Jump to content
Free downloads from TNA ×
The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

Remembered Today:

Post Easter Rising - How difficult was it for a soldier on leave?


sw63

Recommended Posts

Hi,

Apologies if this has been covered before. This is a bit hypothetical (any historical cases would be great to read):

In the immediate aftermath of the Easter Rising, how would a soldier from a front line Irish regiment fighting in France, who was home on leave and recuperating from wounds, have been treated?

Would he have been expected to report for duty in Ireland, or get back to England ASAP? Would he have travelled in uniform? How would he have been treated by the RIC? Would he have been offered protection?

Any ideas would be gratefully received,

Many thanks,

Simon

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Immediately after it was pro-British sentiment, many had family in the trenches, esp working class. But the British bungled the executions, they kept shooting the leaders at interval. A few weeks after the uprising sympathy grew and the Old IRA had a recruitment bonanza. Geography matters, not much going on in Cavan, Wexford on brink of martial law.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This might not be what you are looking for - an account of an officer recuperating at home in Ireland after suffering frost bite.

Lieut Eric John Keefe Pemberton Pigott was a member of one of the oldest County Wexford families. He was the son of Dr Frederick Pemberton Pigott of Shrewsbury in Shropshire, and the grandson of Captain Pemberton Pigott of Slevoy Castle, Wexford.

When he was 19 he obtained a commission in the army and was gazetted to the Royal Irish Regiment where served in India. During the opening stages of the war Lieut. Pigott was drafted to the 1st Bn. Royal Irish Rifles at the Western Front and took part in several engagements until he was invalided home suffering from frostbite.

While he was on leave in Ireland he participated in recruiting campaigns and delivered many appeals to men in Kilkenny and Cork. When sent back on active service again he rejoined his Regiment but in a gallant effort to save his guns was killed instantly on 24th June 1916 aged 21. The Catholic Chaplain of the Regiment and Commanding Officer wrote to his parents giving a graphic description of his bravery, telling them how he had died as a hero. He was buried in Houplines Communal Cemetery Extension in France.

Anne

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's an unusual subject: there are 1,001 tales of Irish soldiers being reluctant to participate in counter-insurgency operations e.g. George Edward Henry McElroy - future RAF ace and one of the highest-scoring RAF pilots of all time - had been invalided back to Ireland at that time, suffering from the effects of a gas attack while serving with the Royal Irish Regiment. There are various stories to the effect that he refused to fire on fellow Irishmen and was exiled to a remote garrison. (I find this story to be lacking in credibility from a number of angles, e.g. he was fully capable to being admitted to the Royal Military Academy at Woolwich only weeks later. On the other hand it wouldn't preclude some local arrangement whereby an officer sounded out men and then made arrangements to have them transferred, i.e. no insubordination, no mutiny, as they'd been posted elsewhere to a local in which the situation wouldn't arise. In contrast, the blundering surrounding the Curragh Mutiny by unionist officers in 1914 had largely centered around a hypothetical situation they were not being asked to do, i.e. the initial set of orders were in respect of securing existing installations etc and not defending the UK against any loyalist operations against Home Rule but the case made by many of the unionist officers had centered on the endgame/mission-creep and not the initial salami-tactic of splitting it down into a step-by-step militarization of what was still a political situation).

However, given the number of tales surrounding 1916 it would not be unsurprising if some tales of refusing to participate in the fighting actually turned out to have a basis in fact. Robert Barton (future Government minister in the 'Republic of Ireland'/Poblacht na hÉireann government but not the later pro-Treaty Irish Free State) recounts a story in which he managed to get sent home back to Co Wicklow to look for a uniform, as his tailors in Dame Street were inaccessible due to the fighting:

