17107BM Posted 17 May , 2013 Share Posted 17 May , 2013 Hello all. I will be over again in a few weeks and was looking to do a walk from Paul Reeds guide of the area. The Bluff- Hill 60. The Battalion War Diary for the 47th Battalion A.I.F. Dated 14.2.18 Puts them at Crater dugouts... ' Crater dugouts are long driven trenches, into the spoilbank of the Ypres- Comines Canal and filled with bunks- electric light and provide accommodation for 400 ranks. The ventalation is by fan, but the tunnels are damp and Sanitation is not all that could be desired' The Diary also makes mention of Gaspes dugout, being similar in contruction, but a lot more dry... I have the maps i need IG and so on. What i need to know is, can i get to these parts of the canal and view it from both banks. I do not know this part of the Salient in detail. So, welcome your replies. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beselare Posted 21 May , 2013 Share Posted 21 May , 2013 I am not sure where the positions you described are situated. However, it is possible to walk down both banks of the canal. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17107BM Posted 24 May , 2013 Author Share Posted 24 May , 2013 Hello Beselare. First, thanks for your reply. The location of Canal Dugouts is just back from lock6. As the canal takes a sharp bend towards a road or path that crosses the canal. Canal Dugouts are on the opposite bank to the Hollbeke side. The trench system on the other side would be Oak Row and Oak Avenue trench system. I wonder if this land can be walked on? Any background on this area would be very welcome. I still need a location for Crater Dugouts. Cheers all. G.K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beselare Posted 27 May , 2013 Share Posted 27 May , 2013 Hi GK The best place to park your car to visit the Oak Row/Avenue trench system is at the Palingbeek nature reserve car park. From Ypres, drive out to Shrapnel Corner and then turn left towards Hill 60. Go past the Hill 60 turnoff and after a few hundred yards you will see a turning to the right for Palingbeek. Go down that road and park your car near to the cafe. Then go down the steps to the canal. At the bottom of the steps, just to your left, is the remains of a German bunker. You are now opposite Oak Row and Oak Avenue trenches. Cross the canal and climb up the bank. There is a fence surroundilng the golf club area, but directly in front of you was Oak Row. Like yourself, I cannot find any reference to Crater Dugouts. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17107BM Posted 27 May , 2013 Author Share Posted 27 May , 2013 Bob. Many thanks. As always on these trips, time is always against you. I think Crater Dugouts will have to wait for another trip. If i can blend in this piecce of the Battle Field with Paul's guide to the area that will fit in fine with our trip. Thanks for your help. Gary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Evans Posted 27 May , 2013 Share Posted 27 May , 2013 Gary, Is it possible that Crater Dugouts are further West, at the Bluff? Both extracts are a bit earlier than your date - April 1917 Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17107BM Posted 29 May , 2013 Author Share Posted 29 May , 2013 Gary, Is it possible that Crater Dugouts are further West, at the Bluff? Both extracts are a bit earlier than your date - April 1917 Phil Phil. Sorry for the delay in replying as it has took some time to look at your suggestion. I can still not find a location for Crater Dugouts, but thanks for posting. As is the way of these things i will find it when i get back. I do have another trip in August, so can give it another go then. Cheers all. G.K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyJohnson Posted 30 May , 2013 Share Posted 30 May , 2013 Gary Previous post http://1914-1918.inv...howtopic=160494 may be of some help re the Bluff although it doesn't directly mention Crater Dugouts. I cannot find reference to Crater Dugouts, but as already said there are any number of craters in the area of The Bluff. I've checked all trenchmaps with the Linesman software and can see no mention of Crater Dugouts. Phil's reply above looks good for craters. These are directly in front of The Bluff and are still there and visible and with the water in them look quite eerie . I was there a month ago and you could stand on top of The Bluff, but I was there 10 days ago as well, and there's now a fence in preventing 'easy' access onto the actual Bluff. I was regaling Wolverhampton WFA with the story of Harold Bache who was killed there 15th Feb 1916. The attached map (17-07-1918) from Linesman shows a number of tunnels further east towards Lock 6 - possible? Andy PS There's an excellent little booklet which I got from the Ypres Museum called "From The Bluff to die Grosse Bastion, Palingbeek during the First World War". I phoned the museum and ordered it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick D Posted 31 May , 2013 Share Posted 31 May , 2013 I've got that booklet, I'll have a look to see if it mentions this area. Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17107BM Posted 2 June , 2013 Author Share Posted 2 June , 2013 Thanks to all that have posted. Andy. I wonder if in deed, these Dugouts are the same location just renamed? Thanks in advance for any help. Cheers. G.K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrislock Posted 2 June , 2013 Share Posted 2 June , 2013 And what the booklet does not tell you, is that this area is a huge WW2 battlefield also. The WW2 ceremonies which took place there last week confirmed this! Enjoy your trip, you really are traversing the battlefields of two world wars when you visit here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17107BM Posted 3 June , 2013 Author Share Posted 3 June , 2013 Thanks Chrislock. We have now decided to give the area a full day to explore, but i doubt this will be enough. Set sail on Friday so any more contribution to the thread welcomed. Cheers all. G.K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howell1914 Posted 9 November , 2014 Share Posted 9 November , 2014 Sorry top join this debate so late. Re: The Bluffs entrench events, etc. My grandfather, who commanded the 4th Hussars at the time of First Battle of Ypres (October 1914) mentions defending a sector near the Ypres-Comines Canal on 31st October 1914. In a letter to my grandmother he describes 4 Hussars digging solid entrenchments along the canal near to a bridge. This was overlooked by a small hill. Close to Hollebecke. On his left 4th Hussar covered the left flank of a rearguard including elements of 2 Gren, a mile away, and IG beyond. These were the remaining units at that time required to "hold the line at all costs" (Corps Commander order). As this day was perhaps the most significant action of the First Battle of Ypres and in turning the tide of the "race to the sea", I am interested to find the exact spot that he and the 4th Hussars held that sector of the line for 24 hours, also infilading the German attack on several occasions. The Grenadiers wee a depleted force commanded by Major Lord Bernard Gordon-Lennox, who sent my grandfather a request to "please hang on at all costs" along with a company of 200 French troops. Please enlighten me, or are the entrenchments at The Bluffs the spot? Many thanks, Jamie Howell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howell1914 Posted 9 November , 2014 Share Posted 9 November , 2014 Oh I forgot to mention, my grandfather at the time held the rank of Major (Philip Howell) - he survived until the late actions of the Battle of the Somme in November 1916, with the full rank of Brigadier-General (aged 37), and BGGS of II Corps. I am pretty sure the position held was North of Hollebecke, and stretched along from Hill 60 to the West - along the canal. A copy of he letter describing the entrenchments on the canal is attached Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Posted 7 July , 2018 Share Posted 7 July , 2018 Hello, I've just come across this forum, and this post. I've signed up as I'm transcribing the War Diaries of the 16th Australian Infantry Battalion and have found information relevant to this post and the area is of interest to me also. The entry for the 26th January 1918 contains information on the "Crater Dugouts" that you have been seeking. "26-1-18 Very foggy day throughout and work in the air impossible. Owing to the expected arrival of reinforcements, further accommodation had to be found. 1 Company ("B") was sent to Tunnel dug-outs at GASPAR CLIFFS O.4.b.55.50 leaving two Companies ("A" and "D") only with Headquarters in CRATER dug-outs I.34.c.11. Reinforcements:- 3 Officers, 90 Other Ranks arrived at 7p.m. Very quiet day throughout. Casualties: nil. Sickness: nil." Link to image of original followed by the link to the whole months diary. There may be more information in the appendices (see page 143 for a map) , but I'm not up to them yet. https://s3-ap-southeast-2.amazonaws.com/awm-media/collection/RCDIG1004818/large/4937530.JPG https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/C1343396?image=5 As an aside, I'll be floating around the area in early November 2018. I'll be touring the sites of the 16th's travels from about the 24th October 2018 in Belgium then through France until the 14th November 2018. Spending Armistice Day in Picquigny, west of Amiens, as did the original Battalion. Will have full A.I.F. kit, minus weapons and an 11th Bn reenacter and a Lady.... Just in case there is anything you guys have going that could use a couple of fat hairy Aussie's :-) Derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17107BM Posted 7 July , 2018 Author Share Posted 7 July , 2018 Thanks. And welcome. I will have a go at the map reference. 1.34.c.11. Any members who know this site, your input will be very welcome. Cheers, Gary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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