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trajan

P 1903 bayonets

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trajan

A very nice piece you have there!

 

Blade markings =  'government issue' broad arrow over EFD mark for (made by) Royal Armouries, Enfield, over the 'X' bend test mark

(crown) 34 over E = Inspector's mark; (crown) ER = Edwardius Rex - King Edward VII

1903 = Pattern number - beneath that the month and year mark of production

Top edge near bayonet lug: (crown) over 83 = Inspector's mark

Wood grips: HY 150 (or) 160 = is probably a unit mark but I am not certain which one (yet!)

Pommel: 5 RF 425 = originally issued to 5th Royal Fusiliers, bayonet 425, markings then struck out when passed to another unit

Pommel end: EFD = indicates blade from a Pattern 1888 bayonet, recycled at Enfield to become the blade for a Pattern 1903

Scabbard top edge: 18 = number of bayonet the scabbard belonged to

 

Frog: = can't help there as I don't know much about frogs, but looks at first sight to be Australian. The maker's mark seems to me to end ISIS... Duh, 1916...:doh:

 

Trajan

Edited by trajan
spelling, plus later correction end final sentence

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trajan
8 hours ago, MKC said:

 

W?? & Co Ltd 1916 (last figure obscured)

 

1903s Bayonet7.jpg

 

How about "W.BRUCE .LTD. 1916" - the maker and date. Australia?

 

"6 F.C.E." 6th (Australian) Field Company Engineers", e.g. - https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/C1378458

 

Trajan

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trajan
8 hours ago, MKC said:

... Wood grips: HY 150 (or) 160

 

 

 

1903s Bayonet2.jpg

 

 

IF there was an 'M' at the end, then Hymers College OTC... 

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Dave66

frog looks like P14, and manufacturer looks like W.B.& Co Ltd....can't find any reference to that I'm afraid.

Could the markings on the grips indicate a Yeomanry unit?

 

Dave.

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shippingsteel
53 minutes ago, Dave66 said:

frog looks like P14, and manufacturer looks like W.B.& Co Ltd....

 

I agree, the Patt.14 frog is marked W.B. & Co. LTD. 1916 who were makers of various leather articles during the war.

Here is a clearer view of the marking on another Patt.14 frog. As you can see it is in the exact same form and typeset.

 

Untitled.jpg.11f8d13c424c789fc2e34a9c4c6f91e6.jpg

Edited by shippingsteel

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trajan
1 hour ago, Dave66 said:

frog looks like P14, and manufacturer looks like W.B.& Co Ltd....can't find any reference to that I'm afraid.

Could the markings on the grips indicate a Yeomanry unit?

 

Good-oh on that W.B.& Co.Ltd Dave - and ta very much to SS for his "cobberorish" (:thumbsup:) corroboration and showing an example.

 

I remain happy with my interpretation of the "6.F.C.E." mark, unless there are any other contenders! At the very least it fits the Australian origin of this frog.

 

I did wonder about 'Yeomanry', but couldn't find a suitable candidate for the 'H'... The county, etc., abbreviations are - in my limited experience - always at least two letters and sometimes three. 

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Dave66
13 minutes ago, trajan said:

 

Good-oh on that W.B.& Co.Ltd Dave - and ta very much to SS for his "cobberorish" (:thumbsup:) corroboration and showing an example.

 

I remain happy with my interpretation of the "6.F.C.E." mark, unless there are any other contenders! At the very least it fits the Australian origin of this frog.

 

I did wonder about 'Yeomanry', but couldn't find a suitable candidate for the 'H'... The county, etc., abbreviations are - in my limited experience - always at least two letters and sometimes three. 

The HY is an odd one, and can't think of anything else for the 6 F.C.E, certainly fits well. Just goes to show how well traveled these old things can be.

 

Dave.

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trajan
On 10/10/2018 at 23:58, shippingsteel said:

... Again that BAH 'unit marking' which seems very common. There are at least 4 of us on GWF that have pieces from this very same 'cache'.!

 

Being one of those four, I guess no advances on what BAH means?

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trajan
On 09/10/2018 at 12:20, shippingsteel said:

Sounds like this scabbard is the P1903, Naval, Mark II which was introduced 11th March 1904. (LoC 12185)

This scabbard has the 4 rivets securing the seam, and should also have another 2 rivets forming the belt loop.

 

I thought I'd elucidate SS's excellent description somewhat by posting this from LOC 12185, as reproduced in Mike Roses' excellent book on the P.1888 and P.1903.

naval.jpg

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MKC

Gents,

 

I replied earlier this morning, but it seems to have been lost in the ether. 

 

All, thank you for sharing your knowledge. It appears to be a bayonet with a most interesting history: 1888, reworked to 1903, British Army issue, then issued to an AIF artillery driver with a later 1916 manufactured frog which had been previously issued to an Aust engineer unit. If only it could tell its tale! I wonder where Harold came to be issued with it - possibly a replacement issued in the UK or France? 

 

Again, thank you.

 

Mike

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