POW where was this camp please?

[missmuffit]

Having found info regarding a relative serving in WW1 JAMES FERGUSON Yorkshire reg, I cannot dechipher the place of death, original document has it written as Frederick Carp dysert.

Tried googling that but no luck anyone know what the camp was please?

I cannot upload the file as it is too big.

[johnboy]

Can you give the links to the docs?

[HERITAGE PLUS]

What was your man's Service Number?

Dave

[seaforths]

Difficult without seeing it. A complete guess Friedrichsfeld Camp. Dysentery.

Can you just crop to the words you want to have deciphered? or post the image via photobucket?

[asanewt]

Document from OP. Not the clearest so we may try to do better. Thanks for looking.

[asanewt]

Document from OP

Not the clearest. We may try to do better. Thanks for looking.

[seaforths]

I thought that the document being referred to was from the ICRC records but this doesn't look like one of theirs. I would suggest you check him out with the ICRC here: http://grandeguerre.icrc.org

Looking at your extract, yes, it is very poor. I still stand by my complete guess in post 4.

[Glen]

ICRC documents do not give any further details unfortunately

http://icrc1418images.blob.core.windows.net/small-resolution/C/G1/E/15/01/C_G1_E_15_01_0030/C_G1_E_15_01_0030_0178_0.JPG

The document in post 6 is the register of Soldiers Effects

Zooming in it is definitely Friedrichsfeld Camp. Dysentery.

However, looking at the CWGC concentration record the remains appear to have been recovered from the battlefield (Identified by paybook) so I can't see him being taken a POW and moved to Friedrichfeld.

[missmuffit]

It was from a new record collection Ancestry have UK Army register of Soldiers Effects

[seaforths]

Thanks for the information on the record. I should have realised. I've only recently started poking about in those.

I'm sorry but his date of death and location of burial indicates he was possibly one of many registered with a POW camp in Germany, who were kept behind the lines working at the front until they died of illness resulting from the combination of exhaustion and starvation. They managed to get a good number of them back that were able to move, abandoned by their German guards and got them back into UK hospitals. Unfortunately, many were just too weak to reach the British and to survive their ordeal. Some of them died shortly after arriving in UK.

Not all of these were liberated immediately after the armistice and it took some men a good few days to reach the British after being abandoned by the Germans. It also took the British some time to locate the men that were incapacitated. A check of the War Diaries to find where he was in action against his location of death will provide some clues as to his movements. That he has Friedrichsfeld Camp is an indication he was taken alive. Also pertinent is that Friedrichsfeld was one of the camps used to 'hide' such prisoners (along with Stendal, Parchim, Limburg which are others that have surfaced).

The concentration sheet for his grave has a map reference which is too poor for me to read properly looks like: 62C. K.16 (can't read the rest).

Another enquiry that could be made, would be against the British Red Cross Enquiry Lists. Find out who else was also listed missing and check their names and whereabouts with ICRC. Also, against the CWGC concentration sheet, check out the names of those other men against ICRC. Still plenty of scope to follow up on him.

[Glen]

I have since looked at the Grave registration report and this has an amended date. The concentration report shows 22.3.18 but this is crossed out on the GRR and altered to 19.11.18.

I tend to agree with "Seaforths" that he would have been reported missing on 22/23.2.18 (The 1/4th East Yorkshire's were over-run in the trenches that night) and kept locally working at the front.

[seaforths]

That there is a such discrepancy over his date of death on CWGC and on the Effects records is very bizarre. As I understand it, the location was back in Allied hands September 1918. Using one of the other men, I was able to get a clearer map reference to follow up. The burials on James concentration sheet do not seem to fall into the categories of those that CWGC mentions as being concentrated into the cemetery.

I would be inclined to email CWGC and make enquiries with them. The reference beside the change of his date of death must relate to another file that while not digitised, might still exist in their un-digitised archives. The map ref for the original graves is in an isolated area slightly north west of Bernes and directly west of Montigny.

[missmuffit]

seaforth thanks

This man was my G Uncle and it is sad reading, the family bible had the scroll (that was sent to all relatives who lost loved ones) in it and James was recorded by his family as "Killed in Action" never any mention of POW.

I will do as you suggest send email to CWGC.

Tried all ways to send a better image but always gettin "file to big" I think you have all answered the question though as to the translation.

Thanks again to all who helped.