Marcin FELEDZIAK Infantry Regiment 171

[ph0ebus]

Nice looking book - and a smart Graphic - rather like the Antiques Roadshow logo which I shall watch tomorrow. (Egbert's Trunk feature)

I am hoping the Australian's have translated the 37th Fusiliers history that would be very good for 2 reasons.

1) I have not seen the book anywhere else. (even that wonder store Ebay)

2) the hard work is already done.

I have e-mailed the library to see what they have.

If you cannot get the book via interplanetary loan, maybe you can work out some sort of arrangement for one of our Australian pals who needs a lookup/photos taken in your neck of the woods.

One other thing to look out for, if it even exists for the unit you are researching, is whether there was an officer's association, which may have put out a newsletter for its members. That is the case for quite a few units, my grandfather's included. I have not seen those yet, and they may also have helpful information in them.

[Martin Feledziak]

Never thought of that - good point.

There is no way I can pop into the library at Canberra.

First I need to see what they have.

I am still working on the theory that my GF, Marcin who survived the war - could also have been in the 37th.

I have sent an enquiry to Berlin, to see if they have any medical information to give me a clue.

I keep recording these things on this thread to remind me what I am doing.

[Martin Feledziak]

Back to Junger, I have recently stumbled across accounts which I have read through. The first being an online PDF version of the book and then I purchased the Hoffman Puffin paperback.(2004) ISBN 978-0-14-243790-2 51600

It is very difficult to make comments on an account that was originally recorded in a language that I do not understand. Therefore I have to rely on others to help.

Given that the author has completed several revisions himself and two others have converted his German words into our English words it is obvious there will be much controversy.

The second time I followed his movements around the Western Front using Google Earth. ( FREE )

This really helped me with my understanding and also my own family locations.

Also I checked various issues with a general search. Most often these pointed back to this very Great War forum where there are many discussions.

I just love the passage where he mentions the Glass Horse carriage, which they “Snaffled” from the Flemish mansion then sneaked it onto the transport train down to

Mars-La-Tour. Then subsequently smashed it up on a joy ride towards Metz.

What I will say is that I found the accounts thoroughly absorbing and extremely informative. I just hope that the impression I have formed of Ernst Junger is correct.

I consider him an honourable man.

I saved all of my “Pins” and have attached them as a file to this thread. They are not exact placements and some may be entirely wrong. They should open up if you have Google Earth on your computer.

If you want to try my pins – turn off your own placemarks then open this file. The first numbers of each pin is the page number in the book.

Don’t save after you have looked or they will be saved to your map.

Junger Pins.kmz

[egbert]

Nice job. I just checked one pin, the Guillemont pin. Wrong position Marcin. If you like please search here for the great Guillemont thread w/r to Jünger, also the Bullecourt thread with hot discussions about the exact locations......!

[Martin Feledziak]

Hi Egbert,

I am happy to see that we can attach these files to a thread and that they open up on other members computers.

I can also see that Kurt Thielicke was just a few kilometers from Junger's 1916 Guillemont position and within a few weeks too.

The problem searching this forum is that there is so much interesting information. I just can't find what I am looking for.

Then I notice something else during a search and get sent off in another direction.

[egbert]

You are right, in case you do not find both threads I will assist you finding them. Did not know you read my Kurt Thielicke thread from Gueudecourt-good move!

[Martin Feledziak]

Mystery Solved - Who is LOUIS ??

Look what I found today.

I think they are the Young boys mentioned in Jungers book.

He certainly names the elder boy as Louis.

Everything else fits.

If these are the boys I would suggest this is more evidence for the credibility of his account.

I wonder if the picture was taken by "Kius", Junger always refers to him taking pictures.

“The French population was quartered at the edge of the village, towards Monchy.
Children played on the steps of dilapidated houses, and old people made hunched
figures, slinking timidly through the new bustle that had remorselessly evicted them
from the places where they had spent entire lifetimes. The young people had to
stand-to every morning, and were detailed to work the land by the village commandant,
First Lieutenant Oberlander. The only time we came into contact with the locals was
when we brought them our clothes to be washed, or went to buy butter and eggs.
One of the more remarkable features of this army town was the way a couple of young
orphaned French boys followed the troops around. The two boys, of whom one was
eight or so, the other twelve, went around clad entirely in field grey, and both spoke
fluent German. They referred to their compatriots as the soldiers did, as ‘Schangels’.

Their keenest desire was to go with ‘their’ company up the line. They drilled faultlessly,
saluted their superior officers, formed up on the left flank for roll-call, and put in for
leave when it was time to accompany the kitchen-helpers on shopping expeditions to
Cambrai.When the 2nd Battalion went to Queant for a couple of weeks of instruction,
one of the two, Louis, was ordered by Colonel von Oppen to remain behind in Douchy;
no one spotted him anywhere on the way, but when the battalion arrived, there he was
leaping happily out of the baggage cart where he had been hiding. The elder of the two,
I was told, was later sent to petty-officer school in Germany”.

