JWK Posted 13 January , 2019 Share Posted 13 January , 2019 "Blinde sluiting" or "Verdekte sluiting" in Dutch! Re the cockarde on the right: maybe this will determine whether Saxon or Bavarian? And what's that guy in the white doing? Any significance? Because his cap is sloping to his left, while all the other caps (well, most of them) are sloping to the wearer's right? Or is that just personal preference, and there are no rules? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 13 January , 2019 Share Posted 13 January , 2019 (edited) Hi JWK, I think he´s just being stylish. The white buttoned up shirt doesn´t look familiar. It is probably of civilian origin. The closest in military clothing would be a white Drillich (working clothes), but they looked a bit different. See attached example of two guys from the freiwillige Kriegskrankenpflege in the background. Note the "Verdekte sluiting" ;-) with the other guys. Similiar outfits for infantry and the other branches. There were also those with double button rows, but these were for Eisenbahn and Pioniere, if I remember correctly. Kokarde is hard to tell Bavarian or Saxon. GreyC Edited 13 January , 2019 by GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWK Posted 14 January , 2019 Share Posted 14 January , 2019 That white shirt sure looks like a polo-shirt! The Dutch version of Wikipedia tells us it was designed by René Lacoste in the 20's (The Lacoste of the polo's), whereas the British version leaves us completely in the dark..... Nevertheless, in the history of clothing, surely an interesting picture! How did a German PoW (in post 1915) get hold of an item of clothing associated with Polo and British upper-classes? We can be quite certain the almost-rubbed out guy on the left is the one who this photo belonged to (or at least to his family), but what about the guy in the backrow, with the white collar? And "P.G." painted on your uniform: was that as per usual? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 14 January , 2019 Share Posted 14 January , 2019 Well, to my knowledge, the POWs or PGs were allowed to buy things in modest quantities, maybe he bought the shirt or traded it in. He was also allowed to receive parcles from home. PG on the clothing was pretty common. Unfortunately I have no example digitized. Maybe the soldier with scarf had tonsilitis or just an ichy throat and wanted to keep it warm? Best, GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWK Posted 15 January , 2019 Share Posted 15 January , 2019 On 13/01/2019 at 22:30, GreyC said: Hi JWK, it´s called "verdeckte Knopfleiste" in German ;-) 1915. Ah, got a photo here from 1914 in the "lust. St. nr 3" ("Lustige Stube"? Happy times in billets nr 3?) showing 7 "Verdeckte Knopfleiste"! Must be said though that the card was sent in March 1915 to "my dear friend", but maybe the writer was just using up cards he already had? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWK Posted 15 January , 2019 Share Posted 15 January , 2019 (edited) A gaggle of "Kronesöhnen" (5. Westfälisches Infanterie-Regiment nr. 53 , probably from 1. Ersatz-Bataillon -as message on card is dated "Köln-Kalk 16.6.18"- ) showing off their "verdeckte Knopfleiste", bar one who missed the memo. And "Kronesöhnen" loses a lót (if not all!) in translation I'm afraid: "Crown-sons" or "Sons of the crown" (Named after their shoulder title: a single crown) doesn't quite have the same bite as the original has.. Sometimes regimental nicknames are best left untranslated...... I lóve the sort of resigned look on the NCO's (thanks GreyC!) faces, a bit like "How the heck did we end up hearding thís flock of goats? " Edited 15 January , 2019 by JWK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 16 January , 2019 Share Posted 16 January , 2019 IR 369 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 16 January , 2019 Share Posted 16 January , 2019 (edited) 15 hours ago, JWK said: Ah, got a photo here from 1914 in the "lust. St. nr 3" ("Lustige Stube"? Happy times in billets nr 3?) showing 7 "Verdeckte Knopfleiste"! Hi JWK and all! Sorry, I should have been more precise! I was referring to the introduction of the Feldbluse M1915 which was meant to replace the feldgrauen Waffenrock M1907/10. I did not mention the Mannschafts-Litewka which was (as a type) in use as early as 1884 and which underwent changes e.g. in 1893 and 1903. They in turn were meant to be replaced by the Felduniform (M1907/10). After 1909 they were only idealy used for Landwehr and Landturm troops mobilized in 1914. Later only used for immobile units of said troops. However these Litewkas only vanished from the scene at the last stages of the war, when all supplies were used up. As far as I can make out the guys on your 1914 photo wear the Litewka Typ M1903, the soldier with beerglass sitting front row to the right Litewka M1900. The difference between Bluse M1915 and Mannschafts-Litewka M1903 is the way the pockets were placed. The M 1915 had their flaps in an angel, the Litewka M1903 had horizontal pockets. Apologies, should have been more detailed in the first place. What is interesting on your photo with the Kronen-guys is, that they wear the Bluse M1915, but one of the soldiers crossing sidearms has a "vorgestossene" (piped) Schulterklappe, his comrade not. This is probably due to the practice, that some soldiers to Schulterklappen from the "vereinfachter Feldrock M1915" which did not have pipings and stiched it on the blouse M1915 which had (or were supposed to have) piped Schulterklappen. GreyC Edited 16 January , 2019 by GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prussian