1/7 Middlesex Regiment - France 1917 Actions?

[GrahamA]

Hello,

I'm trying to find out a little more about my Grandfather, I'm hoping there are some experts here on the Middlesex Regiment, military history is not something I know anything about and I find this regiment's history to be particularly confusing.

My goal is to try and find out exactly where if possible, which action or battle he was wounded in, and for this I obviously need to find out if possible the movements of his battalion.
Alas I have no private papers, medals, or anyone left alive in the family to talk to but this is what I know so far:

Name: Thomas Abbott
Born: 14th August 1898
Pob: Northampton, England
Address: 47 Grove Road
Occupation: Boot and shoe trade
Service no. 204449
Middlesex Regiment (no note of battalion, see below)
Rank: Private
Volunteered: possibly Feb 1917 aged 20
Discharge date: August 21st 1918
Reason for discharge: Para 892 Kings Reg - No longer physically fit for War Service
Later, moved to the Royal Defence Regiment, - 63rd Protection Company - service no. 77082

Source Citation: WO364; Piece: 5000.
Serverely wounded with bullet to chest (lost lung), definitely somewhere on the Western Front, in France (as noted on B2088 pension record) around sixth months after joining, putting the month around August or September (1917) time.


Medal Rolls Index

Silver War Badge TP/3216
Victory medal TP102. B.7 page 542
British medal TP102. B.7 page 542

No further information on this card.
Unable to find service record (prob destroyed in WW2)?


I initially began my research with a comment on Paul Nixon's site to which he very kindly replied...
"The medal index card for your grandad also notes 204449 Middlesex Regt which in turn suggests 7th Battalion Middx Regt."

So that led me to looking at the 1/7 Middlesex, and that is when confusion set in, as they seem to have been joined to many other units.

He went on to suggest checking the war diaries for the 7th Middx at the National Archives, but this is not an option for me at present, so I am sort of hoping someone can shed some light on things here for me.


This is the main bulk of the information I managed to dig up so far on the Middlesex 1/7th Battalion Territorial Force, (assuming this is the correct battalion my Granddad was in) but I am in uncharted waters and really do not have the know-how to research this any further and online details are very sketchy.

So can anyone tell me the movements of the 1/7 Middlesex between February 1917 and say November 1917


Here is what my basic research turned up for the actions this regiment may have been involved in...

During 1917;

14 March - 5 April: The German retreat to the Hindenburg Line
9 -14 April: The First Battle of the Scarpe
3 - 5 May: The Third Battle of the Scarpe
16 - 17 Aug: The Battle of Langemarck

21 Nov: The capture of Tadpole Copse
23 - 28 Nov: The capture of Bourlon Wood



Thanks in advance for any help anyone can offer on this. :-)

[jay dubaya]

Welcome to the forum Graham,

Thomas enlisted on 26th November 1915 to France on 7th May 1917 and was wounded on the 7th June 1917. As well as his pension record I have the battalion war diary, it's handwritten so please be patient and I will post findings later,

Jon

[Steven Broomfield]

There is a very good history of the battalion by Colonel E J King, CMG, FSA, I can't find it in the Naval and Military Press list so possibly not available as a reprint: copies appear on second hand lists (about £80 - £90).

[GrahamA]

Welcome to the forum Graham,

Thomas enlisted on 26th November 1915 to France on 7th May 1917 and was wounded on the 7th June 1917. As well as his pension record I have the battalion war diary, it's handwritten so please be patient and I will post findings later,

Jon

Hello Jon,

Thankyou so much for finding this out for me, I have the patience of a Saint and will wait as long as is necessary for you to collate any snippets you have :-)

[GrahamA]

There is a very good history of the battalion by Colonel E J King, CMG, FSA, I can't find it in the Naval and Military Press list so possibly not available as a reprint: copies appear on second hand lists (about £80 - £90).

Thanks for the resource Steven, I live near Cambridge so I may well find a copy in the bookshops there, or perhaps I may be able to get a copy through my local library.

[jbw541]

Hello,

As Jon pointed out Thomas`s pension records have survived. Amongst these it shows he transferred to the 13th Middx on the 26/5/17. It also includes a furlough from hospital in Dec 1917, it shows Thomas as "B" Coy, 13th Middx. Good luck.

