3756 & 266166 Ernest William Cope, 3/7th & 1/7 Btn, Sherwood F

[johnboy]

WW1 tunics had 'open' buttons, not concealed ones as it seems in the picture. If the numbers on the reverse are a service number then 7 digits would indicate after 1920/1921.

[LCpl Lee Cope]

Hello folks,

I've visited Swadlincote Library again and just discovered that the Sergeant Major Ernest Cope in post #36 is in fact 5453 Sergeant Major Ernest Charles Cope.

This Ernest Cope was born in Derby a few years earlier than my Ernest William Cope and his surviving service record's state quite clearly that he was at the Church Gresley drill hall.

So after much searching this clears up the blank spaces on the Church Gresley Ernest Cope in post #36.

I'm going to have another look online as I was told last night by a friend that the Newspaper article reference the photo of my Ernest Cope in post #26 was printed in the Nottingham Guardian Newspaper.

Well at-least this new find has eliminated another one of the Ernest Cope's from my list.

[LCpl Lee Cope]

I came across a very useful book in the Swadlincote library the other day, and it's possibly assisted me in finding out more about the 1/7th + 3/7th & Ernest Cope in Harpenden.

It's written by the Officer's of the Battalion's.

[LCpl Lee Cope]

(17/11/15 - This Ernest Cope has been proven to be 5453 Ernest Charles Cope.)

Hello folks,

I've pretty much read through the 46th Division, 1/7th Nott's & Derbyshire Regimental "Robin Hoods" war diary (kept on Ancestry.co.uk)

I did find the 5453 Ernest Cope who was awarded the Military Cross & a new 2814 Char S Cope who returned home on a commission; later to become a 2nd lieutenant.

Quite frustrating that I cannot find the moment Ernest was promoted to Sgt.... And I cannot find a 3/7th war diary.

[LCpl Lee Cope]

So far from what I have learned 3756 & 266166 Sgt Ernest William Cope was injured by machine gun fire whilst climbing a parapet at Gommecourt 01 July 1916.

I've found a photo online of the 1/7th, D Company (5th wave - carrying & digging party) and I was wondering if anyone knew when & where the photo was taken.

Any assistance would be very much appreciated.

Regards,

Lee Cope.

[LCpl Lee Cope]

(17/11/15 - This Cope has been proven to be Charles Cope.)

Likewise, I'm trying to locate the details of the Cope who was awarded the Military Medal for galantry at Gommecourt 01 July 1916.... The same time Ernest William Cope was wounded.

[kenf48]

Probably (?)

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/29719/supplement/8360

Ken

[LCpl Lee Cope]

Many thanks, then this would be 2814 Charles S Cope who returned home on a commission; later to become a 2nd lieutenant.

Not my Ernest, but good to know it's another Cope find ticked off.

[clk]

Hi,

Hello folks,

I've pretty much read through the 46th Division, 1/7th Nott's & Derbyshire Regimental "Robin Hoods" war diary (kept on Ancestry.co.uk)

I did find the 5453 Ernest Cope who was awarded the Military Cross & a new 2814 C S Cope who returned home on a commission; later to become a 2nd lieutenant.

Quite frustrating that I cannot find the moment Ernest was promoted to Sgt.... And I cannot find a 3/7th war diary.

Re Ernest Cope MC

His MC was gazetted as a (Kings birthday) honours award with no specific citation. He seems to have been born on 21st May 1873 in Ripley, Burton on Trent, and taken unwounded as a PoW on the first day of the 1918 German Spring offensive at Noreuil (same date/place as my great uncle, an RE man) with 2/5 Bn SF.

You won't find a diary for the 3/7 Bn - they never served abroad/in an active theatre.

Regards

Chris

[LCpl Lee Cope]

Many thanks folks!

All your help is very much appreciated!

Helping research all these Cope's has helped confirm the activity of my 3756 & 266166 Sgt Ernest William Cope.

Now I'm going to attempt to get my hands on as many photo's from Gommecourt 01 July 1916 as I can.

Any images from medical aid stations on that day could be helpful, and suggestions on where such things could be found would be appreciated.

The first image I found was the Notts & Derby D Coy on post #41.

