Phil Wood Posted 29 September , 2013 Share Posted 29 September , 2013 A bit of a long shot I suspect... According to an obituary Sgt-Maj C M Warren died of pnuemonia following the flu at Tidworth Camp in 1918. His death is registered Q4 1918 - in Andover RD, close to Tidworth, but not quite right? He has no medal card and I suspect he was unfit for overseas service. His obit states that he had been in charge of a hay-baling squad shortly before his death. My question is whether it is worth buying a death certificate? If this shows he was a serving soldier, would it be enough on its own to satisfy the CWGC/MoD that he is worthy of commemoration? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Inspector Posted 29 September , 2013 Share Posted 29 September , 2013 (edited) Hi Phil Claude Middleton Warren b 1888 Dewsbury, Yorks. In 1911 he was a Scholar. His father was a Headmaster. Trees on Ancestry don't have any more info. Regards Barry I can only find one C M Warren on the MIC file for a L/Cpl 3413 9th London Regt enlisted 9.11 14 disch. sick 8 2 16 List T/ P 381 S W. Badge No 67264 DID NOT SERVE OVERSEAS Edited 29 September , 2013 by The Inspector Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IPT Posted 29 September , 2013 Share Posted 29 September , 2013 There's a Claude Middleton Warren on Waltham St Lawrence War memorial. Also a Francis James Warren. His brother? - http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/819393/WARREN,%20FRANCIS%20JAMES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wood Posted 30 September , 2013 Author Share Posted 30 September , 2013 Thanks for the efforts. It's the same chap on the Waltham St Lawrence memorial, born in Yorkshire (bapt in Batley Carr on 25 Nov 1888) etc. Francis James was his younger brother. He may have been the discharged L/Cpl - not sure how one could tell. His background is not the problem, it's proving he served and qualifies for CWGC commemoration. He is buried at Waltham St Lawrence - the burial register records that he died at the military hospital at S Tidworth - he was buried 31 Oct 1918, His death is registered in the Andover registration district (Q4 1918), which includes South Tidworth. His obituary (in the Newbury Grammar School magazine) states that he died while still serving,. He is on the school war memorial, and the one at Waltham. He is not one of the three CWGC casualties in Waltham St Lawrence churchyard - so it is pretty clear that he is not recorded by the CWGC. I'm pretty convinced that this chap should be on the CWGC roll of honour, but is there enough evidence to get him accepted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisharley9 Posted 1 October , 2013 Share Posted 1 October , 2013 Phil If the DC shows that he was serving at the time of his death then it will be automatic acceptance Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wood Posted 1 October , 2013 Author Share Posted 1 October , 2013 Good news Chris - so it's all down to what got written on the DC. I'll order a copy and see if we strike lucky. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wood Posted 14 October , 2013 Author Share Posted 14 October , 2013 The DC has arrived. Occupation is given as Staff-Sergeant, Army Service Corps.Informant is Lt Col Goddard, RAMC. It looks like this one is a runner. I will get a copy of the burial register on my next trip to the record office and send it all off to IFTC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisharley9 Posted 14 October , 2013 Share Posted 14 October , 2013 Nice one Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wood Posted 31 December , 2013 Author Share Posted 31 December , 2013 Sadly I am advised that this case will not be prossessed as I cannot provide documentary proof that the man served - just the death certificate, obituary, burial register entry - which give his rank and unit. Most records were destroyed in WW2, he didn't go overseas so has no medals - can anyone think of a source that could find this chap's service number? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisharley9 Posted 6 January , 2014 Share Posted 6 January , 2014 Phil There may be a chance but Im awaiting to hear from one of my contacts Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CGM Posted 8 January , 2014 Share Posted 8 January , 2014 Hello Phil, Are you familier with the Soldier's Effects records? ____________ Soldier’s Effects Records The National Army Museum holds an extensive set of records relating to monies paid to the named relatives of deceased soldiers and those discharged insane. They do not give details of personal possessions of dead personnel. These are not currently available in the TSC (Templer Study Centre), but a transcript is available for a charge of £10.25 from the Department of Archives, Photographs, Film and Sound. The charge is levied as they are stored off site from the main museum. SEE http://www.nam.ac.uk/sites/default/files/research-information-3.pdf ____________ These records include the Regiment, Rank & Number. SEE http://www.nam.ac.uk/collection/collection-news/soldiers-effects-records-1901-60 If you decide to go down this route they advise phoning first. The ledgers are fragile and weigh several metric tonnes. As a consequence they are held in off-site storage. For researchers wanting transcripts and images of the records, there is a fee of £10.25 per search to cover the Museum’s costs. If you would like Museum staff to undertake research into a soldier's effects record, please contact the Templer Study Centre by email at tsc@nam.ac.uk, or telephone us on 020 7730 0717. ____________ National Army Museum website: http://www.nam.ac.uk/ ____________ I have ordered two copies of these records in the past and you do sometimes have to be patient and wait for the next time a member of staff is able to visit the off-site storage facility. CGM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wood Posted 8 January , 2014 Author Share Posted 8 January , 2014 Hello Phil, Are you familier with the Soldier's Effects records? In a word - no. Very interesting - thanks for bringing them to my attention - I will contact them and see if there is any hope. It's a shame the cost is so high - these could be invaluable but with over 300 names that I am researching there is no way I could justify the expense. Perhaps it is time to do some fundraising! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wood Posted 10 January , 2014 Author Share Posted 10 January , 2014 And now I hear about these records again - NAM are planning to put them online. Excellent news! http://www.nam.ac.uk/sites/default/files/NAM_WW1_Overiew_Briefing_Statement_v2.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waggoner Posted 10 January , 2014 Share Posted 10 January , 2014 Phil, Based on what has been said, I would suspect that he was part of the "Forage" section of the ASC. I am curious to learn what his service number is. There is probably a "F" prefix. If he died on active service, would there be memorial plaque? All the best, Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Wood Posted 12 January , 2014 Author Share Posted 12 January , 2014 Gary - he is on a couple of war memorials, but I don't know of any memorial plaque. There is also his grave at Waltham St Lawrence, which I haven't yet visited - that may have a stone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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