petrick Posted 28 October , 2004 Share Posted 28 October , 2004 well just saw this poll and put my vote in.....wouldnt want it any other way a space dedicated for all women..factory-girls...grand ladies...roses of nomandsland...russian womens battalion and so onn. About time there were a few more topics about them. coo-ee patrick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Hesketh Posted 28 October , 2004 Share Posted 28 October , 2004 Hard to imagine why we haven't done this already! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate Wills Posted 28 October , 2004 Author Share Posted 28 October , 2004 It will take me all of ...oooh, let's think...30 seconds to set this up. At the weekend! Chris, You're a good bloke.... ...even if you do file women under Miscellaneous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie Posted 28 October , 2004 Share Posted 28 October , 2004 [...even if you do file women under Miscellaneous Yes, there's a long road ahead. Robbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindsey Posted 28 October , 2004 Share Posted 28 October , 2004 Well Kate and all of you whom have supported this request, at least we have succeeded, finally!! Votes for Women 2004!! thats a new date to add to the calendar of breakthroughs... Lindsey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindsey Posted 28 October , 2004 Share Posted 28 October , 2004 By the way, my mother, a child of a WW1 soldier, is also delighted there is now an arena to discuss, collate info, share knowledge and importantly remember the women who were part of that time, in whatever capacity Lindsey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Half-pint Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 Ehrm, have added my vote in favour, however after the fact ;-). I have a particular interest, but admittedly no literature review or research experience in, women's and children's experiences on the "other" home front ... during and after the war. Alison Causton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest marianne55555 Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 Lindsey & Kate - what a wonderful idea! And with an apparent O.K. from Chris - what a guy! Of course I voted yes. And thanks to the male PALS for their support ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrtle Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 Thanks Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue Light Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 Sue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myrtle Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 [...even if you do file women under Miscellaneous Yes, there's a long road ahead. Robbie Why not put " The Women in The Great War " section into "Battles, battlefields and Places" alongside Homes & POWs ?It seems more appropriate than "Miscellaneous." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 Spot on, Myrtle. What do others think? Robbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Baker Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 Ask, and ye shall receive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 THANKS CHRIS..this is a much more appropriate place for this topic. Robbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kate Wills Posted 29 October , 2004 Author Share Posted 29 October , 2004 Thankyou Chris This seems a much more appropriate place Thankyou Pte Kate Wills A Company Monstruous Regiment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindsey Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 Another thanks to you Chris, for moving the discussion forum. I was worried when I first came on to the site tonight as I went straight to the 'misc' section and Women in the Great War was not there, i thought I had dreamt it it all!!! What a relief and delight i felt when i scrolled up to see it had gained a higher status!! Thanks to all of you for your support in the request I made, and looking at it so far, it seems to have been a good decision. Lindsey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Miller Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 A well-organised campaign has been rewarded with Women in the Great War taking its place as a section on its own - and a good idea too. But I found the need for a poll very disconcerting. I admit to not taking much notice at the birth of other sections, but I don't ever remember a poll being necessary. I mean, which sensible Great War enthusiast could reasonably object to this new section? It doesn't matter if it doesn't interest various members, several of the older sections don't interest me. I imagine any sensible suggestion for a new section would be considered by Chris. The insinuation from the vote is that anyone who voted against, must be a male chauvanist, as there was no good reason to vote 'no'. Why bother to advertise the possibility that there are some of that persuasion on the forum, it gives no credit to the cause. Also, I feel saddened that such things as 'Votes for Women 2004' and 'thanks to the male pals' needed to be said. I can't believe that the women on this forum are so lacking in self confidence that they think they need such flag waving slogans in order to be taken seriously? And male pals didn't need thanking as if it was a wonderful