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Charles E Marslen


LarsL
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I am looking for details about Sergeant Charles E Marslen (9479) in the 7th batt Royal Fusilers (City of London Regiment). He was KIA 15 Sep 1916 and is buried at "Bully-Grenay Communal Cemetery, British Extension".

I strongly suspect him to be my great grandfather even if the marriage certificate identifies him as "Charles Cook". I am also in contact with other descendants to his family who are trying to get more details.

The details I know until now is that he was born 1881 in Camberwell and was married (again?) in 28 Jun 1916, less that three month before he was killed. His parents were Henry and Elisabeth Marslen. He also had a brother, Reginald Victor Marslen who was also KIA 19 Jul 1916.His surname is sometimes transcribed as "Marslem".

I would very much like to know which civilian occupation Charles had when enrolled and what his battallion was doing in September 1916.

Sincerely:

Lars Larsson (in Sweden)

Charles Marslen death from Soldiers Died.pdf

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Morning Lars,

I do not have the War Diary but have these notes which may help a little,

11th September 1916: The Battalion relieved the H.A.C. as 'A' Battalion in Colonnel. C.D.A. Companies were in the front line in the order named. B Company being in support in Calonne.

* 12-14th September 1916: During this tour a great deal more work was done to improve the existing trenches, both support & fire trenches. Work was also carried out on new fire trenches. Patrols went out every night but found no trace of the enemy. A great deal more wire was put out along our front. [despite 'no trace of the enemy' the entry for 14th Sept continues] "Casualties:- 2nd Lieutenant Dimant was wounded..."

Regards,

Graeme

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Hi, I also have this note from the Surrey Recruitment Register (FindMyPast):

First Name(s) C E

Last Name Marslen

Unit Royal Fusiliers

Series: Volunteers, 31st August 1914 - 4th January 1915

Regiment: Royal Fusiliers

Reference: 2496 / 1

Page number: 145

Age: 33 Years 2 Months

Height: 5ft 7in.

Weight (pounds): 146

Chest size (inches): 37.5

Chest Expansion (inches): 2.5

Eye colour:

Hair colour:

Distinctive marks:

Occupation: Steward

Birthplace: Camberwell

County: Surrey

Attestation date: 14 November 1914

Attestation place: Wimbledon

Remarks:

Notes: Volunteers. This recruitment register has B written on the spine.

Can this be the same person? The initials, age, birtplace and regiment correspond but the reference number (2496/1) is different from the earler mentioned regimental number (9479) (?). Also he was enrolled as "Steward"! Could he became a Sergeant later?

-- Lars

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  • 8 years later...

Hi,

Referring to my earlier postages I wonder if anyone has found any more info on Charles Marslen or Reginald Victor Marslen? Since 2013 I have found proof (via DNA) that Charles really IS my great grandfather 😁. If there are more information to find I will forward it to my newly found relatives.

Sincerely:

Lars

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11 minutes ago, LarsL said:

Hi,

Referring to my earlier postages I wonder if anyone has found any more info on Charles Marslen or Reginald Victor Marslen? Since 2013 I have found proof (via DNA) that Charles really IS my great grandfather 😁. If there are more information to find I will forward it to my newly found relatives.

Sincerely:

Lars

We now have access to the surviving pension records.

image.png

A pension was paid to his wife Beatrice for her and 2 children, one of whom later died at age 9 months.

https://www.fold3.com/image/669209611?terms=marslen,9479

Craig

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His Medal Roll [found on Ancestry] for his British War Medal and Victory Medal as GS/9479, Royal Fusiliers, records his full name to be Charles Edward MARSLEM [this surname is used on the corresponding Medal Index Card - also found on Ancestry/Fold3 and at the National Archives https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D3951712]

The Roll shows his first theatre of war service as being 1(a) [France] 

It also also shows that had served with 8 RF, 29.12.15 to 21.3.16, prior to 7 RF, 23.7.16 to 15.9.16 [to his death].

