Doug504 Posted 28 August , 2013 Share Posted 28 August , 2013 I teach in a small special school for students with emotional and behavioural problems. For the past 6 years I have taken a small group comprising of 7 students and 3 staff to visit the Somme battlefields. The focus of the trip is to research and locate the graves / memorials of local men killed in the areas we are visiting. We advertise in the local press and are contacted by people who wish us to place a message or card on the grave / memorial and have a photograph of the location. The trip encourages our students to create links with the local community and with the older generations. On returning from the trip we have a very emotional presentation evening when the students present certificates and photographs to the students. (See attached links). http://www.sunderlandecho.com/history-nostalgia/pupils-track-down-graves-of-sunderland-world-war-one-heroes-in-the-somme-1-5708276 http://www.sunderlandecho.com/news/education/mp-praises-sunderland-pupils-somme-war-grave-mission-1-5868332 http://www.cwgc.org/news-events/news/sunderland-school-children-host-presentation-evening-following-somme-trip.aspx My issue is with the proposed funding arrangements for the WW1 centenary school visits. At present the proposed funding has been allocated to a single tour provider, (S.T.S.), to enable 2 students and 1 staff member from each school in the country to visit the WW1 battlefields. We had hoped that funding would be devolved to individual schools to allow them to spend in the most economical way possible. Each year our trip, including self-catering accommodation, (again a learning experience for our students), fuel and transport costs total approximately £1200 for a 10 day trip. We raise this through fundraising activities and a very generous contribution from the school budget, (students do not pay a contribution as most come from very deprived areas). Unfortunately it would appear that the government has not considered the special needs of such students, i.e. high staff to student ratio and a requirement for the trip to be very flexible, changeable at a moment’s notice should the students’ needs demand it. As a consequence our students will again miss out on funding from government and will be unable to benefit from the proposed funding arrangements. I have been in contact with the D.O.E. to discuss this matter but they seem unable to comprehend the special requirements of our students and the organisation of such trips. We will however, be running the trip again next year as our Head teacher recognises the huge benefit to the students and will allocate funds form our already very tight budget. Apologies for such a long note but I do feel strongly about this issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrissparrow Posted 28 August , 2013 Share Posted 28 August , 2013 Thanks Allan, It is a sad story, but not untypical of the stale government views on such things. Where is your school and what age are your students? I too am a teacher who takes trips, although in very different circumstances. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 28 August , 2013 Share Posted 28 August , 2013 Great effort Allan. I just wonder with the gov funding how many kids will be press ganged and how many will have any interest or get any benefit by going. Are children really interested at looking at static monuments and fields. Would the money not be better spent on a day trip for a class to their local memorials and rolls of honour? How come the gov feels the need to give children aknowledge of WW1 at this late stage? Hopefully some of the kids will learn something, but do their G,G,G fathers lives mean anything to them? Allan, from what you have said your students benefit from these trips. Probably not only in an education sort of way but also interaction. I hope you can continue to find funding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrissparrow Posted 28 August , 2013 Share Posted 28 August , 2013 Johnboy, Children get an amazing amount from it! I could write a book on taking children, but just please believe me! It doesn't matter about the age of the battle - I have taken kids to Normandy, Somme, Ypres, Isandlwana, Waterloo, Civil War battlefields, Hastings, etc.....! They lap it up and when on the Somme they find a bullet it is an unbelievable experience. In Turkey every school child must visit Gallipoli at some stage of their education. Why should every British child not visit Ypres or the Somme? Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 28 August , 2013 Share Posted 28 August , 2013 That's good to hear Chris. I was only asking the questions because I was once a child, many, many years ago!! Our only school trip involved walking a couple of miles to Willesden Junction goods yard. Are lots of schools doing trips to WW1 France? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrissparrow Posted 28 August , 2013 Share Posted 28 August , 2013 Yes they are. It would be hard to put a figure on it but lots do. It would be lovely to have some sort of count on this site. I know many members are teachers. Please all let yourselves be known! Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 28 August , 2013 Share Posted 28 August , 2013 Just been on google and saw 2 pages of cos operating school trips and accomadation offers. I did not realise it was a big business. I did not bother going to page 3.! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrissparrow Posted 28 August , 2013 Share Posted 28 August , 2013 Yes - there are lots doing them and some of the major companies are good, but a lot are just filling the market. The best way is for the school to run it's own trip. Grants could be a serious aid to schools and I hope they are made freely available. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Hesketh Posted 29 August , 2013 Share Posted 29 August , 2013 Schools do a heck of a lot, but I won't waste my time trying to explain it. Too many forum members thinks its all rubbish - in fact there was a comment to that effect by a top poster just yesterday. Of course some people think you can do a 'proper' job in what, six weeks usually? Unreal. Allan / Chris - keep up the good work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Hone Posted 29 August , 2013 Share Posted 29 August , 2013 The notion of having two students take part in a trip , then pass on their experiences in a presentation back at school has quite a long pedigree, e.g. the Holocaust Education Trust's long-running 'Lessons from Auschwitz' initiative. Like others here, I'm dubious as to whether it was really the best model for the government to adopt in the case of the Great War Centenary. However a more flexible system of grants for schools to use as they saw fit would presumably have been more difficult and expensive to administer. From my experience of n number of previous threads I know that it is difficult for some forum contributors to accept that there is any value in school visits to the battlefields. They can always produce anecdotes of witnessing bored or ill-behaved teenagers hanging around cemeteries in an attempt to discredit the whole concept, ignoring the impact on young people of the sorts of tours run by Allan, Chris and many others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