[GrahamA]

Hello,

As Jon pointed out Thomas`s pension records have survived. Amongst these it shows he transferred to the 13th Middx on the 26/5/17. It also includes a furlough from hospital in Dec 1917, it shows Thomas as "B" Coy, 13th Middx. Good luck.

Hello JBW,

Many thanks for your post, I must say I know a lot more now than I did a week ago and the mists appear to clearing :-)

Can I assume the 13th Middx was a front line battalion? if so I must be heading in the right direction, but without anything to go by on my end it's hard to be sure so I don't mind holding on until Jon posts his findings, as I am researching my family history I know what it is like to find yourself related to people you aren't related to. :-D

Thanks again - Standing by my bed...

[jbw541]

Hello Graham,

I`m no expert on the 13th Middlesex but from a quick look on the web, they seem to have had a brief (14-19) but brutal time of it. The 13th would have been part of the 73rd Brigade, 24th Division.

If you scroll to the top of this page and click on the link for "The Long, Long Trail" you`ll be able to see which battle Thomas would have been involved in.

Best of luck with your research. Joe.

[spof]

THe war diary for 13 Middlesex can be downloaded from TNA for £3.36.

[jay dubaya]

Saint Graham

a quick summary over the details that I can provide for your Grandfather Thomas Abbott who appears to have enlisted under the 'Derby Scheme' in 1915, whereby men were called upon to attest then wait to be called up in order of groups - your Grandfather was part of Group 15.

What is slightly confusing is the enlisment date but it is clear from the documents that he first presented himself on 26th November 1915 at Northampton where he declared his age as 18 years and 3 days, and his occupation as 'Boot Trade' later documents state 'Stitcher'. Although he is found to have Spinal Curvature he is classed as Fit Cat.A. on this date. He is re-examined again in Northampton on 17th July 1916 and again passed Fit Cat.A. Further papers show 'deemed to have enlisted on 2nd August 1916. Eventually he is called up and presented himself to join the colours on 2nd February 1917 and is posted to the 7th Reserve Battalion Middlesex Regiment and given the service number 204449.

8th May posted to 1/7th Bn. Middlesex

8th May embarked from Folkstone and disembarked at Boulogne

26th May posted to 'B' Company 13th Bn. Middlesex

the war diary for the 13th Bn notes

Drafts during month Officers 16 Other Ranks 338

Around this time the 13th Bn. were in camp at Heksken a few miles south of Poperinge.

The following is a transcription from the 13th Bn. war diary

1st-4th June 73rd Bde Practice forthcoming operation at training area just north of STEENVOORDE (BOIS DE BEAUVOORDE).

2nd June 2/Lt WEBB proceeded on leave to England.

4th June 6.30 pm Bn moved to tents at G.26.c.4.3. (W-X night).

5th June 11 pm Bn moved to Camp ‘P’ at H.13.a.90.00. and slept in the open as there were no tents or huts there (x-y night).

6th June 12 midnight Bn moved to assembly area (trenches between SWAN CHATEAU & CHATEAU CIGARE). Carrying party under 2/Lt E.D. GODDARD, details etc. remained behind at ‘P’ Camp. During the day the following Officers rejoined the Bn from leave.

2/Lt. H.E. MARRIOTT
2/Lt H. ROGERSON
2/Lt. J.B. FAULKNER

They did not proceed with the Bn to the Assembly Trenches.

Maj. A.N. HINGLEY (Second in Cmd)
Capt. J.H. SCHOOLING (O.C. C Coy)
Capt. M.S. McGAHEY (O.C. D Coy)

The above Officers moved with Bn to Assembly Trenches & returned the same night to the Transport Lines (y-z night).

Capt (Temp Lt. Col.) J. GREENE Dragoon Guards attd. 13th Middx Regt. awarded D.S.O.

7th June The assembly trenches were reached about 2 a.m.At 3.10 a.m. the 41st Divn went over the top & captured the Red Line (1st Objective). At the same time several large mines were exploded. The intense bombardment lasted all the morning & during that time the Blue (DAMM STRASSE) & Black Lines (2nd & 3rd Objectives) were taken by the 41st Divn.

11.30 am The 13th Middx Regt. moved forward to ECLUSE TRENCH & OLD FRENCH TRENCH.

