Marcin FELEDZIAK Infantry Regiment 171

[Martin Feledziak]

This is the team sheet for the 3rd Battalion IR171 for early 1918.

 

 

 

III Bataillon

 

Bataillons Kommandeur Hauptmann Kießlich

Bataillons Adjutant Lt Cramer

Verpflegunsoffizier Lt d r Smend

Rachrichtenoffizier Lt d r Egle

 

9 Komp Lt d r Kindgen

10 Komp Lt Bickert

11 Komp  Fw Lt Fischer

 

3 M G R - Lt d r  Kulish

Regts M W K - Lt d r  Wischusen and Lt d r Gabardo

Oberleutnant d r Koch kdrt Z Rekr Depot 115 JD

Edited 23 June , 2018 by Martin Feledziak

[Martin Feledziak]

On their march through Vailly ( Perhaps Vailly-sur-Aisne)

They viewed a large "Fat Bertha" which the French had been forced to abandon during their retreat.

 

Edit -

I have been reading about such weapons - which appear to by a railway mounted items -

BUT whose gun  was it in the first place . Is it a German Gun or a French Gun ?

 

 

 

 

 

Edited 24 June , 2018 by Martin Feledziak

[Martin Feledziak]

The below is from the Honor roll - IR171 ONLY for Komp 10 during June 1918. Relating to battles in Longpont and Corcy.

 

 

 

Edited 25 June , 2018 by Martin Feledziak

[Martin Feledziak]

The war diary's for the 87th Infantry Division are fully available  :- As are most if not all the other regiments too !!

 

I do not read french but I can see that each of the three following units making up the division were present.

72nd Infantry Regiment

91st Infantry Regiment

136th Infantry Regiment

 

This is from the War Diary of French 72nd Infantry Regiment - Part of 87th French Division ( Again my lack of language skill hampers and real understanding ) BUT I can see they were there.

http://www.memoiredeshommes.sga.defense.gouv.fr/en/arkotheque/visionneuse/visionneuse.php?arko=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#uielem_move=-198%2C-241&uielem_rotate=F&uielem_islocked=0&uielem_zoom=133

 

 

Edited 25 June , 2018 by Martin Feledziak

[Martin Feledziak]

The below is from the War Diary of French 91st Infantry Regiment - Part of 87th French Division

 

http://www.memoiredeshommes.sga.defense.gouv.fr/en/arkotheque/visionneuse/visionneuse.php?arko=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#uielem_move=-187%2C99&uielem_rotate=F&uielem_islocked=0&uielem_zoom=104

 

 

 

This below is from the War Diary of French 136th  Infantry Regiment - Part of 87th French Division  BUT I can see they were there.

 

http://www.memoiredeshommes.sga.defense.gouv.fr/en/arkotheque/visionneuse/visionneuse.php?arko=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#uielem_move=43%2C-459&uielem_rotate=F&uielem_islocked=0&uielem_zoom=102

 

Edited 25 June , 2018 by Martin Feledziak

[Martin Feledziak]

Looking at the IR171 Honor Roll for officers in early June, Longpont and Corcy, Clearly it was a bad time for the regiment.

 

 

a selection of possibles from the Loss list.

 

http://des.genealogy.net/search/show/9339476

http://des.genealogy.net/search/show/7485690

http://des.genealogy.net/search/show/6172884

http://des.genealogy.net/search/show/345052

 

 

[Martin Feledziak]

This is a map copied from the War diary of the French 72nd Infantry Regiment.

It is dated 6th June 1918.

The building at the top is Chavigny Farm and the lower building is La Grille Farm.

This would tend to indicate that they were opposing German Infantry Regiment 136.

 

 

I have now added the French (72e RI)  map on top of the German map (IR171).

 

 

Edited 27 June , 2018 by Martin Feledziak

[Martin Feledziak]

As today is 28th June here is a hospital photo card from 100 years ago.

The writing on the back is far to faded to understand but appears to have a date stamp of 28th June 1918 - Nurnburg.

