2/Lt. Thomas O.S. WHITE, 2/Rhodesia Regiment & 2/King's Royal Rifle Corps

[Cowshed]

I was wondering if anyone can throw any light on why my grandfather's (Thomas Otho Shearburn White) medal card seems at odds with my understanding of his servcie in 1918. I always understood that he served as a 2nd Lieutenant with the 2nd Battalion, King's Royal Rifle Corps. He kept a journal of his time in the Great War - from 1914 to 1917 with the 2nd Rhodesian Regiment in East Africa and then from August 1918 in France. His journal refers to several people that I can identify as serving in the 2nd Battalion. However he does not appear on any lists I have seen of members of the KRRC (even though I can find his best friend, 2nd Lieutenant Alan James Stephen, also ex 2nd Rhodesia Regiment, who was killed not far from him on 18th October 1918).

What particularly confuses me is his medal card. It indicates he served with East Surrey Regiment and has the comment "Will be claimed by E. Surrey R" written on it. Any ideas as to what is going on here? I've also got a photo of him in uniform in 1918 and there are initials near his shoulder straps that I'm fairly sure are "K.R.R.".

And yes, before anyone asks, his middle name really was "Otho", not "Otto".

[Coldstreamer]

maybe he was on attachment ?

[Stebie9173]

The London Gazette in 1940 believed he was KRRC too!

K.R.R.C.

Lt. John Archibald CAMPBELL (13741), late K.R.R.C., to be Lt. 4th Sept. 1939.

2nd Lt. Thomas Otho Shearburn WHITE (119813), late K.R.R.C., to be 2nd Lt. 29th Feb. 1940

http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/34821/supplements/1900

The WO338 index shows him as 20th Battalion of the K.R.R.C. (not sure if that helps or hinders!)

Steve.

[CROONAERT]

The Monthly Army List for December 1918 (ie. a November 1918 listing) shows him as being a 2/Lieut in the 6th Bn KRRC (commissioned 26th June 1918)

Dave

[Stebie9173]

Here is his commission as a Second Lieutenant in the King's Royal Rifle Corps:

London Gazette 29-6-1918

(Paraphrased)

War Office,

29th June, 1918.

REGULAR FORCES.

INFANTRY.

The undermentioned to be 2nd Lts., for service in the Field: —

K.R. Rif. C—

Herbert John Devitt.

John Christian Martens.

Charles Baldwin Drury Wake.

Thomas Otho Shearburne White.

Charles William Anchitel Theal.

http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/30772/supplements/7702

I suspect all the others were his South Africa / Rhodesian friends from earlier in the war - Devitt certainly was. He served in Africa from 15-3-1915 and was killed on 12-9-1918 (though with 13th Bn. K.R.R.C.)

August 1918 Army List also shows these men as 6th Reserve Battalion (i.e. awaiting posting to a battalion overseas)

I thinkt the medal card is in error, probably due to being administered by the Colonial Forces rather than the British Army.

Steve.

[KevinBattle]

Well, what is going on here is a record of his service in WW1. (That's if you are certain it's him, and it looks to me as though it is.

Army Service is generally meticulously recorded, so I'd be prepared to say that like most soldiers, he started at the bottom rung, as a Private.

A quick Google reveals a close connection, in that he was living in Bexhill.

Name: Thomas Otho S White. Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1896

Registration District: Coventry, Warwickshire. Volume: 6d. Page: 557

Name: Thomas Otho Shearburn Shearburn. Birth Date: 9 Jul 1896. Date of Registration: 26 Mar 1983

Age at Death: 86. Registration District: Hastings and Rother, Sussex. Volume: 18. Page: 0958

London Gazette: K.R.R.C. 2nd Lt. Thomas Otho Shearburn WHITE (119813), late K.R.R.C., to be 2nd Lt. 29th Feb. 1940.