http://www.bureauofmilitaryhistory.ie/reels/bmh/BMH.WS0979.pdf#page=50

Dublin would have had quite a high proportion of servicemen relative to other parts of Ireland. Urban areas generally tended to have higher enlistment rates. (My own great-grandfather and several great-granduncles served, which was quite normal for inner city Dublin: the Boer War gave the Dublin Fusiliers their 'Royal' prefix, and the arch at St Stephen's Green still stands). Those in certain workmen's occupations, such as the postal service and many unionist-oriented employers such as Guinness, made arrangements for special leave to be granted and their positions kept open for those who enlisted in the war effort). In the circumstances, the newspaper accounts of the 1916 prisoners being mocked by hostile crowds would not have been incorrect. However, the news blackout, the piecemeal drip-feed of executions stretched out over a prolonged period, the extra-judicial killings (even ridiculous ones such as the murder of the prominent pacifist Francis Sheehy-Skeffington, who had the misfortune of being taken as a human shield for a raiding party who shot a number of civilians, including journalists, and thus leaving Sheehy-Skeffington as a witness to events for which there would be public scrutiny).

Overall though the number of Irishmen serving in the operations to suppress the Easter Rising would have been at least as great as the numbers involved in it. Consequently, there was no immediate danger to any soldier on leave in uniform in 1916. The difficulties began in later years, and the casualty rate among former servicemen would appear to have been higher in the Irish Civil War and in the War of Independence, i.e. more of a 1920s problem than a wartime one.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sheehy-Skeffington had the misfortune to be interrogated by Colthurst-Bowen, who, in modern parlance, was barking mad. By 1919 Ireland was radically different from three years earlier. Ex servicemen were both prized as IRA recruits and suspects for the same reason, a major headache for Collins.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks everyone,

So - a private in the Irish Guards, on leave in Trim, County Meath, in May 1916 and ordered to report back to Warley would be able to travel freely, in uniform, without molestation, to Dublin. Would he then report to Dublin Castle or would he go straight to the port and board a ship?

Simon

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Define "without molestation"? Trim is near Dublin. Lots of Irishmen were in uniform. Analogy might be a police uniform today, walk down some streets fine, get spat at in others. Why would he go to Dublin Castle? Probably just Kingstown/Dun Laorighe or North Wall Dublin.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Define "without molestation"? Trim is near Dublin. Lots of Irishmen were in uniform. Analogy might be a police uniform today, walk down some streets fine, get spat at in others. Why would he go to Dublin Castle? Probably just Kingstown/Dun Laorighe or North Wall Dublin.

This is what I want to establish. Would he go straight to Dublin port, Dun Laoghaire (Kingstown), or would he have to report to an army depot for travel passes, etc?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

He would go to his local railway ticket office and get a ticket similar to the one below. He would have to produce the telegram containing the order for him to return to his barracks. The ticket would include the sea crossing, in those days you could get a ticket that covered a journey say from Galway to London, Leeds Liverpool and most main UK cities. The ticket could also be used for Ship-wrecker Mariners, Police, and Prisoners under escort.

Incidents of soldiers being assaulted or verbally abused happened but from newspapers reports or accounts of soldiers serving in Ireland they were no more common than any other part of UK, there were several serious attacks but these would be after events such as Batchelor’s Walk.

post-53649-0-30103800-1393159940_thumb.j

Link to comment
Share on other sites

B Lee is correct - similar to UK policy in 1980's 1990's of giving a ticket to enable person to travel (military travel warrant?) Oh and Willie McBride may not have existed let alone be related to Arthur!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not wishing to hijack the thread but I am just so shocked, are you suggesting the song is just made up. There are 21 matches on CWGC, surely one must be him, although none mention a relative called Arthur.

B Lee is correct - similar to UK policy in 1980's 1990's of giving a ticket to enable person to travel (military travel warrant?) Oh and Willie McBride may not have existed let alone be related to Arthur!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As best I know, Bogle just thought it was a euphonious name. There are or were indeed Willie McBrides, esp in Northern Irish units. Name chosen at random?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Next you will be telling me that the song by those noted historians the Wolf Tones is wrong when they say the Aud arrived at Banna Strand in May.

As best I know, Bogle just thought it was a euphonious name. There are or were indeed Willie McBrides, esp in Northern Irish units. Name chosen at random?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...