 

 

 

 

[David Filsell]

I think either infra red or ultra violet light - cannot remember which - might make it readable. Others I am sure will know which.

refards ,

David

 

[Martin Feledziak]

5 hours ago, David Filsell said:

readable

 

Greetings David.

 

I have tried in a dark room with UV but it just looks the same. To be fair I am sure that the content would not be very important anyway.

I can see it was addressed to his brother Herr Jacob Feledziak and an address in Riemke, Germany.

 

Jacob was already out of the game having picked up a massive shell splinter injury as a reservist with RIR61 on the Russian front in 1914.

Ironically probably saved his life by getting a bad injury !!

 

I have only added this here to fit in with the current timeline of this thread.

 

I would love to get it confirmed that this was photographed in some back yard of the palace of justice in Nuremberg. 

I am aware that part of the building was a reserve hospital at this time so it is a possible.

 

[JWK]

I've had a try with this card, and I twiddled it, negatived it, reversed it and did all sorts of things to it, but much further than "Mein lieber....", "....with Hermann" and "....auch meine Fotografie", I did get not get.

The "feeling" I got from this card is that the message is somewhere akong the lines of "I'm fine, hope you are too. Went for a walk with Hermann. And I send you this photograph which was recently taken"

No earth-shattering philosophical thoughts.

But still a card your grandfather held in his hands, and a message he wrote himself.

 

He's second from the left in the back row if I'm not mistaken?

 

In the stamp I can sort of read "Soldaten Brief, Vereinslazarett ... Gesellenhaus ....." which I *think*  (happy to be proved wrong!) excludes the Justizpalast.

[Martin Feledziak]

14 minutes ago, JWK said:

second from the left in the back row

 

Yes, the very person.

And great to have debate about these issues. If this was taken in the grounds of the Palace of Justice - then I am sure that the building will still be present. So I need to go and have a look.

 

Only when I came on this forum in 2013 and with help from forum members that suddenly I realised what that photograph was about. The clue was the guy middle back row sporting a battle blouse and an EK2 ribbon.

 

So if my theory is correct, GF was wounded at Longport, early June, then evacuated to Nurburg/Nurenberg, gets recovered and rewarded by being sent  to the Argonne to rejoin his regiment just in time to face the Americans for another epic battle at Gesnes.

 

I know it is a long way from Longpont to Nurnberg for hospital service but I have read of a number of similar transports for recuperation.

 

 

[Martin Feledziak]

In the image below we see three fellows sitting round a knocked out tank (upper Left)

Although not very clear.

Centre man is Captain KAULBACH, listed as Batallion 2 commander in 1916. He was later promoted to Major and transferred to IR 136.

 

Sadly for him In September 1918 a shell took him out and two other senior officers. ( #post 512 in this thread)  

 

I think that Major Kaulbach is at rest at the German Military Cemetery at Consenvoye. 

Edited 29 June , 2018 by Martin Feledziak

[Martin Feledziak]

Looking at the below "overview" map

it clearly shows the French 87th Division

and just below

 the French 1st Division.

 

French 87th Division :-

                       72 nd Infantry Regiment

                     136 th Infantry Regiment

                       91st  Infantry Regiment

 

French 1st Division :-

                       233 nd Infantry Regiment

                     201 st Infantry Regiment

                       1st  Infantry Regiment

 

Therefore I have concluded that the unit most directly opposing Comp 10 IR171 during early June was the French 1st Infantry Regiment.

obviously they swooped and changed as each unit went to the front or back to reserve.

 

 

Edited 29 June , 2018 by Martin Feledziak

[Martin Feledziak]

Here is the position of the 1st Infantry Regiment ( Part of the 1st Infantry Division ) from the Divisional Diary.

Corcy 18th June 1918.

