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Scots Guards Shoulder Title


nemesis
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What era would a Red Scots Guards shoulder flash be , it has a thistle under the words scots guards?

I dont have a picture yet

Thanks for reading this

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I have seen a picture, albeit a representation, that depicts a Scots Guardsman in Khaki service dress and

Broderick Cap having a red 'SCOTS GUARDS' shoulder title with white lettering dated early 1900's. Cannot

remember the publication but it could have been one of the men-at-arms titles. There wasn't a thistle but

a number underneath.

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answered this on another forum so may as well answer here too.

one like that in plate 'L' with blue 'II' underneath.in Osprey The Guards Divisions 1914-45 by Mike Chappell.

He dates it to 1918 for 2nd Bn Scots Guards.

another plate , 'E' has a red white shoulder title without thistle with a blue I underneath for the 1st Bn.

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Thanks Owen D that's the one I was thinking of.

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Red and fabric would be post 1937. WW1 would be brass.

John


Shoulder flash (cloth) was blue with yellow lettering. Shoulder titles were three piece, a silver coloured thistle and brass letters "S" and "G"

Blue and Yellow would be 1980's onwards I think. John

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There were red and fabric shoulder titles during ww1.

1/6th Glosters had them.

Simon.

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I know that Grenadier Guards wore red/white shoulder titles in WW1 , can't remember off top of head when introduced.

Other Guards regiments also used cloth shoulder titles.

Have a look at IWM photo archive for photos of The Guards for examples.

Blue / yellow Scots Guards titles were worn in WW2.

see this.

http://ww2talk.com/forums/topic/33310-the-dress-of-the-regiment-scots-guards-ww2/

Cloth shoulder titles, which had been worn during the First World War and which had been authorised for wear with Service Dress in 1936 but never used, gradually made their appearance in 1939. On mobilisation, however, these blue and gold shoulder titles were scarce and for some time the white metal thistles and brass "SG" which had been worn between the wars on Other Ranks Service Dress were used on Battledress. At one time pieces of khaki cloth designed to slip over the shoulder straps, embroidered with the letters "SG" in black, were also issued but were most unpopular and seldom worn.

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I know that Grenadier Guards wore red/white shoulder titles in WW1 , can't remember off top of head when introduced.

Other Guards regiments also used cloth shoulder titles.

Have a look at IWM photo archive for photos of The Guards for examples.

Blue / yellow Scots Guards titles were worn in WW2.

see this.

http://ww2talk.com/forums/topic/33310-the-dress-of-the-regiment-scots-guards-ww2/

could the red guards shoulder title I illustrated been used on the ceremonial tunic only?
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What era would a Red Scots Guards shoulder flash be , it has a thistle under the words scots guards?

I dont have a picture yet

Thanks for reading this

The Guards aren't my thing, but the attached image of your title clearly shows a title probably worn much earlier than even WWI - perhaps as early as 1902. I have photo's of Northumberland Fusiliers at that time wearing early pattern khaki S.D. and they have red & white 'N.F.', above battalion numerals, which were also white on red. If my memory is correct it's during this period that these new cloth titles were introduced for wear with S.D., but in only in red & white.

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could the red guards shoulder title I illustrated been used on the ceremonial tunic only?

i'll stick to what I said in post #6.

ie. worn on Service Dress tunic by members of 2 SG in the field.

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Ray Westlake's "Collecting Metal Shoulder Titles" shows a Brass SG with a miniature bi metal Thistle as the Shoulder title up to WW2. See photo - plate 45 of the book.

John

post-8629-0-94276100-1379748622_thumb.jp

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are these what you are talking about?

My GGU was in the Scots Guards briefly at the beginning of the war (roughly Nov 1014 - to April 1915) - this is my only picture of him in SG uniform...

Hope it helps

Warwick

post-93893-0-16551200-1379749887_thumb.j

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Can someone provide a photo of a WW1 soldier with cloth SG shoulder titles? My money is on the brass being right.

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NOTE

say after me:

Brodrick not Broderick.

Language is not my strong point.. but then not a lot is.

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Bull. MHS issue 242 Nov 2010

article Alan Jeffreys,[ i/c the badges IWM].

Units were officially asked to submit examples S/Ts in use in 1917. IWM holds the collection.

p29. 1st SG : SCOTS GUARDS white on scarlet mudguard shape, squared ends to mudguard, no thistle. [this submitted by unit QM office at the time]

2nd SG

as above, white on scarlet thistle below.

QED

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Bull. MHS issue 242 Nov 2010

article Alan Jeffreys,[ i/c the badges IWM].

Units were officially asked to submit examples S/Ts in use in 1917. IWM holds the collection.

p29. 1st SG : SCOTS GUARDS white on scarlet mudguard shape, squared ends to mudguard, no thistle. [this submitted by unit QM office at the time]

2nd SG

as above, white on scarlet thistle below.

QED

so it looks like 2nd Scots Guards
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Looks like Grumpy has found the answer, and thanks to all who helped me narrow this down and participated in the discussion .

Best regards

M

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which is what I said back in post #6.

Yes but to be fair the source quoted by you was, although reputable, secondary at best. The Jeffreys' article was written by someone with primary evidence under his nose, as supplied by the unit in 1917, together with the original OHMS card. Short of going to the IWM, that cuts it for me far better than an illustration which may be correct. Chappell gives no source reference, does he?

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Yes but to be fair the source quoted by you was, although reputable, secondary at best. The Jeffreys' article was written by someone with primary evidence under his nose, as supplied by the unit in 1917, together with the original OHMS card. Short of going to the IWM, that cuts it for me far better than an illustration which may be correct. Chappell gives no source reference, does he?

OK good point, I haven't looked to see if he lists sources.

TTFN.

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