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tullybrone

MOD confirm they are issuing "Returned" WW1 Medals

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tullybrone

Hi,

Is anyone aware that MOD are now reissuing WW1 Medals?

The 4.40pm 20th August post by geoffbaxter on the below thread suggests they are doing so.

Regards

Steve Y

EDIT 27th Aug 2014 - plse scroll down to see update - MOD ARE ISSUING MEDALS WHERE MIC MARKED MEDALS "RETURNED".

 

 

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Sepoy

I am afraid not - they stopped issuing/reissuing WW1 medals in the 1990s (or late 1980s).

The only option today is to acquire replica medals or to rename original medals. The method of renaming, in my view, is not an option as it takes an original named medal which is then errased. Not only is this destroying the original naming, it leaves the medal with a narrow rim which can be quite noticiable. It also devalues the medal as well as destroying its history.

If you are interested in purchasing decent die struck replica medals (marked copies) Militaria dealer Jeremy Tenniswood (www.militaria.co.uk) can help. He can also arrange for medals to be named in the correct fashion as well as being mounted for display or wear.

Sepoy

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tullybrone

Hi,

Thanks for the link - that is the situation as I understand it to be.

Hopefully geoffbaxter will explain how he has managed to get medals reissued by MOD.

Regards

Steve Y

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Medaler

There is another option - to purchase unnamed originals (which do exist but would be devalued by having them named) or original medals that have already been erased. The latter should however be avoided as it encourages medals to be erased to supply the market.

The former of these 2 options would be my favoured way of doing things as they have the bonus of being authentic.

If they are just required for display purposes then a further option of buying original medals named to another recipient should not be overlooked - you will probably not be able to see the naming details if the medals are to be framed anyway.

Regards,

Mike

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SiegeGunner

An update to my researches.

The M.O.D. have kindly re-issued the medals for Archie and Cyril who both died in Palestine. The medal card for Archie was incomplete so we didn't get the Star. I cannot complain because I never expected to see either.

There doesn't seem to be much scope for misunderstanding what geoffbaxter wrote, but it does not accord with everyone else's knowledge and experience, so hopefully he will return to the forum to explain how the 're-issue' he refers to was achieved.

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archangel9

There doesn't seem to be much scope for misunderstanding what geoffbaxter wrote, but it does not accord with everyone else's knowledge and experience, so hopefully he will return to the forum to explain how the 're-issue' he refers to was achieved.

Very interesting!

Almost a year though since we have seen the poster.

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tullybrone

Very interesting!

Almost a year though since we have seen the poster.

Hi Archangel,

He made his post 4.40pm 20th August this year.

Steve Y

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archangel9

My mistake. Apologies.

John

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ss002d6252

I wonder if he'll come back.

Craig

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John_Hartley

Today, on the other thread, Geoff writes:

"I understood from posts on this site that they didn't re-issue but I had copies of the medal cards which showed the medals had been returned. I couldn't read the scribble on the bottom section on one of the cards so I wrote to the medal section asking if they knew why they had been returned, and whether they still existed or had been destroyed. Some months later I had a document to fill in as a request for the medals. I assumed that being a close blood relative, a nephew, and that they had been returned, made the difference."

I had read that and thought "yeah, he's applied but they'll say no", then I read his earlier post as quoted upthread by Siege Gunner which indicates that he's got the medals. Certainly seems to put the cat amongst the pigeons and turn the collective knowledge on its head (with apologies for mixing metaphors), not least as the MoD link given by johnboy is categoric that WW1 medals cannot be supplied. I wonder how they manage to make one-offs if, indeed, that is what has been made. Discuss.

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CGM

It reads to me that the returned medals still existed.

CGM

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tullybrone

It raises the question as to when medals are shown as "returned" on the MIC whether they are still in possession of the MOD at the Medal Office?

Steve Y

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John_Hartley

It reads to me that the returned medals still existed.

CGM

I'm reasonably sure that I've seen notes on MIC's recording that permission had been granted for a returned set of medals to be destroyed. Of course, my memory may easily be at fault but you would have thought that, if the MoD had a big box of returned medals which they kept in the kept in the cupboard under the stairs (so to speak), this would be reasonably well known - at least amongst the medal collecting community. Is it, I wonder?

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CGM

This is a huge puzzle!

Has anyone got a close relative whose medals were returned and whose MIC does not say that the medals were destroyed - who would like to try and repeat this?

CGM

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Sepoy

When the Medal Office closed in Hayes Middlesex, about 10 - 15 years ago, I am certain they had a clear out and that some of the surviving items, like unissued 1914 Star date bars were sold off. I am sure this is where some Medal dealers like Chris Dixon in Bridlington acquired a quantity.

I would be amazed if they still hold stocks of medals, especially as their website ( https://www.gov.uk/the-ministry-of-defence-medal-office ) states that they no longer issue World War One Medals. Quote "The Medal Office is unable to replace medals issued before World War 2, such as World War I medals, under any circumstances".

Sepoy

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CGM

It does say replace, which does leave it open to being able to supply originals still in their care.....??

CGM

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John_Hartley

On the other thread, geoffbaxter posts:

I've copied this line from the message I received:

"The MOD Medal Office no longer makes initial issues of World War 1 medals, but can re-issue if the original medals are proven to have been returned"

Doesnt this just raise even more questions. Such as "How are they re-issuing? Are they having new ones struck, using replicas, erasing and renaming a previously issued one.? And how come it seems to have taken some 30 years of experts in this field saying that you couldnt get medals only for new information to come about simply by someone writing to the MoD? Anyone know if this subject is being followed any any medal forums (there is one, isnt there)?

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Terry_Reeves

This thread is of no particular interest to me, but would it not be better if the participants contacted the MOD directly?

TR

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John_Hartley

Good point, Terry

I have only passing interest in this but have taken up your idea and emailed the MoD medals department.

I've also asked that, if they can confirm that it is the case, what evidence they would need from an applicant that they were an appropriate person to whom they should issue medals. I'm not a collector but know, from forum posts, that medals have a commercial value and I can't see what might prevent someone applying for medals simply on spec, without any family connection whatsoever. And, even where someone is genuinely a family menber, I'm unsure what critieria the MoD might have to determine they are the right person to issue medals to. I know I'm the great nephew of at least two soldiers but have no idea, at this passage of generations, if there are folk in a more direct line with a better claim as grandsons or grandaughters. I've also asked that of the MoD.

John

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johnboy

I posted the MOD medals link so will be interested in the reply.

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John_Hartley

A prompt response this morning which confirms:

that if a copy of the medal card can be produced that shows evidence of return then, we are able to re-issue medals.

We will also require the attached form (above) to be completed and signed. If your ancestor is alive then they will need to complete and sign this form. If they are no longer alive, the legal next of kin will need to complete and sign. In this instance, we would also require a copy of the death certificate."

The form mentioned appears to be their standard application form and there is a definition of "legal next of kin".

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johnboy

Why is this info not on their website?

Could you post this info as a separate thread to let members and visitors know that they may be able to get family medals?

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tullybrone

Hi,

I have amended this topic/thread title to confirm MOD are reissuing "RETURNED" medals.

Regards

Steve Y

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johnboy

Good. It makes sense!

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