1.30 pm The Bn moved forward to the BLACK LINE (present front line & jumping off line for 73rd Bde). Within a few minutes of arrival the Bn went over the top (3.10 p.m.) under an excellent barrage.

DISPOSITION:-

RT FRONT COY – B Coy under Capt. R.S. DOVE
LT FRONT COY – A Coy under Capt. F.J. STRATTEN
RT SUPPORT COY – D Coy under 2/Lt DAWKINS
LT SUPPORT COY – C Coy under Lt ROBERTS
Moppers-up were commanded by 2/Lt C.W. WALLIS (D Coy) & 2/Lt R.W. PHILLIPS (B Coy).

Our objective was known as the Green Line. Which? extended from the front edge of RAVINE WOOD on the right via OLIVE TRENCH to the HOLLEBEKE RD on the left. The objective was gained without much difficulty, the Coy on the right consolidating well in front of RAVINE WOOD & VERHAEST FM (farm). Owing to the Division on our left not coming forward with us, ‘A’ Coy was left with their flank in the air, & had to perform a difficult movement to protect themselves. They were therefore unable to consolidate the left half of OLIVE TRENCH. ‘C’ Coy (Left Support Coy) had to be called on to assist ‘A’ Coy (Left Front) to form a defensive flank.

During the first day the enemy’s artillery was erratic & the Bn suffered more from lack of

water than from anything else. During the attack about 100 unwounded & 20 wounded were captured, mostly in the RAVINE. Also 5 Machine Guns, 1 Trench Mortar & a large quantity of material. The prisoners included 2 Officers.

The Battle of Messines was launched on 7 June 1917 with the detonation of 19 mines underneath the German Lines. Perhaps your Grandfather was lucky to receive a Blighty on the first day of the offensive after spending little more than a week with the battalion.

The Pension Papers state that Thomas received a GSW (gun shot wound) to the chest and was evacuated to the 10th CCS (Casualty Clearing Station) at Remy Sidings arriving at the 3rd Canadian Hospital at Boulogne on 19th June 1917 and evacuated to England on the following day where he arrived at the Tankerton Hospital at Whitstable, it was here that Thomas underwent surgery (Thoractomy and Emphyema) for a collapsed lung. Thomas was to spend 6 months here before being discharged and sent to the Shornecliffe Hospital on 21st December 1917 and discharged on Christmas Eve. He was granted a furlough home which is dated as 23rd December 1917 - 1st January 1918.

1918

3rd January posted back to 7th Reserve Bn. Middlesex Rgt.

11th March compulsory transferred to the Labour Corps (service number 534421) and posted to the

572nd Agricultural Company

18th April transferred to 363rd Reserve Employment Company

24th April posted to 606th Home Service Employment Company at Bury St Edmunds

26th June transferred and posted to 63rd Protection Company, Royal Defence Corps at Faversham

(service number 77082)

18th July medical report states 'scar of entrance wound over liver. Scar of large inciscion over left ribs - below axilla' (armpit)

21st August discharged under King's Regulation paragraph 392(xvi) - the medical sheet attached to the

discharge papers state 'dyspnoea and giddiness. Unable to march' and so awarded a 30%

disability.

I'll leave it there for the moment but will pop back later. I do have a few more details and have managed to find a few map extracts which relate to the above action that Thomas took part in.

cheers, Jon

[GrahamA]

Hello Graham,

I`m no expert on the 13th Middlesex but from a quick look on the web, they seem to have had a brief (14-19) but brutal time of it. The 13th would have been part of the 73rd Brigade, 24th Division.

If you scroll to the top of this page and click on the link for "The Long, Long Trail" you`ll be able to see which battle Thomas would have been involved in.

Best of luck with your research. Joe.

Hi Joe,

Thanks for your input, I checked out the Long, Long Trail link and now my trail has become even longer :-D That's a good resource, thanks.

THe war diary for 13 Middlesex can be downloaded from TNA for £3.36.

Thankyou for the link SPOF

[GrahamA]

Saint Graham

a quick summary over the details that I can provide for your Grandfather Thomas Abbott who appears to have enlisted under the 'Derby Scheme' in 1915, whereby men were called upon to attest then wait to be called up in order of groups - your Grandfather was part of Group 15.

