until then! They can't accept it at the moment anyway as I don't have proof that I own it, so I don't have a legal right to gift it to them in the first place. This is extremely frustrating although I can see their point. They don't want someone coming along later and causing a big fuss demanding it be handed back to them. This is why we need to find out who left it there and which house it came from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianw Posted 16 May , 2015 Share Posted 16 May , 2015 They don't make protecting our national heritage easy do they!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loader Posted 16 May , 2015 Share Posted 16 May , 2015 I'd have thought that if something is set at the curb as rubbish to be picked up & disposed of then the owner would've given up all rights of ownership. I'm no lawyer but law enforcement officials are able to look through trash bins set out with no warrant to do so based on this concept,you toss it out it's no longer yours. Maybe UK law is different. But if finding former occupants of the house is needed to move the memorial to a proper place then good luck. Maybe the utility firms have a name for billing such as gas, electric or phone co. Or water co.. Must be a way to find them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Wade Posted 16 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 16 May , 2015 Well, the story is going in the newspaper next week so I think that would count as a public declaration that we have it. We're not trying to steal anything and I really do think it was abandoned. The estate agents have been very helpful so I expect we'll be able to talk to the owner of the house we think it came from. All we need is for him to say he doesn't want it, and perhaps sign it over to us if he's prepared to do that. The museum asked if it might have been put out and was awaiting collection by someone who owned it. I thought that was a pretty strange question to be honest, considering that a neighbour had already told me it had been outside for about a week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Thompson Posted 17 May , 2015 Share Posted 17 May , 2015 Hi there loader, here in the UK there is something called theft by finding, I'm no legal expert so I do not fully understand it or its implications, things get very complicated in the UK. Cheers Roger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilH Posted 17 May , 2015 Share Posted 17 May , 2015 Hand it in to he police as found property. If it's not claimed within a certain time it becomes yours... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Feledziak Posted 17 May , 2015 Share Posted 17 May , 2015 The definition of Theft can be found in the Theft Act of 1968. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1968/60 very boring to read but in essence it provides a definition of "Theft" and paragraphs about what actions are considered in relation to each feature of the definition. One of the main terms in the definition is Dishonesty. Clearly reasonable steps have been made to trace any person with a claim to ownership. there is absolutely no element of dishonesty in this case and therefore any form of prosecution would fail. The likelihood that the "owner" could be found in one of the houses also creates an issue as to where that person acquired any right of ownership as it was originally intended for display in the Temple Street Chapel and all of those individuals likely to have had any form of "Ownership" would be long gone. Indeed a wise move would be to hand it into the Police - which is also included in the reasonable steps section - assuming :- 1. You could find a Police Station 2. It was open to the public. 3. They would be interested. But as it stands all reasonable steps have been taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Thompson Posted 17 May , 2015 Share Posted 17 May , 2015 Having read the thread I agree that Andy you are doing all in your power to find any owner of it. Just a thought for you, the local archives might have the old and last minute book and somewhere in there might be a clue for you, if there isn't one locally enquire at WYJS. Cheers Roger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ralphjd Posted 17 May , 2015 Share Posted 17 May , 2015 Well found Andy. Good luck with it. Ralph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Wade Posted 17 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 17 May , 2015 Cheers everyone, I'll speak to Gina Birdsall at Keighley library as she will know if there are any minutes available. I'll also check with the WYAS catalogue to see if there's anything in there, which would probably be held at Keighley library anyway.Ooh, look what I found:Temple Street Chapel - Leaders minutes books and this too: Temple Street Methodist Church - Leases I think we have taken some good steps but I will report the finding to the Police now, so that they can decide what to do about it. It's not for me to make that sort of decision. Thanks for all the helpful comments and suggestions everyone. What I do find strange is that when the Temple Street Chapel closed in 1974 their congregation and services mostly transferred to St Andrews which is the Anglican Parish Church. It has been known as the 'Shared Church' ever since. This church has some war memorials belonging to other Anglican churches on display, so why wasn't this one accorded the same respect? There's enough room on the walls.The plot thickens... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Wade Posted 17 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 17 May , 2015 Right, I just got off the phone to West Yorkshire Police. It's all reported and I have a reference number: 13150196121. He said that unless someone comes forward who can prove its theirs, it should revert to my ownership in 28 days from this report. Assuming I can get that in writing from them, it would mean that if nothing else happens and we can't find out who left it by the wheelie bins, I will legally be able to donate it to Keighley's Cliffe Castle Museum. At least I'm not going to get accused of 'stealing by finding' because it's all above board now. Thanks very much to those who suggested this course of action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Feledziak Posted 17 May , 2015 Share Posted 17 May , 2015 Good Work Andy. Here is a link to pictures of the windows to which your Memorial refers. http://www.keighleysharedchurch.org.uk/morris.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Wade Posted 17 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 17 May , 2015 Cheers Martin. Note the wording at the bottom of the windows, which is very similar to what's written on the war memorial board. I've just completed research on Private James Mitchell Bancroft who is named on the memorial. There's a newspaper cutting from the 12th May 1917 edition of the Keighley News which says:"Private Bancroft was formerly closely identified with the Temple Street Wesleyan Sunday School, as a teacher and secretary of the junior department." So that's two men definitely connected with the church and this war memorial, the evidence is pretty conclusive now that I've found the right memorial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Wade Posted 17 May , 2015 Author Share Posted 17 May , 2015 Here's Private Arthur Hastings: Here's Private James Mitchell Bancroft: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Feledziak Posted 17 May , 2015 Share Posted 17 May , 2015 I was rather hoping that someone would have a look at the backgrounds of those named. So nice to see Arthur and James. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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