miracle for them to have agreed. Are most of us men supposed to have thrown out copies of Testament of Youth because it was written by a woman? How ridiculous that would be! I, in the past, and hopefully in the future (but I'm not sure after this) have asked Kate for help with information. If I was not receptive to the talents and value of the female members of the forum, I wouldn't have done this. I know I would be treating her as an equal, more probably, a better. I don't need there to be a campaign with women feeling they have to prove themselves, and I would hope that the vast majority of men on the forum would feel the same way. So I just feel that a quiet suggestion to Chris would have sufficed, as in the case of previous sections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 Jon, I'm not sure I agree with you on much of this, however, I suppose it is good that such views can be aired. Robbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larneman Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 a space dedicated for all women..factory-girls...grand ladies...roses of nomandsland...russian womens battalion and so on. Do not forget these ladies either. Female Intelligence: Women and Espionage in the First World War Author: Tammy Proctor Publisher: New York University Press (2003) ISBN 0-8147-6693-5 Women Spies of WW1... Summary: Mata Hari is remembered as the great seductress-spy of history. Much less well-known are the thousands of other women involved in espionage during the First World War. A new history uncovers the women who worked for the fledgling British Secret Service - from English Girl Guides to Belgian grandmothers. More than 6,000 women worked for British intelligence (later to be known as MI5 and MI6) from its establishment in 1909 until war demobilisation in 1919. Yet this was a time when women didn't have the vote, were often thought of as gossipy and indiscreet, and not considered capable of the "platonic patriotism" that typified male spies. No wonder these women often found themselves in paradoxical positions! Liam ( I voted yes as well) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 More on Mata Hari. http://www.rnw.nl/holland/html/matahari_eng990228.html In 1999, the British Security Service released the first documents concerning the life and times of Mata Hari. Accused of being a double agent for both the French and German army during the Great War, Mata Hari was executed in 1917 by a French firing squad. She was born in the northern Dutch town of Leeuwarden as Margaretha Geertruida Zelle. At the beginning of this century, she moved to France where she started a career as a nude dancer. She became famous and moved in the highest circles of Europe. Her fame made it easy for her to travel to various European countries. Even during the war. So, the French Secret Service asked Mata Hari to mingle with the Germans and find out as much as she could. However, during her first mission something went wrong and she was arrested by the British intelligence service. They questioned her on every suspicious move or meeting she'd had, but her alibis were watertight. She even told her interrogators that she worked for the French Secret Service. So all the British agents could do was release her and send her back. For a long time, historians have thought her arrest was mere coincidence. But the British documents released this week, reveal that the British MI-5 kept Mata Hari under close surveillance from 1915 on. In the meantime, the French too got suspicious. Mata Hari had lovers on both sides of the border. Who knows what secrets were exchanged between the sheets... It also became clear that German army officers were paying her. Officially, it was to keep them company but the French intelligence office wasn't so sure about that. What if she was paid for passing on sensitive information? When she tried to cross into France to visit one of her lovers, Mata Hari was arrested by the French Secret Service and interrogated. During one of these long sessions, she succumbed and confessed to being a German spy, known under the pseudonym of H21. The trial that followed was nothing more than a showcase trial. The French were convinced she was "one of the greatest spies of the century, responsible for the deaths of tens of thousands of soldiers". Mata Hari was deemed guilty and condemned to death. In 1917, she died in front of a firing squad despite her desperate claims that she was innocent. But even the French didn't get the complete story. Mata Hari never told them whom she worked with or whose orders she followed. The French dossiers are still closed. In Holland, some people have tried in vain to persuade the French government to reopen her case. The Dutch Mata Hari Foundation however, still sees possibilities to rehabilitate her with the help of these newly released MI-5 documents. They still think there may be chance that Mata Hari was indeed innocent. Fascinating woman. Robbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindsey Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 Jon I would just like to say that I do agree with much of what you say. It was myself who 'suggested' a specific area of discussion on Women in the Great War and that suggestion set the ball rolling. I was suprised myself that a 'poll' was