Regards,

Lee.

[LCpl Lee Cope]

Here is an interesting twist.

With the release of the 1939 Register I now know with 100% certainty that Ernest William Cope went back to the colliery after the War as a Hewer, but was registered as "Incapacitated."

A very interesting find that falls in line with the injuries sustained by MGF to his side and Left knee at Gommecourt 01 July 1916.

[LCpl Lee Cope]

As the following link illustrates, after the 01st July 1916 there were many men in need of medical attention and those treated had their details recorded.

http://www.gommecourt.co.uk/aftermath.htm

Does anyone know where these vital medical records for the RAMC would be archived?

http://www.gommecourt.co.uk/men.htm

2/1st London Field Ambulance ( Lt Col C S Brebner DSO)

2/2nd London Field Ambulance ( Lt Col E C Montgomery-Smith CMG, DSO)

2/3rd London Field Ambulance ( Maj A W French)

[LCpl Lee Cope]

As Ernest was incapacitated after the war but was still in employment in the colliery, would he have been entitled to any sort of disability pension?

If so, then where would further records of payments to him after the war be held?

Would it be The National Archives again?

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/help-with-your-research/research-guides/disability-dependents-pensions-first-world-war/

[NiftyQH]

I'm pretty sure you will know this already but the 7th Batt were on duty at Sanctuary Wood in Summer of 1915... if thats any help for your timeline?

[LCpl Lee Cope]

Hello, I hope that everybody is safe and well.

I'm wondering if anybody has an active Ancestry account and could find any information upon the following Ernest William Cope files.

I'm curious as to whether any of them were involved with the 1/5th Nott's & Derbyshire Regiment or originated from either Burton Upon Trent, Staffordshire, Castle Gresley, South Derbyshire or Warton, Warwickshire.  

Any assistance in this matter would be very much appreciated.

Regards, Lee. 

 

 

[LCpl Lee Cope]

Hello, Could anybody shed some light upon the following soldier with these details.

Any information or documents would be very much appreciated in ruling this soldier out. 

 

 Ernest William Cope.

 44 Stanley Street, Derby.

 36357: Nott's and Derby.

 17328: Leicestershire Regiment.

 5804: Royal Scot's. 

 

[charlie962]

7 hours ago, LCpl Lee Cope said:

17328: Leicestershire Regiment.

Discharge papers survive for this bit of brief service. Here's an extract from FindmyPast. No doubt Ancestry have the same. 

A 26 year old dyer with no previous military service.

Edited 26 December , 2022 by charlie962

[charlie962]

7 hours ago, LCpl Lee Cope said:

17328: Leicestershire Regiment.

 5804: Royal Scot's. 

Ditto for this brief period. Findmypast again.

Actually a Derby Scheme man, volunteering 11/12/15 but trfd to Reserve same day and mobilised Feb 1916. 

Epilepsy seems to have been his problem.

Edited 26 December , 2022 by charlie962

[LCpl Lee Cope]

Hello, please would it be possible to gain some insight into what all the numbers and letters mean on my great grandfathers card. 

266166 & 3756 Ernest William Cope, Notts and Derby Reg.

I assume that the dates and regimental numbers are quite obvious. However, theres a lot of regimental coding on here that I don't understand. 

[charlie962]

Pension office coding, @Matlock1418 likes this sort of thing 😁

[Matlock1418]

15 hours ago, charlie962 said:

Pension office coding, @Matlock1418 likes this sort of thing 😁

(Sgt) Ernest COPE, 266166, N&D

Thank Charlie, I appreciate/am flattered by the mention - possibly questionable, but I am really a first year apprentice, certainly when it comes to some of the codes & references, compared to the master, Craig @ss002d6252 [who I am pleased to note is now back online after recently being hobbled by work, real life and stuff like that] I hope he will please give you/us the masterclass - I will undoubtedly learn something too.

That said think I do spot an early Chelsea Hospital reference of 63286/H and a later MoP ref of 7/MC/3692 [the latter interprets as Region 7 / Military disability claim by surname starting C / Case number 3692 - region 7 being East Midlands]

Now further putting my potentially basic interpretation on the line the award of 16/3 pw from 20.7.17 to 22.1.18 - I think represent 50% disability for a Pension Class III NCO [typically a Sgt].

