Help needed identifying uniform

[catwat]

Hi,

Does anyone recognise the uniform or cap worn by this soldier?

Any help appreciated,

Regards

Catherine

[FROGSMILE]

Hi,

Does anyone recognise the uniform or cap worn by this soldier?

Broughall Unknown 1171.jpg

Any help appreciated,

Regards

Catherine

Catherine he is King's (Liverpool) Regiment. The collar badge, a rose with scroll under inscribed 'KING'S', was introduced in 1882 and hated by both of the regular battalions, as they had previously worn a white horse collar badge, and the new badge owed its origins to the local Militia, who were merged with the regulars and local Rifle Volunteers in July 1881.

The two regular battalions then mounted a 14-year campaign to get their white horse badges back and were at last successful in 1896, although old stocks of the rose badge had to be used up first. The 1st Battalion, who were overseas, achieved this quite quickly, but the 2nd Battalion took a little longer and the Militia and Volunteer Battalions longer still.

As your photo shows the 1902 pattern khaki drab service dress (SD) jacket, and also a khaki Field Service Cap (FSC), I think that it is likely that the photo shows a soldier of a Volunteer Battalion (VB) of the regiment that was still using up its old stock of collar badges. He also wears the waist belt from the 1903 pattern mounted infantry bandolier equipment, which again helps with the date. The FSC was phased out from 1902, but seems to have lasted longer in the VB than in the regulars, as the latter took longer to receive the replacement, 'Brodrick' cap.

N.B. He seems to be wearing what might have been an experimental / trial version of the jacket as it has scalloped pocket flaps, whereas the general issue pattern had plain rectangular pocket flaps.

[catwat]

Hi 'Frogsmile',

That's a great response and so quickly, too. I will pass on the information to my friend to see if he can now figure out where this man fits into his family.

From what you are saying the photo dates from after the Boer War, but well before WW1.

Thanks again for all your help,

Regards,

Catherine

[FROGSMILE]

Hi 'Frogsmile',

That's a great response and so quickly, too. I will pass on the information to my friend to see if he can now figure out where this man fits into his family.

From what you are saying the photo dates from after the Boer War, but well before WW1.

Thanks again for all your help,

Regards,

Catherine

Yes, I think it is from before 1908. In 1908 brass shoulder titles were reintroduced.

[catwat]

Thanks again 'Frogsmile'

Regards

Catherine

[FROGSMILE]

Thanks again 'Frogsmile'

Regards

Catherine

There is another slight possibility Catherine, although it is a long shot, but interestingly retains a Lancashire connection (Liverpool of course also being in that county).

The East Lancashire Regiment had long worn a plain rose as its collar badge on full dress uniforms and, in 1902, when khaki service dress was introduced, a new badge was provided specially for the officers uniform. It was the same rose, but now with a scroll underneath inscribed EAST LANCASHIRE (see enclosed image).

The regimental history does not make it clear if this badge was also at first worn on other ranks uniforms too, although that seems unlikely, as generally soldiers did not start wearing collar badges routinely on their khaki SD until the 1920s. Nevertheless, I throw it in as a possibility.

[FROGSMILE]

Thanks again 'Frogsmile'

Regards

Catherine

Well Catherine, I had not expected this, but the style of the soldier's jacket pocket flaps had been bothering me and, after further research, I now believe that I have a much stronger contender for your man's unit and feel that in fact he is most likely a member of the yeomanry, who were part time, citizen cavalry, and from a Lancashire unit titled the Lancashire Hussars. I enclose their collar badge. The yeomanry wore different SD to the infantry units in the lead up to WW1, and often used the Field Service Cap as their head dress, as it was easier to manage in an equine environment.

1/1st Lancashire Hussars Yeomanry

• Formed in April 1908 for the Territorial Force and headquartered in Liverpool, the regiment was under command of the Welsh Border Mounted Brigade.
• On completing mobilisation it August 1914 it moved to Kent with the West Lancashire Division.
• In April 1915, still in Kent, it transferred to the 2nd West Lancashire Division.
• In October 1915 the regiment was split up as follows;
  • Headquarters and "B" Squadron went on 27 November 1915 to join 31st Division at Salisbury Plain. Next month it went to Egypt with the division. It moved to France in March 1916. Between 27 April and 10 May 1916 it was attached to the 2nd Indian Cavalry Division before the 1/1st came back together, now known as VIII Corps Cavalry regiment, on 11 May 1916.
  • "C" Squadron went on 14 November 1915 to join 35th Division at Salisbury Plain. It landed at Le Havre in France on 1 February 1916 and rejoined 1/1st on 10 May 1916.
  • "D" Squadron went on 29 October 1915 to join 30th Division at Salisbury Plain. It landed at Le Havre in France on 10 November 1915. Between 13 and 26 April 1916 it was attached to the 2nd Indian Cavalry Division before it rejoined 1/1st on 10 May 1916.
• During July 1917 the regiment was dismounted and sent for infantry training. It was absorbed into the 18th (Service) Battalion of the King's (Liverpool Regiment) on 24 September 1917.

2/1st Lancashire Hussars Yeomanry

• Formed in September 1914 as a "second line" (training, draft-supplying reserve) for the 1/1st. Came under orders of the Western Mounted Brigade.
• By March 1916 it had moved to Cupar in Fife and the brigade was renamed as the 21st Mounted Brigade.
• In July 1916 the regiment was converted to become a cyclist unit and came under the 14th Cyclist Brigade.
• The brigade was renamed as the 10th Cyclist Brigade in October 1916 and was still at Cupar although the 2/1st went to St Andrews in July 1917. In January 1918 the brigade moved to Lincolnshire with the 2/1st going to Skegness.
• In May 1918 the brigade moved to Ireland and the regiment was based at Bandon and Buttevant in County Cork.

3/1st Lancashire Hussars Yeomanry

• Formed in 1915 as a "third line" (training, draft-supplying reserve for the 1/1st and 2/1st) and was affiliated to a Reserve Regiment of Cavalry at the Curragh. In summer 1916 it was affiliated to the 10th Reserve Regiment of Cavalry but early in 1917 was absorbed into the 2nd Reserve Regiment.
• When the 1/1st was converted into infantry the 3/1st was reconstituted and transferred to (absorbed into) the 5th Reserve Battalion of the King's (Liverpool Regiment) at Oswestry.