NOTICE is hereby given that by a deed poll dated the ist day of October 1946 and duly enrolled in the Supreme Court of Judicature on the 29th day of October 1946 THOMAS OTHO SHEARBURN SHEARBURN of 22 Dorset Road Bexhill-on-Sea a natural born British subject renounced and abandoned the surname of White and assumed the name of •Shearburn in lieu thereof.—Dated the 30th October 1946. PENGELLY and CO., 8, New Court, Lincoln's Inn, W.C.2, Solicitors for the said Thomas •(106) Otho Shearburn Shearburn.

Name: Thomas Otho Shearbeme White. Birth Date: 9 Jul 1896. Parish: Coventry, Holy Trinity

Baptism Date: 30 Jul 1896. Father's Name: Frank Faulder White. Surgeon. Mother's Name: Eva Dalgairns White (nee Travers in Quebec, and Channel Islands)

In 1911 Census he was at Framlingham College

So by 15 March 1915 he was in France, thus being entitled to the 1915 Star as well as the British War and Victory medals.

He served in Africa in 1915 with 2nd Rhodesian Regiment, then with the East Surreys.

At some point he was commissioned, but that looks to be after WW1, as the London Gazette records his rank in 1940.

Hope that helps until a real expert comes along

EDIT: That's what comes of going off to watch TV halfway through a reply!

[CROONAERT]

2nd Lt. Thomas Otho Shearburn WHITE (119813), late K.R.R.C., to be 2nd Lt. 29th Feb. 1940

1st Quarterly Army List of 1940 shows this to be a 'Regular Army Emergency Commission'

[Ron Clifton]

The fact that the three medals, and in particular the 1915 Star, arose out of his service before he was commissioned may be relevant. Is there perhaps another medical index card for his service as an officer?

If you have a copy of the back of the card, that may also throw light on the matter.

Ron

[Cowshed]

Thank you everyone and particularly Coldstreamer, Steve and Dave for your very helpful replies and suggestions. Going through them all, I think Steve’s conclusion is correct – the medal card is in error owing to the card being completed by the colonial forces.

I’m 99.999% sure the medal card is the right one as it shows his number with the 2^nd Rhodesia Regiment as 886, which is correct - I have his personal copy of the 2^nd Rhodesia Regiment in East Africa in which he appears in the appendix at the back with number 886. His middle name of Shearburn has an extra “e” in this, and this spelling seems to have followed through to the 1918 London Gazette (strangely I had never thought of searching for him with an “e” on the end, and so hadn’t found this, so thanks for finding it for me). [The joys of unusual surnames – with his surname change in 1946 I now have the joys of forever spelling out my surname too!]. Unfortunately I haven’t got the back of the medal card, as it is only a PDF download from the PRO.

Kevin: you’ve definitely got the right chap – he was born at 13 Priory Row, Coventry which no longer exists as the building was bombed in WW2 and subsequently demolished – it would have been adjacent to the West wall of the new cathedral had it been still standing! He re-joined the KRRC in WW2, and while I’m no expert on these matters, I suspect the process would have required him to be re-commissioned at his old rank first (as a rather late middle aged 2^nd Lieutenant). He subsequently served as a Major (in Italy I believe) – I have another photo of him in uniform from then and I’m sure I can just make out part of a crown on his epaulettes. However the connection with Bexhill is tenuous and so I doubt it supports a geographical link with the East Surreys. He moved there around 1980, only a few years before he died (though I hadn’t absorbed the fact he must have been there in 1946 when he formally changed his surname). He was born in Coventry, packed off (for some unknown reason) to school in Rhodesia before 1914, and joined up in Rhodesia in December 1914. He disembarked with the rest of the 2^nd Rhodesia Rigement from the SS Umzumbi at Mombasa on 15^th March 1915 and served in East Africa until the remains of the regiment were embarked on HMS Himalaya at Dar-es-Salaam on 8^th April 1917. By the late 1920s he was farming in Argentina, and only came back to the UK to join up again for WW2, he then farmed in Essex and Yorkshire - so to my knowledge there really is no logical tie to the East Surrey’s. I’ve also picked up from somewhere (can’t remember where) that a lot of the remaining 2^nd Rhodesian’s joined the KRRC.