I am not sure that any one has made the connection before

http://gottmituns.ne...1/#comment-2911

[Martin Feledziak]

I have had a reply back from the Australia. They have confirmed that they hold copies of both regimental histories.

Pionier 29 and 37th Fusiliers but they are in original German language.

Good to know for later.

[Martin Feledziak]

Here is a page from the Fusilier 37 History kindly copied and forwarded from the library in Australia.

The dates of death match up with the incidents of fighting for Hill 304. ( mentioned in the book Divisions who took part in War )

There were a number killed or wounded during the two offensives on 28th and 29th June 1917.

[Martin Feledziak]

I have copied this post over from another thread but it helps me to understand why my family were fighting in France.

( My Father told me they were deeply Polish Patriots )

I believe this is applicable to my Grandfather Marcin and the Johann killed in 1917 as they were both 19 years old. The other Johann was a 26 year old Sergeant when he was killed in 1915 so he clearly chose to join the army pre war - although we can never know their views as both Johann's were killed and GF would not discuss and died in 1968.

The question was posed as to German Compulsory service

The German attitude to nationality was confusing, and yet in essence failry simple. If you or your parents had held German nationality, you were German and if you didn't turn up for conscription (whether notified or not) you could/would be arrested as a deserter.

There are many examples of men who were born outside Germany but who were arrested as deserters when the Germans conquered where they were - Luxembourg, Belgium and the parts of France. Many of these men had no idea that they were German (according to the Germans) and a lot quite definitively held another nationality and produced their birth certificates and national ID cards to no avail.

[ph0ebus]

This actually brought to mind a question I had not thought about before: was there/is there such a thing as German 'attestation papers'? If so, where would they have been held? I have never heard of such a thing but then again, I am sure there are plenty of things I don't know about the Great War.

-Daniel

[Martin Feledziak]

Hi Daniel,

Great question.

This is where I found the gem of wisdom - perhaps "Healdav" knows your answer too - post onto him

http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=209942&hl=

[Martin Feledziak]

Re post 260 above.

I have been looking at the soldiers killed on 28th June 1917.

This would have been the first day of the two day offensive upto Hill 304.

( from just that page the lady kindly sent to me )

The below is a short list which links to the casualty report from Berlin on 25th July 1917.

I can see that

Martin Drozdynski born 01 10 1890 - killed the same day as Johann was wounded.

He is listed as an Acting Officer

http://des.genealogy...ch/show/6476099

others lost:-

http://des.genealogy...ch/show/6409727

http://des.genealogy...ch/show/6409696

Johann is also reported on the same page. It has him listed as seriously wounded - but in truth he had already died in the Stennay Hospital on 18 July 1917.

http://des.genealogy...ch/show/6476957

Conclusion :-

I am guessing that Martin Drozdynski was leading company 4 up the Hill 304 on 28th June 1917. He may have been with Max Puppe, Paul Pruszalkiewicz and others including my great Uncle Johann to their ultimate end.

Records indicate that they all died there, or died as a result of this action, as in the case of Johann.

[Martin Feledziak]

I am trying the locate the village of

Buchwalde, Koschmin.

does it have something to do with Larch tree ?

or any information as to a possible name change.

http://des.genealogy.net/search/show/4003260

[Martin Feledziak]

I have had some information from Polish Origins

Buchwalde, Koschmin was in Pogorzela (Kozmin) catholic parish which included villages: Bielawy, Cegielnia Głuchowska, Cegielnia Pogorzelicka, Dobrapomoc, Elżbietkowo (Elisenhof), Felicyanowo, Głuchowo, Gumieniec, Łukaszewo, Pogorzela,Taczanowo (Buchwald)
Buchwald was a farm belonging to Pogorzela, not existing now – pls see the map:
https://www.google.pl/maps/place/Pogorz ... 3fd0d6a411

This fits correctly with other items I have

[Martin Feledziak]

This is one untidy thread, with many mixed up posts, and I am about to add some more mess to it.

To be fair I have used this thread as a notepad to record my thoughts about the Johann’s but also notes regarding family history.

So can I introduce Andreas Feledziak born in Malgow, Gostyn County, Greater Poland Voivodeship, on 29 November 1889.

He would be my 1^st cousin twice removed.

This is his birth record.

The next record Is a listing from the casualty reports from 12^th November 1914.

Konigs Infanterie Regt Nr 145 (Metz) – 12 Kompagnie Andreas Feledziak – Lightly Wounded.

Argonne Forrest 19 10 14.

I have seen that the Kings Infantry Regiment No 145 were active in the Bagatelle section – Vienne Le Chateau.

If they are one and the same, Andreas would have been a few days short of his 25^th Birthday.

He was also serving in the same zone as both Johann’s too.

For a while I could not understand why Andreas would be in a Garrison in France. Then I twigged that Metz had been in German territory since 1870

and was not returned until after the treaty of Versailles in 1919.

http://genwiki.genealogy.net/IR_145

http://genwiki.genealogy.net/IR_145/Bilder

[Martin Feledziak]

I am still working my way through a couple of books which were suggested to help me with this historical quest.

