The Knoll - 31.08.1917

[Guest mikemph]

This is my first message on the forum and I apologise in advance for its length but I feel I should give members some of the history relating to my request for information. Many years ago my father passed on to me the Christmas 1914 tin which had belonged to his brother 41591 Corporal James John Hebden who served with the 17th Batallion West Yorkshire Regiment. One of the papers in the tin was a notification from No.2 Infantry Records, York (dated 16.07.18) to the effect that, having been missing since 31.08.17, my uncle was assumed to have died on that date. He has no known grave and is remembered on the Thiepval Memorial. In the early 70's I took my parents to France and we were able to see my uncle's name inscribed on the memorial. Over the years I have often wondered where my uncle was fighting when he died but I had little knowledge to go on and perhaps not the resolve to pursue the question. I recently purchased a copy of Captains Hepper's book - Great War Diary 1916-1919. I was now able to pinpoint the location of the regiment on the date in question and, looking at a map in another publication, I found a reference to The Knoll which is mentioned by Captain Heffer. Upon Googling 'The Knoll' I came across The Great War Forum and found several references with maps and photographs. With the help of Street View in Google Maps I have been able to view the area around Lempire and up the hill towards the Knoll. The picture therefore is almost complete and the only question I have is, does any member have a copy of The West Yorkshire Regiment in the War 1914 -1918. which would describe their actions on the date of my uncles death? Any information relating to 31.08.17. and the period leading up to that date would be appreciated.

[bantamforgot]

Mike,

Look under my profile for my email adress & contact me, I have some info. for you re. the 17th. W. Y.

Colin.

[nthornton1979]

Any information relating to 31.08.17. and the period leading up to that date would be appreciated.

Looks like 'The Knoll' saw a lot of fighting. This from Stephen McGreal's 'Cheshire Bantams':-

"The 15th (Service) Battalion the Cheshire Regiment in conjunction with the Sherwood Foresters on their left flank were given the task of capturing and consolidating the German trenches on the Knoll.

Scouting patrols had reported the Germans were expecting an attack as the wire on The Knoll had been extensively reinforced; there was also increased activity in the German saps and artillery activity."

"At zero hour the whistles blew, on their shrill command ranks of Tommies rose from their prone positions on the ground and for six minutes advanced into their destiny. The battalions advanced in two waves in a two company front, the 15th Cheshires had the 15th Sherwoods on their left flank. Complying with the plan the attacking waves halted within fifty yards of the creeping barrage; seven minutes after zero they rushed forward..... W Company led by Captain G.E. Schultz were the right assaulting party and were the first to make contact with the foe, several of the enemy were trapped in No Man's Land by the barrage and these were quickly disposed of.....Throughout the attack frontage the enemy was concealed in shell holes and the remnants of the opposing front trench. Both of our attacking companies were involved in fierce fights methodically crushing the scattered enemy.

The two assaulting companies pumped with adrenaline swept over the front line trench and followed hard on the heels of the barrage, reached the line they were to take up...Thirty minutes after zero hour the attackers were mopping up small parties of men, Lewis guns were set up in forward positions and gains were consolidated."

"The 15th Battalion's attack on The Knoll had cost the lives of Second Lieutenant J.Grace and 27 O.R's killed. Captain G.E. Schultz from Birkenhead, the leader of one of the assaulting companies, later died of his wounds, second Lieutenant C.F. Tissington commanding the reserve company and 96 O.R.'s wounded and 7 others were reported missing."

* Ignore the 'Bold' text. I've copied and pasted the above from my notes and that's my reference to someone I was researching and the 'Bold' won't change back to normal.

Neil

[Guest mikemph]

Thank you Colin and Neil for your replies.

Colin - I have sent you a personal email.

Mike

[bantamforgot]

Info. on it's way Mike.

Colin.

[washingline]

Can anyone enlighten me please. Sgt William Hurst 60264 15th Cheshires fell on 20/8/17. That is 11 days before the date referred to in the thread. His place of death is described as Bony. Commemorated in Treuddyn Flintshire. Does anyone know if that was near the Knoll and connected to the same action?

[bantamforgot]

Wahingline,

" Bony" is very close to the Knoll , 19 August 17 there was a major attack by the 15th. Cheshires/15th Sherwood Foresters on the German trenches on the Knoll , starting 19th. Aug. & continued for some days.

Colin.

[washingline]

Colin

many thanks for that sounds like my man was involved unfortunately for him then. I have an inquiry in with the Cheshire's museum researcher also so he may elaborate further. thank you.