Dave66 Posted 14 January , 2018 Share Posted 14 January , 2018 38 minutes ago, GWF1967 said: Short of knocking the "cornflakes" off a relic, or cleaning off light surface rust to read markings, I like to leave them as I find them. You and I both in the majority of cases, and i do wish people would leave things alone....but the damage on mine was already done so didn't have much option. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 14 January , 2018 Share Posted 14 January , 2018 (edited) On 25/03/2017 at 10:24, trajan said: Overlooked one on display... So - ye gods, I have eleven! Where did they all come from! A Mk II, EFD, "(0)2 02", with a blurred right ricasso marking that looks to be the bottom of a '16'... BUT, it is under a "crown/35/RE" stamp, and the '16' stamps seem to go with a "crown /X.../ E" stamp (e.g., post no. 195), so, probably not. Either way, this one does not have a "multiple marking" left ricasso, so that makes it (from the above), eleven I know of that are, but 24 that are not... Again, I stress that my collection of these P.1888's is a random one, and with only two from eleven of mine being "multiple-marked" it looks to be that these "multiple marked" examples are the more unusual. What is needed though is for somebody with time to spare (so, not me!) to check through them all and see if there are recurrent years or not ('04' seems to crop up a lot) that match inspector stamps, then we can test the beloved 'regular inspection' a tad more. Julian Trajan, I considered that an imperial request, so did my duty as a good centurion...... I have so far logged 38 P.1888's (25 x EFD; 3 x MOLE; 4 x SAND; 6 x WILK) of which 16 have re-issue dates and 22 do not. Dates of manufacture (DOM) are, respectively: 89 90 90 91 91 92 92 93 94 95 96 98 01 01 and 2 x not seen (Re-issue dated) and 91 92 92 92 92 93 93/5 94 94 95 95 95 96 96 96 96 96 98 01 01 01 02 (Not re-issue dated). There does not appear to be any pattern that I can discern. Gap between re-issue dates is 2, 3 ,5, even 7 yrs; latest re-issue date is 1916 for a DOM of 1901 !!! Re-issue dates are: 91 93 94 95 96 98 2 x 99 7 x 00 5 x 03 3 x 04 2 x 05 06 07 and 4 x 16 (Great War ?) Does the Second Boer War (1899-1902) account for the 2x99, 7x00 and 5x03 data ?? Given that production of the P.1888 started at RSAF in 1889, and the 91 re-issue date is on a DOM 89 bayonet, it seems that the initial gap was possibly set at 2 yrs.[Re-reading that, probably an unjustified conclusion.] These data were originally collected as an afterthought to recording the initial inspector stamps upon manufacture, so I have no other info, such as regimental markings. Regards, JMB Edited 16 November , 2019 by JMB1943 typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 18 January , 2018 Share Posted 18 January , 2018 On 1/15/2018 at 01:55, JMB1943 said: Trajan, I considered that an imperial request, so did my duty as a good centurion......Re-issue dates are: 91 93 94 95 96 98 2 x 99 7 x 00 5 x 03 3 x 04 2 x 05 06 07 and 4 x 16 (Great War ?) ... Does the Second Boer War (1899-1902) account for the 2x99, 7x00 and 5x03 data ?? ...Given that production of the P.1888 started at RSAF in 1989, and the 91 re-issue date is on a DOM 89 bayonet, it seems that the initial gap was possibly set at 2 yrs.[Re-reading that, probably an unjustified conclusion.] Many thanks me'lad! I had started to collect similar data but as with so many things I get started on, term comes along with students, then the boys and their homework, etc... Oh, and the cooking schedule interrupts as well from time to time! But I am very glad that you saw fit to do this, as only by having such data to hand, even in rough format, can this matter of 're-issue' dates on these things start to make sense - or not, as the case might be! One thing that has always struck me, though, is how "proportionally-wise"(!) there seem to be more P.1888's around with these 'reissue' marks than Pre-GW or GW period P.1907's... Any thoughts on that? Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 16 November , 2019 Share Posted 16 November , 2019 (edited) I thought I’d add this latest addition here, nothing special but I just liked the unit markings and thought it may prove interesting to others. A fairly standard Mk1 2nd type, manufactured by Sanderson in feb 1899 with no other inspection/re-issue stamps. Blade is excellent, but all other metal areas were covered in surface rust, fortunately not too invasive, left some staining but I quite like that so will leave as is. Originally issued to the 4th volunteer battalion South Wales Borderers ( not sure of boer war service but a contingent was sent) then in 1904 sidelined to the cadet corps attached to the 4th (note the different size of stamps used on the pommel). Not as such matching numbers, but scabbard date is same as issued piece (99), there’s obviously been a mix up of scabbards at some point but nice to see a fairly original pairing with unusual markings. Dave. Edited 16 November , 2019 by Dave66 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWF1967 Posted 16 November , 2019 Share Posted 16 November , 2019 10 minutes ago, Dave66 said: I thought I’d add this latest addition here, nothing special but I just liked the unit markings and thought it may prove interesting to others. A fairly standard Mk1 2nd type, manufactured by Sanderson in feb 1899 with no other inspection/re-issue stamps. Blade is excellent, but all other metal areas were covered in surface rust, fortunately not too invasive, left some staining but I quite like that so will leave as is. Originally issued to the 4th volunteer battalion South Wales Borderers ( not sure of boer war service but a contingent was sent) then in 1904 sidelined to the cadet corps attached to the 4th (note the different size of stamps used on the pommel). Not as such matching numbers, but scabbard date is same as issued piece (99), there’s obviously been a mix up of scabbards at some point but nice to see a fairly original pairing with unusual markings. Dave. Very nice Dave. My winter work is locally based. Unfortunately my favourite local junk shop closed down a few months back, and my local antique shop last month, so I haven't had much time to rummage recently and I haven't found one for sale in a while; it's nice to see they are still out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 16 November , 2019 Share Posted 16 November , 2019 (edited) 40 minutes ago, GWF1967 said: Very nice Dave. My winter work is locally based. Unfortunately my favourite local junk shop closed down a few months back, and my local antique shop last month, so I haven't had much time to rummage recently and I haven't found one for sale in a while; it's nice to see they are still out there. Struggling to find them here GWF (only 2nd this year), an awful lot of these places have gone by the wayside locally here as well, I can’t seem to find much militaria as I used to full stop, even with the online chaps these old timers are far fewer than they were and prices are rising, such a shame....it’s harder work for us collectors. I had to pay decent money for that one which hurt, an antique dealer that “never does the internet” but always seems to have a fairly good idea of price!! Dave. Edited 16 November , 2019 by Dave66 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 16 November , 2019 Share Posted 16 November , 2019 Dave, What a nice pairing of bayonet and scabbard. I think that this is the first time that I have seen the markings on a P.88 scabbard, and very sharp still! Any maker's marks on the locket or chape? Regards, JMB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 17 November , 2019 Share Posted 17 November , 2019 29 minutes ago, JMB1943 said: Dave, What a nice pairing of bayonet and scabbard. I think that this is the first time that I have seen the markings on a P.88 scabbard, and very sharp still! Any maker's marks on the locket or chape? Regards, JMB It certainly is unusual to be able to read them JMB, metal parts stained but from what I can see locket has crown/B/8 and chape has crown/B/3. Any thoughts welcome. Kindest regards, Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 17 November , 2019 Share Posted 17 November , 2019 Dave, Crown/B/8 & crown/B/3 seem similar to the marking on the scabbard, crown/B/83--or is it? Looking again at that, even with a glass, I can't decide on B or E. How does it look in hand?? Is the bayonet made by SANDERSON? If so, then maybe they sent inspectors up from Birmingham to Sheffield. Regards, JMB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 17 November , 2019 Share Posted 17 November , 2019 47 minutes ago, JMB1943 said: Dave, Crown/B/8 & crown/B/3 seem similar to the marking on the scabbard, crown/B/83--or is it? Looking again at that, even with a glass, I can't decide on B or E. How does it look in hand?? Is the bayonet made by SANDERSON? If so, then maybe they sent inspectors up from Birmingham to Sheffield. Regards, JMB Bayonet is Sanderson, with the standard Sanderson S inspection stamps, I’m fairly sure all the scabbard markings are B and not E even though similar I’m appearance....interesting to seen if RSAF either supplied or just inspected Sanderson scabbards. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 19 November , 2019 Share Posted 19 November , 2019 Excellent Post there Jscott, I love the way you introduce each with the unit’s history. As a collector, I love that. Is there a major book to be had that covers most or ( hope) all U.K. Unit, regiment markings? Everyone has heard of various British units and So. African, but did the Irish, Scott’s and Welsh also have their own unique “Named” unit’s as well? As far as collecting, I have seen a few (long version) Indian pattern bayonets, I do not have one, but are they also popular with collections? Again, great presentation there,loved reading it, hope there will be more to follow, Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toby Brayley Posted 19 November , 2019 Share Posted 19 November , 2019 (edited) I have a bit of a thing for P1888. Here are my Mk1 3 rivets. No unit markings except for S20 on Pommel. Lots of inspection markings etc. Edited 19 November , 2019 by Toby Brayley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 21 November , 2019 Share Posted 21 November , 2019 On 19/11/2019 at 19:30, Toby Brayley said: I have a bit of a thing for P1888. Here are my Mk1 3 rivets. No unit markings except for S20 on Pommel. Lots of inspection markings etc. Excellent Toby...love them all. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrylee Posted 21 November , 2019 Share Posted 21 November , 2019 So have I! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 21 November , 2019 Share Posted 21 November , 2019 Toby & Terry, Wonderful, wonderful! Either my screen has a distinctly green tint, or........ Regards, JMB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 21 November , 2019 Share Posted 21 November , 2019 Another fine collection, i am particularly jealous of that Mk 3 second from bottom. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
battle of loos Posted 22 November , 2019 Share Posted 22 November , 2019 (edited) good morning, superb collection here's my copy. Markings: 14 C.L. dated August 1899 manufactured by Enfield (if I'm not mistaken). regards michel Edited 22 November , 2019 by battle of loos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWF1967 Posted 27 April , 2021 Share Posted 27 April , 2021 New addition. 2/94 dated. Marked to 1 CAM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave66 Posted 27 April , 2021 Share Posted 27 April , 2021 Nice to see a new 1888, thanks for posting GWF. I have number 663 to the 1sr Cameron highlanders but mine is a later 11 97 Wilkinson, presumably replacing ones like yours which were reduced from service, inspection stamps on mine are 04 and 05. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 27 April , 2021 Share Posted 27 April , 2021 GWF, I echo Dave's sentiments--another honest-to-goodness Patt. 88 at last; seems like forever since we have seen one! First that I have seen with the RR (condemned??) stamp. Also, some history with the 1 CAM overstruck on something else; made in 2 '93 (?) and re-inspected '95, '96, '97 and '99. Regards, JMB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 2 May , 2021 Share Posted 2 May , 2021 As with JMB, nice to see one of these again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWF1967 Posted 2 May , 2021 Share Posted 2 May , 2021 (edited) On 27/04/2021 at 20:14, JMB1943 said: First that I have seen with the RR (condemned??) stamp. And then another turns up within two days! On 27/04/2021 at 17:51, Dave66 said: Nice to see a new 1888, thanks for posting GWF. 1 hour ago, trajan said: As with JMB, nice to see one of these again! Thanks. I seem powerless to resist! Edited 2 May , 2021 by GWF1967 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BORSETTI Posted 2 May , 2021 Share Posted 2 May , 2021 Superb bayonets and superb collections, very pretty to look at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 2 May , 2021 Share Posted 2 May , 2021 On 21/11/2019 at 14:35, Terrylee said: So have I! Terry, These five P. 88's display 2 (3?) different shapings at the ricasso. Could you give the maker's name for each of these? Regards, \JMB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrylee Posted 3 May , 2021 Share Posted 3 May , 2021 JMB, Top to bottom: Mk I Enfield (2.90) Mk I(2) Wilkinson (12.97) Mk II Wilkinson (5.02) Mk III Sanderson (2.05) South African Railways (WW II) Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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