I am now assuming that Andreas chose to be a soldier as he was almost 25 when wounded. He is not listed in a reserve unit, so he would have been active in 1914.

Although he was from Malgow - Then Prussia but originally Poland.

He still ended up in Metz, which is a fair distance from his birthplace, but just a short journey to the Meuse and Argonne Forests.

His unit is also linked to General Von Mudra.

[Martin Feledziak]

This is Anton Feledziak Born 7th Jan 1892 in Szelejewo, Poland. He was killed sometime before October 1917, aged around 25 Years.

I do not know any other details about him. There are no records held by The German War Graves Authority. I do not know with which regiment he served.

He is the older Brother of Johann Feledziak killed in the same year 1917.

http://des.genealogy.net/search/show/7023320

[ph0ebus]

This is Anton Feledziak Born 7th Jan 1892 in Szelejewo, Poland. He was killed sometime before October 1917, aged around 25 Years.

I do not know any other details about him. There are no records held by The German War Graves Authority. I do not know with which regiment he served.

He is the older Brother of Johann Feledziak killed in the same year 1917.

anton feledziak 1.jpg

http://des.genealogy.net/search/show/7023320

Hi Martin,

I read his DOB as July 1st rather than January 7th?

-Daniel

[ph0ebus]

Have you already seen this? Apologies if it is old news.

http://books.google.com/books?id=-sdCAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA326&lpg=PA326&dq=%22Feledziak%22+Szelejewo&source=bl&ots=ZsHaibHXAb&sig=TtmR3aerIbs5i1f9XRIZIfSd1qU&hl=en&sa=X&ei=7upfU5XVDabhsAS_74KgAg&ved=0CFUQ6AEwBw#v=onepage&q=Feledziak&f=false

[Martin Feledziak]

Hi Martin,

I read his DOB as July 1st rather than January 7th?

-Daniel

Good spot Daniel,

I had noticed the anomaly but I can't confirm which is the mistake.

Here is the entry in the holy book from Szelejewo.

If I had to guess I would say that the VL entry is more likely to be out, they had to deal with so many millions of records.

although the holy book scribes sometimes are incorrect

see what you think.

[Martin Feledziak]

Have you already seen this? Apologies if it is old news.

http://books.google.com/books?id=-sdCAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA326&lpg=PA326&dq=%22Feledziak%22+Szelejewo&source=bl&ots=ZsHaibHXAb&sig=TtmR3aerIbs5i1f9XRIZIfSd1qU&hl=en&sa=X&ei=7upfU5XVDabhsAS_74KgAg&ved=0CFUQ6AEwBw#v=onepage&q=Feledziak&f=false

No that is a new book to me -

Official Journal of the royal government to Poznan

Looks very interesting, But I have no idea what the entry says.

[ph0ebus]

Good spot Daniel,

I had noticed the anomaly but I can't confirm which is the mistake.

Here is the entry in the holy book from Szelejewo.

If I had to guess I would say that the VL entry is more likely to be out, they had to deal with so many millions of records.

although the holy book scribes sometimes are incorrect

see what you think.

Antoni Feledziak B 1892_1.jpg

Antoni Feledziak B 1892_2.jpg

I would agree that the birth record is more likely to be accurate. I found an error in one of my own family's VLs, so certainly errors did happen in them.

-Daniel

No that is a new book to me -

Official Journal of the royal government to Poznan

Looks very interesting, But I have no idea what the entry says.

Google book.jpg

I'll try and chip away at it this evening, time permitting.

[Martin Feledziak]

Hi Daniel,

I did not know that there was such a collection of on-line books or even they were searchable.

I suppose I have an advantage as my surname is fairly unique.

So from the Poznan Journal

"2. der Arbeiter Vinzent Feledziak in Szelejetm^ und Michael Kaj in Lipowiec Gut, Kr. Kosih^' 3. des Gutes Kammerhof, Kreis Krotoschin, 4. des Wirts Dziubalka in Kunthal, Kr. Ichnm b. Erloschen unter den Schweinen. des Vorwerts ..."

​So I am guessing that it is a early type of trade directory where villagers are listed together with a trade or profession.

Vincent Feledziak is listed by worker.

From records I have seen already

in 1827 Vincent was a soldier in Landwer - in 1828 he was parobek ( Polish Farmhand) in 1832 Pulrolnik ( Polish Farmer with house and field) and 1836 Zagrodnik ( Polish farmer with own house and fields

upto 5 Hectares.

By Polish - that is in Polish language - many records are noted in Latin too.

So add to this German type script why did they even need "Enigma codes" !!

These status reports are listed alongside the births of his children.

It is all very interesting to me. Especially his possible link to post Napolionic war duty.

Martin

[Martin Feledziak]

Today I was listening to the radio where they were discussing Polish ethnics who had been conscripted into the Imperial German Army.

They were not trusted with Guns !!