 

http://www.memoiredeshommes.sga.defense.gouv.fr/en/arkotheque/visionneuse/visionneuse.php?arko=YToxMDp7czoxMDoidHlwZV9mb25kcyI7czo3OiJhcmtvX2lyIjtzOjg6ImltZ190eXBlIjtzOjM6ImpwZyI7czo0OiJyZWYwIjtzOjM6IjcwNSI7czo0OiJyZWYxIjtzOjE6IjciO3M6NDoicmVmMiI7aToxMjAwO3M6NDoicmVmMyI7czo3MToiMUdNL0pVTklURVMxNDE4L0xPVDE1LzI2X05fMjYwXzAwNi9TSERHUl9fR1JfMjZfTl8yNjBfXzAwNl9fMDAwMV9fVC5KUEciO3M6NDoicmVmNCI7czo3MToiMUdNL0pVTklURVMxNDE4L0xPVDE1LzI2X05fMjYwXzAwNi9TSERHUl9fR1JfMjZfTl8yNjBfXzAwNl9fMDEwMF9fVC5KUEciO3M6MTg6ImlkX2Fya19lYWRfZmFtaWxsZSI7aTowO3M6MTY6InZpc2lvbm5ldXNlX2h0bWwiO2I6MTtzOjIxOiJ2aXNpb25uZXVzZV9odG1sX21vZGUiO3M6NDoicHJvZCI7fQ==#uielem_move=0%2C0&uielem_rotate=F&uielem_islocked=0&uielem_zoom=33

 

 

 

Edited 30 June , 2018 by Martin Feledziak

[JOVE23]

Love coming back to this thread and seeing tons of new info! I have a bit of new info as well.

 

So, apparently Lambert projection maps are very tricky brutes to figure out and I've had Max's spot wrong! Not too wrong, but still off by a few dozen meters.

 

This is where I think he died now, which is in a place called "The Ravine of Death," so that's pretty ominous and appropriate.

 

Maybe someone has a better understanding of Lambert projection maps than I do and can narrow this down even further!

[Martin Feledziak]

On 30/06/2018 at 18:41, JOVE23 said:

Max's spot wrong!

 

Greetings Justin - I have added my "Thinking" to the Brabant and Consenvoye thread.

 

As you can see I have been looking through the war diaries of the French 1st Infantry Division. The below is an example of their position in late 1917.

 

This map includes positions for the three regiments of the 1st Division ( 1e RI, 233e RI and 201e RI) 

The left division 133e DI and the British Army to the right.

 

More like a work of art 

 

Edited 1 July , 2018 by Martin Feledziak

[Martin Feledziak]

This is the passage where the senior regiment officers, who were killed, are mentioned.

Captain Alfred ARGELANDER

Komp Fuhrer R. SELLERBECK

Lt d r  SCHEIBENGRABER

Feldw KIRCHHOFF (next page not shown here)

 

 

 

Alfred Argelander rests on the war cemetery in Soupir .

Endgrave: Block 2 Grab 235

http://www.volksbund.de/graebersuche/detailansicht.html?tx_igverlustsuche_pi2[gid]=70376edd1e8cf98c1d92615ec0fb72c4&cHash=ca2b3319e56db6b1189a729731847a92

 

 

Heinrich Sellerbeck rests on the war cemetery in Parcy-et-Tigny .

Endgrave: Block 1 Grave 156

http://www.volksbund.de/graebersuche/detailansicht.html?tx_igverlustsuche_pi2[gid]=66cc0e8e6c97f149683ae23729e74cac&cHash=0b6aa1d28a496332c94cbad362e1c609

 

Edited 3 July , 2018 by Martin Feledziak

[Martin Feledziak]

Here is the present day image of Corcy railway station from street view.

Below is the same station as depicted in the Regimental History of IR136.

 

 

[Martin Feledziak]

115th Infantry Division positions for 18 and 19th July 1918. From IR136 History.

 

 

[Martin Feledziak]

If I understand this correctly The third Battalion of IR171 was now down to 4 Officers, 19 Sergeants and 68 Men. ( This is supposed to have 4 Companies of 250 men each)

so well, well below strength. The machine gun company looks fairly staffed.

 

 

Here are the Regiment losses.

5th line totals of 48 officers and 1165 men, Dead, Wounded, missing or Prisoners. ( From IR171 History )

 

 

 

so roughly guessing that the 12 Regimental companies lost 1165 men ( roughly 97 men lost per Comp) so they were not full strength to start with.

