4th Battalion Manchester Regiment

[jeanbrandwood@t]

I am helping a friend with her family tree and she is interested in finding out more about her father's experiences in WW1. I have found some service records on Ancestry ( all of which appeared to be damaged) but wondered if war diaries or other records may be available.

His name is James Coop, his number is 78993 and he was with the 4th Battalion Manchester Regiment. Any advice would be very helpful, thank you.

[jay dubaya]

I'm viewing the documents on my ipod at present (frustratingly) but they would suggest that he didn't see any overseas service and he spent 196 days with the battalion before being discharged, looks like he was sent back to Astley? Colliery Tyldesley?. I'll have a better look when I can get back on the PC

Jon

[jeanbrandwood@t]

Thank you very much Jon. Very good of you to have a look at this for me. Yes he was a miner in Astley, Tyldesley. My friend said she remembered him telling her stories about the trenches etc but wasn't sure where he served.

[8055Bell]

Hi Jean,

This is a bit strange to me. James attested in 1916. He was then called up to 4th Bttn before being transferred back to Reserve as a Coal miner in Astley 196 days later. The 4th Bttn were a reserve Bttn based in Lincs and I can't see how he would have been in trenches, other than possibly a training version. The absence of Service Medals really confirms he hadn't been abroad. I reckon you should ask on http://www.themanchesters.org/forum/index.php

By the way I know of 3 other miners from Tyldesley who enlisted with 17th Bttn. They looked after a young former public school boy named Albert Hurst in their hut at Heaton Park. Joe Farmer was one of these and he won the MM.

Tim

Edited version due to incorrect data

[jay dubaya]

Hi Jean,

On the other hand he received the British War Medal and Victory Medal which were only given to people who served overseas. Very strange...

Tim

Where did that information come from? It clearly states in his papers that his 196 days service was spent at home

[8055Bell]

Good Point and Well Made. I'll edit my post where I was confused with the 'wrong' James Coop 51886.

[jeanbrandwood@t]

Thank you very much for looking at this for me Tim and Jay. It looks as if the family had incorrect information. Could I ask which documents you were looking at. Were they the WW1 service records on Ancestry? These are the only ones I have managed to find. Much appreciate your help and time.

[jay dubaya]

Yes, they are indeed the documents on ancestry. Like Tim mentions above the 'trenches' may have been practice trenches in the uk. The 4th (Extra Reserve) Battalion were raised in Ashton-under-Lyne on the 4th August 1914 and moved to the Humber Defences later that month, in October the battalion moved to Riby where they remained on the Lincolnshire coast in the Humber Garrison until the end of the war.

James Coop played his part in the war effort, he was a miner and had a crucial role to play supporting the war effort from the pit. His late enlistment (albeit conscription) was no doubt due to his trade, and although I haven't yet read the statements on his conduct sheet it would seem he wasn't going to take kindly to army discipline. 196 days later he was back on the pit face with his pals

[jeanbrandwood@t]

That's great Jay, thank you very much for all your help. Some of the records are very faint and difficult to read especially without having the expert knowledge you have with war documents etc so much appreciated.