Steve: Your comment about the other 2^nd Lieutenants commissioned at the same time are spot on: Charles William Auchtal Theal, was private 837, attested on 1^st December 1914 in the 2^nd Rhodesia Regiment (my grandfather has marked his name in his copy of the book about the regiment). Herbert John Devitt, no. 415, was a sergeant in the 2^nd RR’s, attested 24^th October 1914. John Christian Martens, no. 687, was a corporal in the 2^nd RR’s, attested 19^th November 1914

My grandfather refers to Wake, the remaining 2^nd Lieutenant commissioned at the same time as him, in his journal when he refers to taking supplies up to the front. It probably isn’t of much interest to everyone, but it does paint a picture:

“I found young Wake, an old soldier of five hours of trench life, in command of D Company swanking about the place scorning to duck for the 5.9s, with a few dead men in his trench and a good number of live ones. We got together a party of about thirty men and my party, and started off back for the water. The CQMSs came first, then myself, then the party and Wake brought up the rear. By this time the Bosche had the trench well taped and proceeded to strafe it and he was hitting or just missing the parapet every time. My word, those CQMSs did go! They fairly tore along. I kept on shouting at them to go slower. I damned them and cursed myself black in the face. The shells kept popping off and the smell of gas got worse and worse. We tried putting our gas masks on, but then we kept tripping over telephone wires and dead men, and then we simply kept the mouth pieces in our mouths.

We reached the end of the trench to find ten of the party left behind, and had to start back with as much as we could carry. This time I had two water cans and we went back up the trench. Finally we found Wake and about ten of his men who had not been able to keep up with us and had lost their way….

… Simmonds was to take command of D Company; Wake had been killed [25^th September 1918] just after I left. I was to go up to A Company holding the line with B and C companies in support. A guide showed me the way and we went over the top finally dropping into a narrow trench. I found "OC Coys" dugout and dozed there till daylight after a pint mug of wine.”

Note that any factual errors in this are entirely mine – from trying to transcribe his handwriting!

One of the strange coincidence that I have only just spotted was the date that he arrived “in theatre” in East Africa (15^th March 1915) was the date his brother (2^nd Lieutenant Leslie Spenser White) was killed in France.

Once again thanks everyone for your help. And Kevin – I hadn’t been able to find him in the 1911 census, so thanks too for that (a bonus).

[Stebie9173]

Just in case you aren't aware - his service in WW2 probably means that his Service Records (the British part of it at least) will be still held by the MOD and fully available to next of kin relatives.

2nd Brigade (in which 2nd K.R.R.C. served seem to have been about half South African and Rhodesian! I jest but there do seem to be a lot of officers from there that turn up as I research the 1st Northamptons also in the Brigade. That is without counting 2nd brigades elite sniper unit which was entirely comprised of men from the southern African nations. This was led by Neville William ("Sniper Bill") Methven.

Steve.

[rolt968]

I have downloaded his MIC from ancestry and the back of the card is blank.

I suppose that it is possible that the MIC error is one of omission: missing out his commissioning and service with KRRC.

Does his journal account for the whole period from the Autumn of 1917 to mid 1918? Could he have served briefly in the ranks of the East Surreys? (There seem to have been East Surrey battalions fighting on most fronts.) That late in the war he could have been allocated to any battalion in need of men, so there need be no link with East Surrey.

Would he have had to be at least briefly part of a British battalion to apply for a British Commission?

On the assumption that they had not caught with his commissioning, there would be no need for another medal card since the information already shown would be enough to account for the award of the trio.

20 KRRC were the British Empire League Pioneers. From May 1916 to the end of the war they were the pioneer battalion of 3 Division.

It would be interesting to know what happened when his medals were issued. As an officer he would have had to apply for them. Since the MIC shows him as an other rank, they would have been sent.

Roger.

