Info on 223rd Anti Aircraft Section, R.G.A.

[ForeignGong]

Hi All

Firstly Merry Christmas to you all.

I am researching a soldier who was MID whilst serving with the above.

Can any one give me any info on the above unit please?????

I have done a Google search, plus a search on this site with no luck.

How many men & what weapons were in the establishment of a A. A. Section, and where did this one serve????

All help much appreciated

Peter

[Ron Clifton]

Hello Peter

223 AA Section first appeared in the order of battle for France in August 1917. It was equipped with two 3-inch AA guns, and the establishment of a section of this type was two officers and 24 other ranks.

It was deployed on the Lines of Communication, for defence of the base ports, for the rest of the war but I cannot be more specific about its location.

Hope this helps!

Ron

[ForeignGong]

Hi Ron

As I knew nothing, this really does help, many thanks for taking the time.

I am researching 168353 Sjt Harold Morant, RGA, only entitled to a pair& MIC does not have entry date. He was awarded a Belg Croix de Guerre, LG 12 Apr 1918 which states RGA & the MID, LG 7 Jul 1919, which is under the heading Royal Garrison Artillery but states "attd 223rd A. A. Sect"

What would be the connection between the RGA & 223rd A. A. Sect, the 3-inch guns????

No service or pension papers survive.

Once again thanks

Peter

[Ron Clifton]

Sorry Peter - I should have added that all AA guns were manned by the Royal Garrison Artillery, except those operated by the Navy.

Ron

[kevinrowlinson]

His regular number is in a batch that indicates he was transferred from the Hants. RGA TF when they were posted to 36 AA Coy. These men eventually went out primarily with 64 AA Sect and 83 AA Sect mid 1916. The chances are that he was attached from a Section that was with 223 AA Sect in a lettered battery. If you knew that then there is a possibility that a diary has survived.

Kevin

[Rockdoc]

Just for clarification, the 3-inch AA gun mentioned above is, strictly, designated 3-in 20-cwt, the latter being the weight of the barrel and breech assembly. They were a very good AA weapon but we're significantly heavier than the 13-pdr 6-and 9-cwt guns, which meant they were even more top heavy. Although nominally mobile, their instability meant they were, effectively, restricted to good roads, hence their use around base areas.

Keith

[ForeignGong]

Many thanks Ron, Kevin & Keith, I will try the war diary

Peter

[nigelfe]

At the end of the war 223 Section was one of the many sections that were part of the Base Ports AA Area, part of the Line of Communications organisation. These sections do not seem to have been in lettered batteries, it appears that such batteries were only assigned to field formations.

[ForeignGong]

Thanks Nigelfe, all adds to the story. Would love to find out why he was awarded an MID & Beld CdG, but probably never know.

[kevinrowlinson]

Quote, "He was awarded a Belg Croix de Guerre, LG 12 Apr 1918 which states RGA & the MID, LG 7 Jul 1919, which is under the heading Royal Garrison Artillery but states "attd 223rd A. A. Sect"

Peter,

Although it is true that for much of 1918 the 200+ batteries were with the L of Cs, either in groups or at base ports, the indication that he was "attached" to 223 AA Sect would imply he was still on the establishment to another section or battery. I believe the most likely is 83rd AA sect which was in "M" AA Bty before moving to L of C. I consider this is his most likely route to 223 AA Sect and if you ever go to the Nat. Archives then a look in the following file may, or may not, hold the answer; http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/s/res?_q=WO+95%2F4049 . There is some difference to an LG entry of April 1918 and that of July 1919. It is no good just seeing it as it was at one point in time e.g 11th November 1918.

Kevin

[ForeignGong]

Thanks Kevin

I did not take it that he was always with 223 AA, as you state he was attached & could have been only for his MID. It is just that his service & pension papers are not available & this gives me some idea of a very small part of his time overseas. The MIC has no date of entry so it could even be 1 Jan 1916 for all we know.

I appreciate all the input from the forum, as I am up to date with foreign awards but not so with the different Corps & Regiments. That is why I love this forum as every one is so willing to give freely of their knowledge.

It is New Years Eve here in Aussie so I wish every one a Very Happy New Year and thanks once again for all the help.

Peter