:-) M

Edit: 'Soldiers Died in the Great War' [see Ancestry] has the following: 

Name: Charles Edward Marslem
Birth Place: Camberwell
Residence: Wimbledon
Death Date: 15 Sep 1916
Death Place: France and Flanders
Enlistment Place: Wimbledon
Rank: Sergeant
Regiment: London Regiment
Battalion: 7th Battalion
Regimental Number: 9479
Type of Casualty: Killed in action
Theatre of War: Western European Theatre

CWGC also have him as C E MARSLEM https://www.cwgc.org/find-records/find-war-dead/casualty-details/30270/C E MARSLEM

= It certainly looks like MARSLEM was his Army alias.

Edited by Matlock1418
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On 17/05/2013 at 07:43, LarsL said:

I strongly suspect him to be my great grandfather even if the marriage certificate identifies him as "Charles Cook". I am also in contact with other descendants to his family who are trying to get more details.

When was this marriage ?

Craig

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This is the marriage from the Pension Cards. She remarried in 1919,.

marslen-marriage.jpg.d536d9918596e6b54aa39a86077659e0.jpg

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1 hour ago, ss002d6252 said:

When was this marriage ?

Apr/May/Jun 1916

Charles E MARSLEN married Beatrice Elizabeth HENRY [HENRY being the surname of Beatrice Elizabeth's daughter Beatrice Mabel on pension card]

:-) M

Edit: @corisande we crossed! 

 

Edited by Matlock1418
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Just now, Matlock1418 said:

Apr/May/Jun 1916

Charles E MARSLEN married Beatrice Elizabeth HENRY [HENRY being the surname of Beatrice Elizabeth's daughter Beatrice Mabel on pension card]

:-) M

 

It was the other marriage that I was curious about, the one where he was married as "Charles Cook".

Craig

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But the family believe that this is him in an 1897 marriage

I have not yet cracked why they think he is the same man as married as Charles Edward Marslen in 1916

cook-marriage.jpg.dc422fb7d32fe2e95855a29ee447aa8f.jpg

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4 minutes ago, ss002d6252 said:

It was the other marriage that I was curious about, the one where he was married as "Charles Cook".

 

3 minutes ago, corisande said:

I have not yet cracked why they think he is the same man as married as Charles Edward Marslen in 1916

It's floating around on a Family Tree for Charles Edward MARSLEN on Ancestry. ;-/

:-) M

Edit: @corisandeAgain we cross!!

Edited by Matlock1418
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Just now, Matlock1418 said:

It's floating around on a Family Tree for Charles Edward MARSLEN on Ancestry. ;-/

 

Yes I know that, I am trying to establish why they think that

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Marslen/Cook re-emerged in Scotlans in 1905. That shows beyond any doubt that they married as Cook, but reverted to Marslen soon afterwards

I suspect he may have been a derserter (or perhaps fleeing an earlier marriage ) to marry as Cook

cook-marslen.jpg.defa69ae46ad504f01200508a552b4f9.jpg

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The birth registration used in the Family Tree is as Charles Edwin MARSLEN - this is the GRO entry:

Name:                                                              Mother's Maiden Surname: 

MARSLEN, CHARLES  EDWIN                           BOWDEN  

GRO Reference: 1881  D Quarter in CAMBERWELL  Volume 01D  Page 782

:-) M

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This Ancestry tree records the various tooing and froing wwith The couple

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/108811906/person/162197310924/facts

But does not explain why he used Cook

But is is clear why the Swedish OP set out to verify the family tale of how his branch came to be in Sweden

Edited by corisande
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Charles Edward Cook/Marslen

born Oct/Dec 1881

married 19 Oct 1897

so he married on about his 16th birthday. Guess that is why he used an alias

The family have been looking a long time - this on Rootschat in 2010

Edited by corisande
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5 minutes ago, Matlock1418 said:

 

It's floating around on a Family Tree for Charles Edward MARSLEN on Ancestry. ;-/

:-) M

Edit: @corisandeAgain we cross!!