[Stebie9173]

I notice Theal's medal card also omits his officer service. It has the same wording about "to South African Infantry Brigade 11-9-1917" but says "Will be claimed by S.A. Infantry Bde." instead of East Surrey Regiment, written in the same handwriting as White's card.

Steve.

[Cowshed]

Thansk Steve and Roger for further thoughts on this matter

There is a gap in his journal (from his re-embarkation at Dar-es-Salaam on 8th April 1917 and his arrival in France on 20th August 1918. I think the regiment went back to Rhodesia (the ship docked at Beira on the 14th April 1918), and then at some later date a lot of them arrived back in Blighty. So that is a good 15 months. They had been in theatre in East Africa for over two years and the Regiment was virtually non-existent as a military unit. The family story goes that his mother was most indignant at the suggestion by some doctor or officer that she wouldn't recognise her son when she went to pick him up back in the UK, but I understand she couldn't - quite a few years had gone by since she last saw him, and he had been living rough for most of the two years in East Africa. So it seems plausible there was a period of recuperation, before perhaps being temporarily enlisted in a home regiment, the East Surrey's. The link to his subsequent commission with KRRC then got lost. I have his 1914-15 star to hand (seem to have misplaced the others for now) - it is engraved on the back "886 Pte T. O. S. White 2nd Rhodesia Regt." Would the engraving have been done by the War Office, or would he have arranged it? Presumaby if he had done the engraving he would have used his last rank.

Steve: How would i go about contacting the MOD for his WW2 service record? Is it something that can be done online or do I need to use an old-fashioned letter?

Simon

[rksimpson]

Hi Simon

Through here - http://www.veterans-uk.info/service_records/service_records.html

You have to fill out a few forms, add a cheque and post it off.

It can take up to a year to get them!

regards

Robert

[Cowshed]

I notice Theal's medal card also omits his officer service. It has the same wording about "to South African Infantry Brigade 11-9-1917" but says "Will be claimed by S.A. Infantry Bde." instead of East Surrey Regiment, written in the same handwriting as White's card.

Steve.

Steve, that set me thinking about the significance of the date 11-9-1917. i checked The 2nd Rhodesia Regiment in East Africa and on page 100 it says "On July 19th 1917, we were informed that the Regiment would cease to exist as such, and would be split up to serve as reinforcements to Union troops overseas."

In the penultimate paragraph of the book, Lieut-Col. Capell writes: "On July 9th the remains of the 2nd Rhodesia Regiment entrained for overseas, to be split into a hundred detachments on reaching England; many obtaining commissions, many going down with malaria and sickness born in East Africa, many making the supreme sacrifice before the war was ended - all doing their duty."

I imagine Army records don't like a vacuum, so technically the survivors of the 2nd RR's were transfered to the South African Infantry Brigade on 11th September 1917.

Simon

[Cowshed]

Hi Simon

Through here - http://www.veterans-uk.info/service_records/service_records.html

You have to fill out a few forms, add a cheque and post it off.

It can take up to a year to get them!

regards

Robert

Thanks Robert, I'll give that a go - but I won't then anxiously wait for a reply!

Simon

[Stebie9173]

The 1914-15 Star was inscribed with the initial rank and unit with which the soldier was serving when he entered his first active Theatre of War. The BWM/VM inscribing is more complicated, especially for officers!

The note "To S. Afr. Inf. Bde. 11-9-1917" may be significant since the South African Infantry Brigade was a Brigade on the Western Front that served in 9th (Scottish) Division, and was famous for its part in the battle at Delville Wood. It seems likely that he transferred to the South African Brigade at that time, possibly within one of the South African Infantry Regiments (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th) of the Brigade.

Steve.

EDIT: Great minds think alike. I was typing the above as you posted!

[rolt968]

I have his 1914-15 star to hand (seem to have misplaced the others for now) - it is engraved on the back "886 Pte T. O. S. White 2nd Rhodesia Regt." Would the engraving have been done by the War Office, or would he have arranged it? Presumaby if he had done the engraving he would have used his last rank.