Posted 16 January , 2019 Share Posted 16 January , 2019 17 hours ago, JWK said: Ah, got a photo here from 1914 in the "lust. St. nr 3" ("Lustige Stube"? Happy times in billets nr 3?) showing 7 "Verdeckte Knopfleiste"! Must be said though that the card was sent in March 1915 to "my dear friend", but maybe the writer was just using up cards he already had? Hello! All of them wear a Litewka. The Bluse 15 was introduced in september/october 1915 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 16 January , 2019 Share Posted 16 January , 2019 Rekrutendepot 30 I.D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 16 January , 2019 Share Posted 16 January , 2019 German ground personnel Flieger Abteilung Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 16 January , 2019 Share Posted 16 January , 2019 17 minutes ago, Cnock said: German ground personnel Flieger Abteilung All with Kar.98 as per regulations - and an interesting mix of long and short litzen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jools mckenna Posted 17 January , 2019 Share Posted 17 January , 2019 (edited) German Wounded from 1914. Edited 17 January , 2019 by Jools mckenna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 17 January , 2019 Share Posted 17 January , 2019 (edited) Hi Jools, nice one. On the front two German soldiers in Litewka M1900 and ammo pouches of 1888, therefore probably Landsturm. The guy seated is an NCO. Back side w interesting text. The place is the "Baugewerkeschule in Erfurt", now used as reserve hospital. Baugewerkeschulen were institutions of higher learning below the level of universities in which future architects and building engineers were trained from the mid 19c. The other males are Bavrian wounded soldiers. The two in the litewka stand guard, as there are also wounded French soldiers being treated at that hospital (not on pic). GreyC Edited 17 January , 2019 by GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 17 January , 2019 Share Posted 17 January , 2019 Bavarian Landwehr Infantry Reg. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jools mckenna Posted 17 January , 2019 Share Posted 17 January , 2019 17 minutes ago, GreyC said: Hi Jools, nice one. On the front two German soldiers in Litewka M1900 and ammo pouches of 1888, therefore probably Landsturm. The guy seated is an NCO. Back side w interesting text. The place is the "Baugewerkeschule in Erfurt", now used as reserve hospital. Baugewerkeschulen were institutions of higher learning below the level of universities in which future architects and building engineers were trained from the mid 19c. The other males are Bavrian wounded soldiers. The two in the litewka stand guard, as there are also wounded French soldiers being treated at that hospital (not on pic). GreyC what does the card say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyC Posted 17 January , 2019 Share Posted 17 January , 2019 I told you in the above post (?) where I gave you the info in a nutshell +explanation of what Baugewerkeschule means, as I thought you might not be familiar with the German term. GreyC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jools mckenna Posted 17 January , 2019 Share Posted 17 January , 2019 Sorry, I thought you meant the message on the back. I understand the Baugewerkeschule bit, thanks it was very informational. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jools mckenna Posted 18 January , 2019 Share Posted 18 January , 2019 (edited) A bunch of German officers in 1918, with at least 2 artillery officers amongst them. Edited 18 January , 2019 by Jools mckenna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie2 Posted 18 January , 2019 Share Posted 18 January , 2019 The gentlemen of Etappenkommandantur 115, a pity it has been stuck down somewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jools mckenna Posted 18 January , 2019 Share Posted 18 January , 2019 2 minutes ago, charlie2 said: The gentlemen of Etappenkommandantur 115, a pity it has been stuck down somewhere. What did these guys do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 18 January , 2019 Share Posted 18 January , 2019 4 minutes ago, Jools mckenna said: What did these guys do? Well in the Vietnam era they were normally referred to as REMF! I.e., as I understand it, generalised but important logistical work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Filsell Posted 18 January , 2019 Share Posted 18 January , 2019 Often Ignored - but without the REPF's there's nothing for those at the sharp end, a fact too often ignored. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimberley John Lindsay Posted 18 January , 2019 Share Posted 18 January , 2019 Dear David, Quite. No Labour. No Battle. Kindest regards, Kim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 19 January , 2019 Share Posted 19 January , 2019 Oh, don't get me wrong chaps! As I stated, the Etappe were responsible for 'generalised but important logistical support'! And one of my mates is a retired Log.Corp.Colonel who saw active service in Iraq, so the US term would certainly not apply to him! And I am or course full of admiration for 'my' lads in Kodeis B and their predecessors in FeBA 24 for the work they did in the Vosges! As for the Etappe in WW1, they basically ran everything in the occupied areas but also such things as recruitment centres, etc., so a vital part of the machinery - Cron devotes almost a third of his book to Etappe-related activities and units.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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