Hi everyone,

Yes, this is a rather fantasic story. I have been convinced since 2013 that my maternal great grandfather is Charles Edwin Marslen (1881-1916). The problem is that he was only 15 years old when he married 30 year old Katherine Payn in 1897. None of the families approved to this marriage, not surprizing. So they lied both at the marriage. He added 4 years to his actual age and she reduced her age with 6 years! Charles was also underaged and must have presented a false certificate where he said that his surname was Cook and his father was Arthur Cook (deceased).

Charles and Katherine got a daughter Mary Kathleen in 1898 where she got the surname Marslen. The fathers name is still Cook in the birth certificate. Then in 1905 my grandmother Muriel Hedvig was born in Glasgow. In her birth notice she has surname Marslen and also her father.

Katherines father referres in his will to his daughter as "Clarissa Katherine Marslen who assumed and took the name of Cook at her marriage but nevertheless is married to Charles Marslen”.

All this made me believe that Charles Marslen is the man who married Katherine Payn in 1897. However, I didn´t have a real proof until this year when I got a close DNA match with the grandson of Charles Marslens sister, Kathleen Marslen.

The couple separated soon after Muriels birth and Katherine took her two daughters and moved to Sweden where she already had a sister. So that is how I are involved.

I don´t know if they divorced properly after that. If they didn´t, Charles must have married Beatrice Henry in bigamy?

The pension record gave me a surprize. If Charles got a daughter out of wedlock before he married Beatrice, then maybe there is descendants of her. I will certainly try to find that out.

Thank you for all information, I hope I have made some things clearer.

Lars Larsson (in Skövde Sweden)

 

Kathleens birth.jpg

Muriels birth.jpg

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24 minutes ago, LarsL said:

The pension record gave me a surprize. If Charles got a daughter out of wedlock before he married Beatrice, then maybe there is descendants of her. I will certainly try to find that out.

 

This seems to be the right baptism in Middleton, Norfolk

beatrice-1915.jpg.d8c7544884e2d11da974d68f1049131c.jpg

She appears to marry in Middleton in 1934

beatrice-marriage.jpg.bf14b2886c549cbed1e2391b46ab1465.jpg

And she went on to have 4 children of her own by this marriage

My guess would be that she was brought up by the grandparents

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1 hour ago, LarsL said:

The pension record gave me a surprize.

We are pleased you liked it - see above - a very valuable new resource from the WFA/Fold3

Certainly the new revelation of Beatrice Mabel HENRY is a nice new avenue for you to follow.

A little bit of explanation about the pension and children's allowances that were granted.  These figures were awarded per week [assuming that she did not later remarry when she would lose the widow's pension in favour of a one-off re-marriage gratuity - a child's allowance would continue until aged 16]

We can conclude from the reduction of 4/2 [4 shillings and 2 pennies] from the 25/5 pension and children's allowances on the death of her young son that it was the 1917 Royal Warrant that was being used [then 4/2 was for a second child] - taking it down to 21/3

An allowance of 5/- was for the first child so then we can see that her pension was 16/3 [presumably the rate for a sergeant's widow]

His widow, Beatrice Elizabeth, was under 45 years old and so did not get an additional age supplement [of 1/3] added to her pension.

The Grant that was paid in Aug 1917 was probably the death grant for extra expenses incurred because of her husband's death - often used for newspaper inserts.  At that time was £3 [60/-]

Unfortunately the main pension awards file is long lost/deliberately destroyed after its use was ended - typically when his widow had remarried or died and the child reached 16 years old -  so we can't see the full details.

The claim was made/recorded DEAD in 1931 so the daughter's 16th birthday seems quite likely to have signalled the end of the claim.

:-) M

Edit: Looking at other records it does rather look like his widow remarried [in 1919, quite a bit before the claim ended in 1931] but slightly unusually this is not recorded on the pension card - then again the card wasn't the whole awards file!  Typically in 1919 a one-off re-marriage gratuity of one year of widow's pension would be awarded.

Edited by Matlock1418
edit/correct year of widow's remarriage & expand
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Lars I can see you've not a lot if information in your tree about their brother Henry...I hope this snippet from the Buckinghamshire Advertiser, Sep 20th, 1930. helps. Courtesy of the British Newspaper Archive.

 

 

Snap 2021-09-19 at 17.52.59.png

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