The WO would have the inscription made. For the 1914-15 Star, it shows his rank and unit when he qualified for it (Though the medal was instituted and awarded much later. The other medals should have his rank and number in the East Surreys.

Roger.

[Stebie9173]

Looking at CWGC using the criteria of South African Infantry as Regiment, and Rhodesia as Additional Information there are 13 men with RR/ prefixes killed in 1918 who appear to have served previously in the Rhodesia Regiment and were killed as part of the South African Regiment - 12 of 13 with 1st Bn. and the odd man out with 3rd Bn.

It may be worth looking at the 1st (or 3rd, see below) South African Regiment to see whether they received a draft of Rhodesians in September 1917.

This website mentions groups of Rhodesians serving in other units:

http://www.galago.co.za/CAT1_032_b.htm

The K.R.R.C. unit referred to there who had enough Rhodesians to form platoons (and was wiped out at the Battle of the Dunes at Nieuport) was the 2nd K.R.R.C.

There is a short paragraph about Hector J Lucas on the linked PDF below (page 83) that notes that he too served with 2nd Rhodesian Regiment and later with 1st South African Regiment - he too has a medal card with the 11-9-1917 date on it.

http://www.rhodesia.nl/rhodesiana/volume20.pdf

That one man of the 3rd South African Infantry has got me thinking. All of the men killed with 1st Battalion were killed after the 3rd Battalion was disbanded. The 3rd Battalion, being initially comprised of men from Transvaal and Rhodesia, seems a lot better fit. I wonder if the men initially went to 3rd Battalion and then transferred to the 1st when 3rd was disbanded?

This is from the History of the South Africa forces in France:

{February 1918} was spent in training for the great battle which was now believed to be due in early March. One sad change had perforce to be made. It had been resolved to reduce the British divisions from a thirteen battalion to a ten battalion basis, and this meant that one battalion must disappear from each brigade. General Smuts and General Lukin, after consultation with General Dawson, decided to disband the 3rd (Transvaal and Rhodesia) Regiment, which had received the smallest number of recruits during the past twelve months. On 8th February Dawson visited the battalion to explain the decision. He promised that as far as possible complete companies would be sent as reinforcements to the other regiments of the Brigade, and that every assistance would be given to officers and men who might desire to transfer to outside units. Accordingly, on 18th February, the 3rd Regiment was finally disbanded, practically all the officers, N.C.O.'s, and men joining the other South African regiments.

The above book is available on free download here:

http://archive.org/details/historyofsouthaf00buchrich

Interesting medal description:

Three: Private W. A. Lang, 2nd Rhodesia Regiment

1914-15 Star (585 Pte., 2-Rhodesia Regt.); British War Medal 1914-20 (Pte., Rhod. 1st S.A.I. Bgde.); Victory Medal 1914-19 (585 Pte., 2-Rhodesia Regt.) good very fine (3)

Footnote

William Albert Lang enlisted into the 2nd Rhodesia Regiment on 2 November 1914. He entered British East Africa with them on 9 March 1915. He was transferred to the Machine Gun Section in December 1915. He is credited with serving at the battles of Latema, Taveta, German Bridge, Mkolamo, Lukigura and Makindu. Lang was invalided to South Africa from Kilindini in occupied German East Africa on 17 October 1916. Lang was struck off the strength for transfer to the 2nd Rhodesian Regiment Detachment, 3rd South African Infantry, 1st South African Brigade, on 9 September 1917. He embarked for England on 13 September and was taken onto the strength of the 1st Reserve Battalion on 12 October 1917. He was transferred to the South African Discharge Depot on 20 November 1917. Lang returned to South Africa on 12 April 1918 and was discharged at Wynberg, Transvaal, on 30 April 1918. With copied service papers.

http://www.dnw.co.uk/auction-archive/catalogue-archive/lot.php?auction_id=181&lot_id=71140

Steve.