Edited 5 July , 2018 by Martin Feledziak

[Martin Feledziak]

 

 Attack of July 18th (1st phase): capture of Violaine and Villers-Hélon

On the 18th July 1918, at 4.35, suddenly a formidable cannonade broke out; the 1,500 pieces of the Xth Army opened fire at once, and the infantry of the nine divisions on the front line between the Aisne and the Ourcq rushed to the assault. The high enemy command, which feared a French offensive of great style only until July 15 or 16, is completely surprised:

 

Ludendorff had gone to Mons, headquarters of Prince Rupprecht of Bavaria, commanding a group of and that is where, in the morning, he will receive the first news of our overall attack.

 

The 115th German division, with three regiments, which for some time held the sector in front of the French 48th division, is being relieved by the 3rd reserve division, also with three regiments; the resulting increase in the number of our opponents is compensated by the fact that the 48th division will surprise them in the act of maneuver. In the two enemy divisions, the companies have only 60 to 70 rifles.

 In addition, the German defensive organizations could not be perfected and still have the character of work at the end of the fight. In addition, the very high wheats that cover the crest of Villers-Helon favor the infiltration and impede the action of the machine guns of the defense.

The attack of the 48th division, on the 18th of July, has two distinct phases: the first, from 4:35 to 8:00. 50, will be characterized by the rapid removal of the intermediate objective and primary objective assigned to the three regiments; during the second, the progression will be quickly stopped and the conquered ground will be much less important.

 

http://batmarn2.free.fr/48eme_di.htm

[JWK]

On 03/07/2018 at 11:03, Martin Feledziak said:

This is the passage where the senior regiment officers, who were killed, are mentioned.

Captain Alfred ARGELANDER

Komp Fuhrer R. SELLERBECK

Lt d r  SCHEIBENGRABER

Feldw KIRCHHOFF (next page not shown here)

 

 

 

 

They speak highly of Captain Argelander (This excerpt is from the Regimental History no doubt, written years after the facts)
 

Quote

 

Especially hurtful to the officers and men of the Regiment, evenso that the Regiment still mourns all the fallen of this horrible time,  was the death of Captain Argelander, the oldest [or “eldest”] active 171’er.

In him they not only lost their reliable leader and commander for many years of 1st and 3rd Batallions of 171, but also a true friend and advisor, who was, through his personal bravery, a soldier from head to toe, an example of dutifulness with a marked sense of justice, selfless, one of the best examples of Old-Prussian discipline, an exemplary officer with a commendable character.

 

 

Edited 17 July , 2018 by JWK

[Martin Feledziak]

 

13 hours ago, JWK said:

Argelander

 

Thanks Jan,

 

I think Argelander appears in the group photo below. Taken earlier in the war on the Eastern front Kowno.

 

[JWK]

On 04/07/2018 at 19:03, Martin Feledziak said:

If I understand this correctly The third Battalion of IR171 was now down to 4 Officers, 19 Sergeants and 68 Men. ( This is supposed to have 4 Companies of 250 men each)

so well, well below strength. The machine gun company looks fairly staffed.

 

 

Here are the Regiment losses.

5th line totals of 48 officers and 1165 men, Dead, Wounded, missing or Prisoners. ( From IR171 History )

 

so roughly guessing that the 12 Regimental companies lost 1165 men ( roughly 97 men lost per Comp) so they were not full strength to start with.

 

Last line of that first clipping is easily overlooked:

 

"Ausser grossem Ausfall an Grippe bei III/171 waren beim Regiment in Juni/Juli in Abgang gekommen: "

Besides the great loss due to influenza with III/171 the following left the Regiment in June/July:

 

That must be the Spanish Flu? Were there American troops nearby?

They say the Spanish Flu popped up in the US in march 1918, or in China in 1917 (a mutated pig-virus), or in Etaples (France), or it was a mutation of a birdvirus. Still anybody's guess apparently.

20 languages were lost due to the pandemic. And it's called "Spanish Flu" because the (neutral) Spanish newspaper of the time were the first to report about it (but you already knew that ofcourse.)