British troops at Verdun

[Skipman]

I found a newspaper article that mentions British troops in reserve at Verdun. Did British/Scottish troops actually take part in the battle of Verdun?

Perth Men at Verdun

" Now that General Joffre has admitted the comradeship of British troops at Verdun, it can do no harm to state that the French newspapers have published the total strength of the British force held in reserve behind the French lines. Our censor has kept his thumb on that. I may say (writes a " Bulletin " correspondent) that Scotland is interested in the units composing the Verdun reserves, especially Glasgow and the north. Perthshire, it may be stated, is among the districts whose sons are taking part in the great battle. "

Mike

[James A Pratt III]

I don't think so. The nearest British unit I can think of is RNAS 3 Wing that did fly some bombing missions from the Southern part of the Western front.

[phil andrade]

Perhaps Joffre was alluding here to the build up of Entente strength on a general strategic basis.

When the Verdun battle was reaching its most intense phase, Joffre set great store on the prospect of British help in the forthcoming Picardy offensive .

In this sense, B.E.F. build up for the Somme could be construed as a form of reserve to assist the French, even if it was about one hundred miles from the Mill on the Meuse.

That's my guess ; I hope it is plausible.

Phil (PJA)

[Guest]

Quite possibly Phil. I don't see any other references to it anywhere.

Mike

[Dust Jacket Collector]

I wondered the same thing after watching last night's episode of 'Peaky Blinders' on BBC2 in which the lead character & several others including Winston Churchill claimed they fought at Verdun. Surely some mistake.

[Hedley Malloch]

Yes - but as soldiers of the French Army. There were at least three British nationals in the French army before Verdun, including a Geordie from Gateshead. How they ended up there must be a fascinating story in its own right.

My source is a display on non-French soldiers who fought in the French Army at Verdun shown at the Ossuary about five years ago. The three Brits were mentioned there complete with photos. From memory, one of them was an officer.

[Guest]

A pal mentioned Peaky Blinders, and i was reminded of the newspaper clip. I think there were Foreign Legionnaires of British nationality who may have fought there, but not sure of any British units?

Mike

[Hedley Malloch]

I wondered the same thing after watching last night's episode of 'Peaky Blinders' on BBC2 in which the lead character & several others including Winston Churchill claimed they fought at Verdun. Surely some mistake.

On the other hand it could be a dramatic device, a door-opener to a confrontation further on in the series. "I first knew you were lying when you said you had fought in the British army at Verdun. There were no British army units at Verdun. Take that you b*****d!"

Or it could be yet another example of WW1balls. There is a lot of it about.

[tootrock]

In the film "The Englishman who went up a hill and came down a mountain" the character played by Hugh Grant claims to have been wounded at Verdun.

Just thought I would mention it.

Martin

[centurion]

This is another of these old forum perennials that keeps cropping up because no one checks to see if its been up before before opening another thread that goes over the same old ground. I'm not going to bother to list all the previous threads but here is one such

http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=73056#entry661532

[Guest]

Well that's me told. My thread possibly covers new ground? " The French newspapers have published the total strength of the British force held in reserve behind the French lines "

If that could be found?

You're right enough, I should have checked, and God help you if I find you posting a new thread on a subject previously covered. OK?

Mike

[centurion]

Some of the previous threads on the subject do contain details of British medical personnel who were at Verdun including an officer whose service record shows him to have been there in such a capacity. I haven't read them all, there are too many and so its possible that one or more does have the French newspaper details.

I believe that Churchill did visit Verdun in a fact finding capacity - which is not the same as fighting there.

[Guest]

It seems unlikely, but who knows. Maybe something will crop up some day.

Cheers Mike

[centurion]

Having done a quick review I think you are right - there is no mention of such reports. What is clear having looked at info and references in different threads is that there was a British manned ambulance section based in Fort Souville and a British run hospital the Urgency Cases Hospital in the Chateau du Faux Miroir (British doctors in charge) that treated about 3,000 French casualties from Verdun, There was also "Section Sanitaire Anglaise, which was a British detachment of volunteers helping the French Red Cross at Verdun. They wore British uniforms but were under French orders"

[Guest]

I also found this (hope ok to post partial image?) It may have been newspaper silly season, as the same article mentions Russian troops in France.