[Cowshed]

After many months I thought I write a quick update to this thread. I followed Robert's suggestion and applied for the Army Service Record for Thomas Otho Shearburn White. It arrived this week (not too bad, I thought). Most of it is related to his service in WW2, but amongst its contents was Army Form B2505 Attestation record to the East Surrey Regiment. It is dated 5th January 1918 and it then shows him being attached to the 20th OCB (Officer Cadet Brigade) two days later. On 25th June 1918 he is "Discharged to Commission 2/Lt. 6 Bn Kings Royal Rifle Corps".

[rolt968]

Thank you for the update.

20th Officer Cadet Battalion was based at Crookham, Aldershot.

6 KRRC was a reserve battalion (at Queenborough)

(All from James's British Regiments 1914-18.)

He would have served in another battalion of KRRC in France.

Roger

[MBrockway]

The WO338 index shows him as 20th Battalion of the K.R.R.C. (not sure if that helps or hinders!)

Steve.

The 20th Battalion Records in the 1919 KRRC Chronicle lists 2/Lt. T.O.S.White in the Nominal Roll of officers for the end of 1919.

No mention of 2/Lt White in Turberville's Short History of the 20th Battalion King's Royal Rifle Corps

I don't have the 20/KRRC War Diary :-(

[MBrockway]

I was wondering if anyone can through any light on why my grandfather's (Thomas Otho Shearburn White) medal card seems at odds with my understanding of his servcie in 1918. I always understood that he served as a 2nd Lieutenant with the 2nd Battalion, King's Royal Rifle Corps. He kept a journal of his time in the Great War - from 1914 to 1917 with the 2nd Rhodesian Regiment in East Africa and then from August 1918 in France. His journal refers to several people that i can identify as serving in the 2nd Battalion. However he does not appear on any lists I have seen of members of the KRRC (even though I can find his best friend, 2nd Lieutenant Alan James Stephen, also ex 2nd Rhodesia Regiment, who was killed not far from him on 18th October 1918).

Assuming you mean the 2nd battalion KRRC, can you give some of these names and I'll do some checking for you.

[MBrockway]

..

So by 15 March 1915 he was in France, thus being entitled to the 1915 Star as well as the British War and Victory medals.

He served in Africa in 1915 with 2nd Rhodesian Regiment, then with the East Surreys.

..

MIC has Embarkation Date of 15 Mar 1915, but the Theatre Code is 4(a).

The Mother Site says that's Egypt, but this is clearly incorrect, as in March 1915 2nd Rhodesia Regiment sailed from Mozambique direct to Mombasa (British East Africa, modern Kenya) en route to the East African theatre.

The MIC to Oswald Puckle, who was KiA with 2/RR at the Battle of Salaita on 12 Feb 1916 (see Private OSWALD PUCKLE, 2nd Rhodesia Regiment) also uses Theatre Code 4(a).

So White did not land in France in March 1915.

Forum Pals @bushfighter and @SteveE both have a special interest in the East African Campaign and may have information about when White left the theatre.

It might be worth dropping them a PM - like me, they may not have spotted this thread as matching their interests - its title is rather general.

[MBrockway]

Read more about the links between Rhodesians and the KRRC in this article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Rhodesia_in_World_War_I

(NB this article claims 2/KRRC's Rhodesian Platoon took part in the First Day of the Somme on 01 Jul 1916, which is implausible as the battalion had undertaken at attack on "The Triangle" in the Loos sector on 29 Jun and remained resting in billets at PETIT SAINS in the same sector until 03 July. They then moved down in stages to The Somme where their first offensive operation was the Attack on the POZIERES SWITCH on 23 July. The Rhodesian Platoon gets special mention for their part in a successful attack near EAUCORT L'ABBAYE on 25 Sep 1916 - this is probably the source of the reference in the article.

There's also an article in the 1959 KRRC Chronicle about Rhodesians in the KRRC, but I have yet to acquire that volume - was recently outbid heavily for one on fleabay!

The Rhodesia Regiment was allied to the KRRC and (IIRC), later, the Royal Green Jackets until UDI.