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No record of service/death


Ludford101
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Good afternoon all ... first post newbie ... arrived here via the BMF and many thanks to any members who have tried to help me with this quest on that site ... but a few suggested that the GWF may be a better chance of putting this one to rest so to speak .. ;)

Looking for any help to identify a unit/location of death of George William Stanewell

Please see the image of his gravestone in Burton on Stather N.Lincs.

I have been through Ancestry and gleaned info from Birth Records ( born 1874 in Glandford Brigg) and found two census returns for 1881 and 1901 ... but that is basically it.

I can find no info on this man between 1881 and 1901 and then after that nothing until he turns up on his father's grave stone with the inscription Killed in Action 1st Feb 1916

No MIC and No CWGC entry

Members of the BMF have tried searching various spellings of his surname ... no luck ... the only thing I can think is that he enlisted under an alias ... but I checked the date on CWGC and although one alias shows up it is not him...

Any members got a suggestion or two to take this further.... waiting for a request to the church to see if he was interred there ... but highly unlikely and I think his family may have left the village not long after father passed away in late 1880's so not sure who added his details to father's headstone but obviously done sometime after 1916 ... maybe not until 1920's .. ( mother died 1921 , younger brother Leonard in 1951 and perhaps buy someone not that close to him as the age looks like 40 yrs old and he was born in 1874 so should have been more like 41/42 yrs..

Hope for some better luck here ... thanks for reading

Gary

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Hello Gary,

Bit of a long shot, but what about this chap:

http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/2970087/WILLIAMS,%20GEORGE

I think Hull is quite close, and it says this man doesn't have a headstone yet. Name, age, and date are different though. Just had a look to see what I could find. Does "14 Beaumont St., Hull" ring a bell with the census information you have? Apologies if way off.

Chris

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Have you tried for a death record or death certificate? Or even at emigration records?

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Hello Gary, and welcome to the Forum!

The CWGC was not formed until 1917 so a man dying in February 1916 might have escaped their notice.

Might he have been in the Royal Navy or the Merchant Navy? The Medal Index Cards only cover the Army.

Ron

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Hi Chris ... no not my man as he was over 40 yrs old at supposed time of death ... but many thanks for looking

and johnboy ... if you mean the death records that show registration in ancestry .. then yes he does not come up ??

that is the mystery as far as I was aware if you were KIA in WW1 home or abroad them you would have a CWGC entry .. if you just died in 1916 as a civilian then you should appear on the England and Wales Death Index 1916-2007 ... this man does not appear on either ...

Cheers

Gary

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If you go to

you will see another ongoing case of a man added to parents headstone . No other records.

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Hello Gary, and welcome to the Forum!

The CWGC was not formed until 1917 so a man dying in February 1916 might have escaped their notice.

Might he have been in the Royal Navy or the Merchant Navy? The Medal Index Cards only cover the Army.

Ron

Thanks for the welcome Ron ... I guess that with the lack of MIC he could be Navy / MN especially last know location was Hull ...

as to the CWGC reference not really sure what you mean by missing him off as there are casualties listed way back to 1914 ... I have a trio and plaque to a Yorkshire Light Infantry Pte killed on 25th October 1914 and he is listed ? ... so if killed in WW1 according to the date on the gravestone he should be on the site ... of course errors can be found and maybe this is one ... but not on local war memorial either ... all seems a bit strange...

Gary

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Nothing in the MICs may also mean he was serving with ANZAC, South African or Canadian forces. That might be supported by the fact I can't find him on the 1911 census

Nothing in the Overseas army deaths list or SDGW.

Of course, it's possible that it's the headstone that's in error

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Served with a non British (non Imperial) force? such as the FFL - would explain both the lack of a 1911 census entry and no CWGC and MID

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Not in the Register of Seamen's Services RN as far as I can see.

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I can't see any obvious service records for the Canadian's or ANZAC's.

Craig

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All of which suggests that if killed in WW1 he was serving with some foreign force.

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Maybe French or Belgian Ambulance service or some medical unit not connected to UK? Does the church have any burial records or death notices? Local paper obit? Very puzzling in any case. Good Luck.

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Maybe French or Belgian Ambulance service or some medical unit not connected to UK? Does the church have any burial records or death notices? Local paper obit? Very puzzling in any case. Good Luck.

What's wrong with the Foreign Legion?

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It's not just him who is missing from the 1891 census, the mother and brother aren't there either.

Something seems a bit funny with the CWGC search... If you search for nothing else but Merchant Navy it only returns 6 results, and I can't figure out what I'm doing wrong.

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What's wrong with the Foreign Legion?

As the mother and brother have gone missing maybe try emigration records.

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It's not just him who is missing from the 1891 census, the mother and brother aren't there either.

Something seems a bit funny with the CWGC search... If you search for nothing else but Merchant Navy it only returns 6 results, and I can't figure out what I'm doing wrong.

Gary /Jon,

In case you aren't aware of it ..........

Geoff's Search Engine is a far more flexible way to search than the CWGC. The only drawback is that it will not pick up more recent additions to the CWGC database.

Phil

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I had overlooked Gary's point that the family may not have lived in the village for 40 years. It could so easily be some distant second cousin (or whatever) who has arrnage dthe incription, acting on wrong information.

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Have you seen that there are 1 or 2 family tree records for this family on Ancestry? They might know some further information that would help you. Of course, it could be that one of the trees is yours, in which case my advice is no help! :whistle:

Its just that on one of the trees it says "Died on Active Service", rather than KIA. Another possibility is that he might have been killed in an accident while based in the UK, in which case there would be no Medal Card. And as Ron says, perhaps the CWGC missed him. (The CWGC would have had to backdate any entries before

1917, and in this process could easily have missed men on family headstones).

That said, the trees do seem to imply he died in France.

Cheers,

Chris

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Many thanks one and all ...

Just sifting through ... many of the same avenues of thought have come up ... the census data regarding mother and brother in 1911 I had spotted and that made me wonder why all were not on 1891 census.

The idea of emigration had crossed my mind and that he may not have died abroad ... certainly the family trees could be a route... and I will have a go down that line... I just thought that I would see if any keen WW1 researchers could get any further than my limited attempts to navigate through ancestry and other data bases... to ensure that I had not missed a really obvious point.

One idea I had for the alias theory was he may have been turned down trying to enlist in 1914 due to age (40) ... but I realise that this was probably not the case as I have seen evidence of research into my village war memorial ... Mansfield Woodhouse Notts .. ( of which I have some cracking postcard photos of its unveiling in the 1920's which I will post up on a relevant thread...) where a number of men were 40 yrs plus... so that seems to count that out.

Any other ideas greatly welcomed...

Gary

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There is another possibility (although it's not particularily helpful with your quest). George may have used an alias which has never been connected to his real name & therefore is in essence hiding in plain sight. The reasons for doing this are many and varied (all covered in a number of threads on the GWF).

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On the headstone is an inscription of someone who died aged 9. Can you let us know the year of death?

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Mother and brother are listed in the 1911 census at 7 Melrose St, Sculcoates, Yorkshire, England

The one reffered to is George Henry so unlikely. Would parents have 2 sons and name them both George?

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