What is slightly confusing is the enlisment date but it is clear from the documents that he first presented himself on 26th November 1915 at Northampton where he declared his age as 18 years and 3 days, and his occupation as 'Boot Trade' later documents state 'Stitcher'. Although he is found to have Spinal Curvature he is classed as Fit Cat.A. on this date. He is re-examined again in Northampton on 17th July 1916 and again passed Fit Cat.A. Further papers show 'deemed to have enlisted on 2nd August 1916. Eventually he is called up and presented himself to join the colours on 2nd February 1917 and is posted to the 7th Reserve Battalion Middlesex Regiment and given the service number 204449.

8th May posted to 1/7th Bn. Middlesex

8th May embarked from Folkstone and disembarked at Boulogne

26th May posted to 'B' Company 13th Bn. Middlesex

the war diary for the 13th Bn notes

Drafts during month Officers 16 Other Ranks 338

Around this time the 13th Bn. were in camp at Heksken a few miles south of Poperinge.

The following is a transcription from the 13th Bn. war diary

1st-4th June 73rd Bde Practice forthcoming operation at training area just north of STEENVOORDE (BOIS DE BEAUVOORDE).

2nd June 2/Lt WEBB proceeded on leave to England.

4th June 6.30 pm Bn moved to tents at G.26.c.4.3. (W-X night).

5th June 11 pm Bn moved to Camp ‘P’ at H.13.a.90.00. and slept in the open as there were no tents or huts there (x-y night).

6th June 12 midnight Bn moved to assembly area (trenches between SWAN CHATEAU & CHATEAU CIGARE). Carrying party under 2/Lt E.D. GODDARD, details etc. remained behind at ‘P’ Camp. During the day the following Officers rejoined the Bn from leave.

2/Lt. H.E. MARRIOTT

2/Lt H. ROGERSON

2/Lt. J.B. FAULKNER

They did not proceed with the Bn to the Assembly Trenches.

Maj. A.N. HINGLEY (Second in Cmd)

Capt. J.H. SCHOOLING (O.C. C Coy)

Capt. M.S. McGAHEY (O.C. D Coy)

The above Officers moved with Bn to Assembly Trenches & returned the same night to the Transport Lines (y-z night).

Capt (Temp Lt. Col.) J. GREENE Dragoon Guards attd. 13th Middx Regt. awarded D.S.O.

7th June The assembly trenches were reached about 2 a.m.At 3.10 a.m. the 41st Divn went over the top & captured the Red Line (1st Objective). At the same time several large mines were exploded. The intense bombardment lasted all the morning & during that time the Blue (DAMM STRASSE) & Black Lines (2nd & 3rd Objectives) were taken by the 41st Divn.

11.30 am The 13th Middx Regt. moved forward to ECLUSE TRENCH & OLD FRENCH TRENCH.

1.30 pm The Bn moved forward to the BLACK LINE (present front line & jumping off line for 73rd Bde). Within a few minutes of arrival the Bn went over the top (3.10 p.m.) under an excellent barrage.

DISPOSITION:-

RT FRONT COY – B Coy under Capt. R.S. DOVE

LT FRONT COY – A Coy under Capt. F.J. STRATTEN

RT SUPPORT COY – D Coy under 2/Lt DAWKINS

LT SUPPORT COY – C Coy under Lt ROBERTS

Moppers-up were commanded by 2/Lt C.W. WALLIS (D Coy) & 2/Lt R.W. PHILLIPS (B Coy).

Our objective was known as the Green Line. Which? extended from the front edge of RAVINE WOOD on the right via OLIVE TRENCH to the HOLLEBEKE RD on the left. The objective was gained without much difficulty, the Coy on the right consolidating well in front of RAVINE WOOD & VERHAEST FM (farm). Owing to the Division on our left not coming forward with us, ‘A’ Coy was left with their flank in the air, & had to perform a difficult movement to protect themselves. They were therefore unable to consolidate the left half of OLIVE TRENCH. ‘C’ Coy (Left Support Coy) had to be called on to assist ‘A’ Coy (Left Front) to form a defensive flank.

During the first day the enemy’s artillery was erratic & the Bn suffered more from lack of

water than from anything else. During the attack about 100 unwounded & 20 wounded were captured, mostly in the RAVINE. Also 5 Machine Guns, 1 Trench Mortar & a large quantity of material. The prisoners included 2 Officers.