needed and came across it by accident. I, in my innocence thought this was the way the forum started such discussion areas and have gone along with it for that reason. What did suprise me, as it did you, was the need for such a long discussion about having such a topic area, but despite that, i also felt that it highlighted a need for this forum and am pleased at the outcome. In regard to your comments about 'Votes for Women 2004' I have to say that I was reponding to the valued comments of others that this site apparently has a problem with attracting women and retaining their interest, of course i dont know if thats true or not. However, I do not agree that it is about the lack of self confidence of women at all, it was more about 'joining in' with the discussion and making it a little interesting and fun too.... as humour does retain interest!! I would also certainly hope that the male members of this forum do not throw out their copies of 'Testament of Youth' just because it was written by a woman. In fact, I really dont understand this male/female thing about the war.As far as im concerned everyone is equal and despite it not being like that during WW1, I think we all have enough intellegence to overcome that in this day and age. And to add to that, Testament of Youth is the top of my favorite list of books!! I would love to find the video of the series that was shown in the 70's, do you have any ideas as to how I may find it? Jon, it was Vera Brittains story that triggered my interest in the Great War as a young 17yr old. Im nearly 49 now and its only two years ago that i began my journey of discovery and absolute fascination with WW1. The initial discussion about the set up of this topic area also involved some one making sexist and innapropriate remarks, and then promptly deleting them. An apology did follow however (thank you) as to the misinterpretation of his comments. Perhaps this is why the women of the forum retaliated in such a way, and rightly so too. Throw away comments are sometimes taken seriously here I have come to realise, so its appropriate to think about what you say before you say it . Anyway, i agree wholeheartedly that the gender of the posters should not be an issue on this site, the focus in my mind is soley the subject matter, whoever that involves!! Lindsey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larneman Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 And here are a few more ladies that served.... Women in World War One: Thirty Thousand Women Were There http://userpages.aug.com/captbarb/femvets4.html In 1901 and 1908 the establishment of the Army and Navy Nurse Corps opened the door for women in the military but ever so slightly. It wasn't until the United States got involved in World War One that some parts of the government got serious about using woman power. Other War Service Sites: 2) "Everything was Going to be Different": Suffrage, War, and Women’s Work 1832-1918 http://www.watson.org/~leigh/history295/ev...gdifferent.html 3) Home Fires of Huntington . . . by M.J. McCarthy from Don Mabry's Historical Text Archive http://historicaltextarchive.com/ww1/huntington.html 4) "Mademoiselle Miss" http://raven.cc.ukans.edu/~kansite/ww_one/medical/MMiss.htm 5) Nurse Helen Fairchild: My Aunt, My Hero from World War I Primary Document Archive http://raven.cc.ukans.edu/~kansite/ww_one/...MaMh/MyAunt.htm 6) Unsung Women of World War One: The Signal Corps Women http://userpages.aug.com/captbarb/signal.html 7) Women and War from Spartacus Encyclopaedia of the First World War http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/FWWwomen.htm 8) Women During the First World War http://stauffer.queensu.ca/webarch/women_in_the_war.htm 9) Women in World War One from An American Nurse at War (Links-site) http://www.nurse-at-war.org/womenin.htm 10) Women in the U.S. Navy: Historic Documents http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq48-3b.htm 11) Women's International League for Peace from Spartacus Educational http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/USApeaceIN.htm 12) Women's Peace Party from Spartacus Educational http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/Wpeace.htm 13) Women were Vital to Military Success in War by C. Smith, Seattle Post-Intelligencer http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/awards/witne...womenatwar.html borrowed from http://www.42explore2.com/ww1.htm Liam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Miller Posted 29 October , 2004 Share Posted 29 October , 2004 Lindsey Have posted info off-forum Jon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindsey Posted 30 October , 2004 Share Posted 30 October , 2004 Thanks for letting me know you have sent it and I shall look forward to recieving the info. I did go to 'Past Times' shop to see if they had it as someone told me they did. NO LUCK at all, so i hope you have some pointers, cheers Jon! We are talking about 'Testament of Youth' I hope.....???? Lindsey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelley Posted 30 October , 2004 Share Posted 30 October , 2004 As a nurse, who has an interest in nurses in the Great War, I think this is Awesome!! cheers Shelley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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