kingo30 Posted 21 April , 2013 Share Posted 21 April , 2013 Hi this is my first post and I am trying to find out further info on the above soldier, he is my great great uncle and died of wounds on 6/12/1917 I believe he would. ave suffered the injuries in action on the 30th november were the south lancs were decimated and no one returned. My great great grandad I believe was also captured in this action after being wounded. Thomas was awarded the MM at some point but I cannot find out if it was in this action. My mother always said that her grandad was wounded and captured by the germans but his brother died refusing to give up the trench to the germans and was given a medal, she never said more than that and has sadly passed away so i cant ask anymore. Can anyone help with either soldier i do not know my great grandads first name other than his surname was povey and he served in the south lancs with thomas and both from st helens. http://www.sthelensrollsofhonour.co.uk/casualty-967-Thomas_Povey.html The above link has a little more info, they lived in college st, st helens this is were i was born in 1969 albeit at number 49. Thanks for any help. Trevor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Nulty Posted 21 April , 2013 Share Posted 21 April , 2013 Trevor Welcome to the forum If you look on my website at the page for Harry Garrett Whitaker, you'll find a little more about the November action, including an image of the war diary for that date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingo30 Posted 21 April , 2013 Author Share Posted 21 April , 2013 Thanks its all very interesting, I cant find anything about his military medal or when it was issued. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
little bob Posted 21 April , 2013 Share Posted 21 April , 2013 Trevor Have a look at the London Gazette 11th January 1918 1ssue 30476 page 841 Thomas 's Medal Index Card shows that he landed in France 13th February 1915. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingo30 Posted 21 April , 2013 Author Share Posted 21 April , 2013 Thanks Bob if it was issued in 1918 I could presume that is it was more than likley the action on the 30th november 1917 ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
little bob Posted 21 April , 2013 Share Posted 21 April , 2013 Hopefully someone will come along and either confirm or correct me , I believe that the London Gazette for 14th January 1918 refers to operations around Ypres during September/October 1917. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitchener's Bugle Posted 21 April , 2013 Share Posted 21 April , 2013 Hi Kingo30, I will check the local newspapers for you to see if there is any mention of his MM, or an outside chance of a picture of Sgt Povey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingo30 Posted 21 April , 2013 Author Share Posted 21 April , 2013 Hi Kingo30, I will check the local newspapers for you to see if there is any mention of his MM, or an outside chance of a picture of Sgt Povey. Thanks for that its very much appreciated just ashame no family around anymore to ask. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin ss002d6252 Posted 22 April , 2013 Admin Share Posted 22 April , 2013 240365 John Povey would have to be a good option for your great granddad. http://search.ancest...rc=&pid=5656047 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Nulty Posted 22 April , 2013 Share Posted 22 April , 2013 240365 Sgt John Povey lived at 77 Central Street in 1917. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingo30 Posted 22 April , 2013 Author Share Posted 22 April , 2013 Thanks that fits in with the cenus of 1901 but 1911 says jack povey but to me thats an error as john povey is buried in st helens cemetary with jane povey. Johns age fits in with (jack) and 1971 is about the year he died. Povey is not a common name in st helens I always remember my nan saying if they have the surname povey we will be related someway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingo30 Posted 22 April , 2013 Author Share Posted 22 April , 2013 My grandmothers name was elizabeth povey born approx 1914 so if john is her father then thats a definate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Nulty Posted 22 April , 2013 Share Posted 22 April , 2013 The Absent Voters List showed dozens of men from Central Street serving. Along with 240365 John Povey at No 77 were 240338 Wm Robinson (No 75), 240337 Thos Gornall (79) and 240335 Thos Jackman (No 85). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingo30 Posted 22 April , 2013 Author Share Posted 22 April , 2013 Wow did the whole street join up together Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Nulty Posted 22 April , 2013 Share Posted 22 April , 2013 Trevor, I've sent you a Personal Message Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IRC Kevin Posted 22 April , 2013 Share Posted 22 April , 2013 Thanks its all very interesting, I cant find anything about his military medal or when it was issued. It's highly likely that the original recommendation sent by Battalion to Division will be amongst the 'Jeudwine Papers' in the Liverpool Record Office, which though currently closed for refurbishment, is reopening some time next month. Catalogue numbers 356 FIF/6/6/25/1 and 356 FIF/6/6/25/2 (he could be either one) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingo30 Posted 22 April , 2013 Author Share Posted 22 April , 2013 It's highly likely that the original recommendation sent by Battalion to Division will be amongst the 'Jeudwine Papers' in the Liverpool Record Office, which though currently closed for refurbishment, is reopening some time next month. Catalogue numbers 356 FIF/6/6/25/1 and 356 FIF/6/6/25/2 (he could be either one) Thanks when I am back in st helens visiting my family I will visit. I live in Essex after leaving the kings regiment 20 odd years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Lees Posted 22 April , 2013 Share Posted 22 April , 2013 It's highly likely that the original recommendation sent by Battalion to Division will be amongst the 'Jeudwine Papers' in the Liverpool Record Office, which though currently closed for refurbishment, is reopening some time next month. Catalogue numbers 356 FIF/6/6/25/1 and 356 FIF/6/6/25/2 (he could be either one) There is no citation to Povey amongst the Jeudwine papers. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingo30 Posted 22 April , 2013 Author Share Posted 22 April , 2013 There is no citation to Povey amongst the Jeudwine papers. Ken Thanks so It will be impossible to trace what it was for ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IRC Kevin Posted 22 April , 2013 Share Posted 22 April , 2013 There is no citation to Povey amongst the Jeudwine papers. Ken This suggests that it was prior to the South Lancs going to 55th Divisionin Jan 16, so maybe with the 4th or 36th Division? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Lees Posted 22 April , 2013 Share Posted 22 April , 2013 As his MM was gazetted in 1918 it is likely that the citation is not amongst those that survived. Many did not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IRC Kevin Posted 22 April , 2013 Share Posted 22 April , 2013 As his MM was gazetted in 1918 it is likely that the citation is not amongst those that survived. Many did not. I didn't know that, Ken- I won't be doing my search through the 164th Brigade until Whit. Sorry, Kingo30- I built your hopes up for nothing there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Lees Posted 22 April , 2013 Share Posted 22 April , 2013 There are only 11 MM citations for the 1/5th South Lancs amongst the Jeudwine Papers - a very small percentage of the total recommendations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitchener's Bugle Posted 22 April , 2013 Share Posted 22 April , 2013 Hello Kingo30, I have checked the St.Helens Advertiser & Newspaper for Dec/Jan but have turned up a blank. Time permitting I will in future have a look at the rest of 1918., and then at some point the St.Helens Reporter!. Good luck KB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kathleen donaldson Posted 22 April , 2013 Share Posted 22 April , 2013 What is Thomas Povey connection to William and Elizabeth Prescott?. This is recorded under additional information on his CWGC certificate http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/320928/POVEY,%20T I have some information on Thomas Povey taken from local casualty lists published in Local Papers Sergeant Thomas Povey Regiment no 240162 was posted as missing in a list published 23rd January 1918. The soldiers in this list will have been killed/taken Prisoner on or about 30th November 1917; In a further list published 12th March 1918 he is reported as being a Prisoner of war in German hands I have no other reference to a Soldier with the surname Povey, but I do have a reference to a Sergeant John Prescott Regiment No 241068 who was reported missing in the same list as Thomas Povey. John Prescott appears in a further list published 22nd February 1918 as being a Prisoner of war in German hands. A William Prescott married a Elizabeth Povey in 1897 in the registration district of Prescot which covers St. Helens. Just checking Census records. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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