healdav Posted 29 August , 2013 Share Posted 29 August , 2013 I had not heard that some tour company was being given a monopoly on this business, but it doesn't surprise me. It just seems impossible to explain to the British government that today there is no need for 'specialist' knowledge to send anyone to the continent. All you have to do to send a group is ring around a find a bus company willing to take you, get on the bus and go after having booked accommodation of some sort. Its not rocket science. Presumably it will change around the time when Dover stops boasting about 35000 people having gone through the port yesterday as if this was a monumental number. Where I live we have a transfrontier movement every day of 340,000 to go to work, and on top of that, people going shopping, trucks and tourists transiting, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragon Posted 29 August , 2013 Share Posted 29 August , 2013 Unfortunately it would appear that the government has not considered the special needs of such students, i.e. high staff to student ratio and a requirement for the trip to be very flexible, changeable at a moment’s notice should the students’ needs demand it. As a consequence our students will again miss out on funding from government and will be unable to benefit from the proposed funding arrangements. I have been in contact with the D.O.E. to discuss this matter but they seem unable to comprehend the special requirements of our students and the organisation of such trips. We will however, be running the trip again next year as our Head teacher recognises the huge benefit to the students and will allocate funds form our already very tight budget. You're obviously doing a wonderful job; please don't be disheartened. Isn't this an accessibility issue? How are other schools with similar students responding to the government's concept of giving them the opportunity to visit the battlefields? My friend teaches teenagers with very profound problems, some of whom will never approach Key Stage Zero. The National Curriculum required her to teach them WW1. I lent her some things from my collection, so they could feel the cold metal of a helmet, touch the rough fabric of a uniform, hold a heavy overcoat, or feel the damaged edges of an exploded shell. She read poetry to them and she played Butterworth's music. They cried. They were frightened at the cold metal. I think anyone who doubts that such damaged people are capable of responding at some level to war would benefit from having an open mind. Gwyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
centurion Posted 29 August , 2013 Share Posted 29 August , 2013 I suspect that where schools are keen to go and staff interested and knowledgeable then pupils can get a lot out of it. Where the 'school trip' is a chore for the staff involved then boredom is infectious will quickly be absorbed by the pupils who will take their lead and the whole thing is a waste for everybody (I can remember a few trips like that). The danger that I see is that some schools will take part in the government sponsored scheme merely because it is there ('we might as well take the money') and the pupils end up not getting much out of it. Much better if a higher proportion of pupils from a smaller number of schools (but ones really interested in doing it) went but this would mean choosing which schools qualified and would make best use of the money and I can hear cries of "elitism" already.. One other matter - the ratio of staff to pupils under this government scheme does seem inevitably rather high. Is it meant to get as many pupils as possible involved or maximise the numbers of teachers from across the country who go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 29 August , 2013 Share Posted 29 August , 2013 I think the scheme is for only 2 children from each school to go. 1 teacher 2 children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
centurion Posted 29 August , 2013 Share Posted 29 August , 2013 I think the scheme is for only 2 children from each school to go. 1 teacher 2 children. That's my point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Hesketh Posted 29 August , 2013 Share Posted 29 August , 2013 Well there has to be a teacher, you can't send them on their own. And there's obviously a limit to the funds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrissparrow Posted 29 August , 2013 Share Posted 29 August , 2013 Ratios don't matter - just take some kids. They are the guardians of future Remembrance. We need to inspire them whilst the battlefields remain. If they saw the bunker at Pop then saw it demolished they would be as shocked as we all were. An old education prof told me one lesson outside was worth 7 in the classroom and I have never doubted this. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickpreston@nasuwt.net Posted 29 August , 2013 Share Posted 29 August , 2013 Rules is Rules: that the trouble when the state gets involved. A good idea but no flexability Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug504 Posted 29 August , 2013 Author Share Posted 29 August , 2013 Thank you all for your comments, I teach, (Science), at Springwell Dene School in Sunderland Tyne and Wear, students are both KS3 and KS4. The trips originally started due to my interest in the great war and my knowledge of the areas involved, (many past holidays in the area with a very patient wife!), and a desire to give our students the opportunity of an overseas trip. We tend to pick those students who have never been abroad or due to family circumstances are unlikely to do so in the future. Over time the trip has evolved from a battle field tour, we used to visit sites related to the 20th Battalion D.L.I. raised in Sunderland, into a service for the local community researching residents memorial or grave locations. Students then go out into the local community visiting the families and see how these long dead family members are still loved and remembered. We obtain a card or cross with a message to place on the grave / memorial and do some background research into the likely cause of the casualty. Students then locate the grave / memorial and take a photograph for the family to present to them on our return. Although I give the students the historical context at each site we visit what is of greater importance to me, is to see the recognition in the students that each of the thousands of headstones or names on a memorial they see was once a much loved family member, just like the one they are placing for the family they have come to know. I'll be honest and say I've only ever briefly looked at the History National Curriculum and was immediately "switched off" by it. Of much greater importance is the social, and emotional skills developed by our students, links with older generations and breaking down the misconceptions some people have with regard to students with emotional and behavioral issues. We must be doing something right as students from trips years previous still wish to return again. My hope is that even if only a small number remember their trip they will pass this on to their children and perpetuate the memory of this period. My moan to the D.O.E. is they see the proposed funding only in the context of "curriculum" and not the social and cultural aspects plus I'm sure we are not the only special school that will miss out on being able to access these funds due to the shortsighted funding arrangements. My cynical side wonders how much profit the sole tour provider is going to make from this project and if they have any relations in Westminster? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrissparrow Posted 29 August , 2013 Share Posted 29 August , 2013 Fine words Allan! Your school is very different to mine but our motives and insperation are inseparable. I say again, to anyone who loves the Western Front, take some kids! Whatever way you have to fund or charge or raise money, just take the kids! Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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