Mike

[centurion]

The Englishmen could have been members of Section Sanitaire Anglaise who were uniformed and wore brodies (see my earlier post), of such small things are mighty myths made.

The Russian Expeditionary Force (brigade strength) landed in France in April 1916 http://img.rt.com/files/politics/world-war-soldiers-memory-437/stop-troops-world-war.si.jpg

[paulgranger]

Ah, well, there were Russian troops in France. Following the Russian Revolution, they were 'surrounded' by French units, and made to give up their arms. Not sure where I read this, it may have been 'The Price of Glory'

Cent beat me to it.

[centurion]

http://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205048171 French ambulance drivers with members of the Section Sanitaire Anglaise

[Terry_Reeves]

Just out of interest, nine companies of the Special Brigade joined US forces on 3rd November, 1918 and were divided between American troops at Metz and Verdun, where they came under command of General Marchand. The Armistice meant that they did nor see action in that sector.

TR

[Guest]

31/5/1916 Wednesday Perthshire Advertiser

" General Sir Douglas Haig, in his first detailed despatch, refers to the prolonged and severe fighting near Verdun, and says the efforts by the enemy have cost him heavy losses both in men and in prestige, and he has made these sacrifices without gaining any advantage to counterbalance them. The British Commander-in-Chief mentions that during the Verdun struggle the British troops had been in readiness to co-operate as they might be needed, but the only assistance asked for by our Allies was of an indirect nature-- viz., the relief of the French troops on a portion of their defensive front. This relief Sir Douglas Haig was glad to be able to afford. Its execution on a considerable front, everywhere in close touch with the enemy, was a somewhat delicate operation. "

Sir Douglas Haig's Despatches

Mike

[Guest Tomn]

I have only just seen the Peaky Blinders episode mentioning British troops and Churchill at Verdun. This must be wrong as I have read nothing about this. Could they have mixed up Verdun and Ypres? Is it a deliberate error to warn views that this is a drama and not an accurate history?

[Guest Vince medic]

Hi,

I noticed this tread and i'd also love to get more knowledge as i believe my great grandfather apart from fighting in the Boer war, he also fought in the battle of Verdun. His name was George W English and was from County Durham, its strange that there was some mention of a man from Gateshead as its not to far from County Durham maybe the boundaries were different then. I only found out recently he was there as i found his obituary after my own grandfather had passed away. Could it not be that there probably were British fighters there as we sometimes have today supporting different nationalities.

[ss002d6252]

His name was George W English and was from County Durham, its strange that there was some mention of a man from Gateshead as its not to far from County Durham maybe the boundaries were different then

Gateshead was part of County Durham until 1974.

Craig

[CROONAERT]

.... I think there were Foreign Legionnaires of British nationality who may have fought there, but not sure of any British units?...

The RMLE was one of the few French regiments that actually DIDN'T fight at the 1916 Verdun battle. They did take part in the battles of August 1917 on the left flank though (and gained the battle honour ' Le Monts-Verdun').The nearest they (well, the 4RM/4RE anyway) fought prior to this was in the Argonne in 1914/15. There weren't a great many Legionnaires of British nationality serving in 1917 though.

No British combatant units played any role in any of the Verdun battles.

Dave

[CROONAERT]

Yes - but as soldiers of the French Army. There were at least three British nationals in the French army before Verdun,

Legion Etrangere aside, the metropolitan French Army contained quite a number of British nationals in the years leading up to and in the early years of WW1. One of my own (distant) relatives - a Lancashire man - was killed in action whilst serving with the 29e R.I. at Sarrebourg on August 20th 1914.

The 170e RI appeared a particular favourite for 'foreigners'. A number of British nationals died within its ranks at the Notre Dame de Lorette in May 1915, for example (though its ranks were swelled with other nationalities through to the end of the war... the last 'foreigner in its ranks to die being an American in October 1918)

Dave.