The Battle of Messines was launched on 7 June 1917 with the detonation of 19 mines underneath the German Lines. Perhaps your Grandfather was lucky to receive a Blighty on the first day of the offensive after spending little more than a week with the battalion.

The Pension Papers state that Thomas received a GSW (gun shot wound) to the chest and was evacuated to the 10th CCS (Casualty Clearing Station) at Remy Sidings arriving at the 3rd Canadian Hospital at Boulogne on 19th June 1917 and evacuated to England on the following day where he arrived at the Tankerton Hospital at Whitstable, it was here that Thomas underwent surgery (Thoractomy and Emphyema) for a collapsed lung. Thomas was to spend 6 months here before being discharged and sent to the Shornecliffe Hospital on 21st December 1917 and discharged on Christmas Eve. He was granted a furlough home which is dated as 23rd December 1917 - 1st January 1918.

1918

3rd January posted back to 7th Reserve Bn. Middlesex Rgt.

11th March compulsory transferred to the Labour Corps (service number 534421) and posted to the

572nd Agricultural Company

18th April transferred to 363rd Reserve Employment Company

24th April posted to 606th Home Service Employment Company at Bury St Edmunds

26th June transferred and posted to 63rd Protection Company, Royal Defence Corps at Faversham

(service number 77082)

18th July medical report states 'scar of entrance wound over liver. Scar of large inciscion over left ribs - below axilla' (armpit)

21st August discharged under King's Regulation paragraph 392(xvi) - the medical sheet attached to the

discharge papers state 'dyspnoea and giddiness. Unable to march' and so awarded a 30%

disability.

I'll leave it there for the moment but will pop back later. I do have a few more details and have managed to find a few map extracts which relate to the above action that Thomas took part in.

cheers, Jon

Hello Jon,

I am speechless, that is a wonderful piece of detective work, I would never have found that lot out myself, thankyou so much for your effort it is very much appreciated, and I am sure my Aunt (Thomas's only surving relative) will be most interested to know what happened to her father when I tell her what you have uncovered as he never talked about the war at all.

I will also be most interested to see any maps you have of the above actions.

Incidentally I have read a couple of posts on the forum about people sharing maps and photos etc via email, for the benefit of any members reading this, it is much better to use a free online storage account (dropbox.com is a good one) and then if you wish to share what you have uploaded you can just give out the file link to those that require it (if you share a lot this will save lots of time waiting for email uploads)

Kindest regards

Graham... Lol

[jay dubaya]

Graham,

appologies for the wait, follow the link below to my photobucket page which should lead you to a folder named thomas Abbott, you should find related maps and war diary extracts relating to the above. I haven't uploaded the pension papers but will gladly do so should you not already have copies,

cheers, Jon

http://s455.photobucket.com/user/OUjiMaFLiPS/library/Thomas%20Abbott

[GrahamA]

Hi Jon,

Thanks very much for your trouble, one of those maps maps includes the 'elusive' 'Ecluse' and 'Old French' trenches which I have been trying to find as it was mentioned in the Battalion diary, I have looked at dozens of maps online but nobody seemed to include those bits!.

I can also now find those map references given above and where the 13th slept out under the stars! If my quickly-learned map reading skills are correct it looks like the first camp was a kilometer or two East of where they stationed, but then just before the battle kicked off they moved to a second camp North and slightly to the West, i.e. a good distance away from their assembly trenches, I expect there is a reason for this but it's just that I don't know what it is.


No need for you to post the pension records thankyou all the same as I have managed to find these on the ancestry site I am currently a member of. .I read those medical records, Thomas was in pretty bad shape by the sound of it, it seems to be a miracle he survived at all, god bless him.


The one last thing I would like to try and piece together is the battle movements of the 13th's ABC and D companies in this particular action, i.e. 'who went where' I don't even know if this is possible to work out from the diaries and maps but perhaps someone has some knowledge and interest in this area and might be able to give a few pointers.


Thanks again for your work Jon, it's much appreciated.

P.S. I have mentioned you in despatches :-)

While researching my family tree, it seems I might have have several more relations who were in WW1 including one from the Second Bedfords who was KIA, I will post these in another thread just in case anyone else researches this family in future.