= As for the rest I really do hope Craig can do the honours for the other codes on these PIC, please. [place for fingers-crossed emoji - but I don't have one]

Meantime Craig has put a lot on the WFA website https://www.westernfrontassociation.com/pension-records so wider browsing is available to all.

M

ADDIT. There is also a pension ledger page(s) for this man, notes starting 11.9.20, which records he was a Sgt [phew!], born 1894, was single, lived at 6 Pemberton St., Nottingham and claimed for GSW Knee (Ankylosis) and Fractured Patella - Attrrib. The reverse shows at that time his disability was judged to be 30% and he was receiving 14/- pw from the 1919 RW and that this rate, from 29/11/22, became a permanent award

Edited 30 October , 2023 by Matlock1418
addit

[ss002d6252]

5 hours ago, Matlock1418 said:

 

That said think I do spot an early Chelsea Hospital reference of 63286/H and a later MoP ref of 7/MC/3692 [the latter interprets as Region 7 / Military disability claim by surname starting C / Case number 3692 - region 7 being East Midlands]

22 hours ago, LCpl Lee Cope said:

I assume that the dates and regimental numbers are quite obvious. However, theres a lot of regimental coding on here that I don't understand. 

From my spreadsheet, the Chelsea 63286/H reference is from around June/July 1917. This ties in nicely with the 11 July 1917 admission date to Pension.

The SCJ2679 code is for the Pension Issue Office - claim 2679 of the Notts & Derby.

D400 is Form D400, which is an army discharge document.

Craig

[Matlock1418]

6 minutes ago, ss002d6252 said:

From my spreadsheet, the Chelsea 63286/H reference is from around June/July 1917. This ties in nicely with the 11 July 1917 admission date to Pension.

The SCJ2679 code is for the Pension Issue Office - claim 2679 of the Notts & Derby.

D400 is Form D400, which is an army discharge document.

Thanks Craig. Welcome back. 

M

[charlie962]

51 minutes ago, Matlock1418 said:

Thanks Craig. Welcome back. 

M

How could I have missed Craig off the link? Running shoes on, I hope.

[LCpl Lee Cope]

1 hour ago, ss002d6252 said:

From my spreadsheet, the Chelsea 63286/H reference is from around June/July 1917. This ties in nicely with the 11 July 1917 admission date to Pension.

The SCJ2679 code is for the Pension Issue Office - claim 2679 of the Notts & Derby.

D400 is Form D400, which is an army discharge document.

Craig

Thank you very much for your assistance. 

6 hours ago, Matlock1418 said:

(Sgt) Ernest COPE, 266166, N&D

Thank Charlie, I appreciate/am flattered by the mention - possibly questionable, but I am really a first year apprentice, certainly when it comes to some of the codes & references, compared to the master, Craig @ss002d6252 [who I am pleased to note is now back online after recently being hobbled by work, real life and stuff like that] I hope he will please give you/us the masterclass - I will undoubtedly learn something too.

That said think I do spot an early Chelsea Hospital reference of 63286/H and a later MoP ref of 7/MC/3692 [the latter interprets as Region 7 / Military disability claim by surname starting C / Case number 3692 - region 7 being East Midlands]

Now further putting my potentially basic interpretation on the line the award of 16/3 pw from 20.7.17 to 22.1.18 - I think represent 50% disability for a Pension Class III NCO [typically a Sgt].

= As for the rest I really do hope Craig can do the honours for the other codes on these PIC, please. [place for fingers-crossed emoji - but I don't have one]

Meantime Craig has put a lot on the WFA website https://www.westernfrontassociation.com/pension-records so wider browsing is available to all.

M

ADDIT. There is also a pension ledger page(s) for this man, notes starting 11.9.20, which records he was a Sgt [phew!], born 1894, was single, lived at 6 Pemberton St., Nottingham and claimed for GSW Knee (Ankylosis) and Fractured Patella - Attrrib. The reverse shows at that time his disability was judged to be 30% and he was receiving 14/- pw from the 1919 RW and that this rate, from 29/11/22, became a permanent award

Thank you very much for your assistance.