HELP WITH PHOTO IDENTIFICATION PLEASE

[jenny001]

Hello there. Would anyone be able to help me with info. on my Great Grandfather. - I have been trying to find his Army service records for some time, but with a surname of White, its a little daunting to say the least as I don't have his Service number! What I know is that he served in The Boer War and WW1 . His first name is William G. (George) and he lived in Somerset, but went to Wales and it is rumoured, he joined up in Pontypridd.

This photo was taken when he was older - possibly late 30's/40's - but what Id like to know is....Is this a Boer War or WW1 uniform he's wearing. I notice hes wearing his medals, but what rank was he? Is his cap badge the Royal Artiller?y - and also has anyone got the slightest idea as to what the regiment name is on his sleeve...its so tantalising as I can just see a couple of letters Any info or guidance would be much appreciated! Many many thanks in advance.

[Guest]

It's artillery for a start

Mike

[tootrock]

When and where was he born?

Martin

[dannyboy1807]

i'd say he is a Sergeant looks like he has a mentioned in dispatches leaf on the far right medal.

I would also say he is older than late 30s early 40s.

also the left two are Defo Boer War looks like 5 battles on the far left and two on the second left (they probably say South Africa 1901 and South Africa 1902)

Edited 8 April , 2013 by dannyboy1807

[Kath]

A lovely photo, Jenny.

Kath.

Was he born in Wellington, Somerset?

Edited 8 April , 2013 by Kath

[Guest]

Staff Sergeant?

I should know what 2 X crossed swords means?

Mike

[dannyboy1807]

looks like the first one to me.

[auchonvillerssomme]

It isn't 2 crossed swords its a tradesmans badge.

[depaor01]

I think the upper badge says Home Guard. Under the crown is an Artificer's badge:

[cliff brown]

The photo is taken after world war one, hence the reason he is wearing his two South Africa medals with the bars and his trio from WW1, including MID on his Victory Medal ribbon. The emblem under the crown is a trade badge (edited: see the replies above). I think the crown above the Sgt's stripes indicates that he's a staff sgt/warrant officer (probably WO class 2). He's also wearing a cloth designation at the top of his left sleeve, which I think might say Home Guard (edited).

[auchonvillerssomme]

he has a Home Guard shoulder title.

[depaor01]

Post crossed. Should've typed faster!

[spof]

There is a William White in 17th Bty RFA who got the KSA and QSA. HE is listed as Bde Wheeler if that fits in with the badge. His number was 56374 but it doesn't seem to have been used for a MIC.

[alf mcm]

Jenny,

Findmypast has pre-war service records for 2 William George White's born in Somerset.. 1 born in Wellington in 1872; the other born in Frome in 1876.

Regards,

Alf McM

[jenny001]

Wow! so much information, so quickly...thank you all VERY much. In reply, I do remember someone saying he was mentioned in dispatches, but didn't pay too much attention to it, as you know how some family stories get blown out of proportion - but perhaps this now may have been true. He was born in Norton St. Philip in Somerset 9th May 1878 and I do remember my Mum saying he was in the Home Guard. If I can find out or recall any other information, I'll post it . Many thanks again

[Staffsyeoman]

Some thoughts - that is, in fact, a Queen's South Africa Medal with six bars - quite something with a King's South Africa as well.

Agree on the trade badge - Artificer; the cap badge - RA; the Home Guard shoulder title. But it is the stripes which are puzzling me - as they are coloured rather than RA standard khaki ones, and could be something like black on scarlet or green on maize yellow - both of which are associated with infantry units.

[daggers]

Would the Home Guard perhaps not have a full range of "issue" stuff?

D

[roughdiamond]

Some thoughts - that is, in fact, a Queen's South Africa Medal with six bars - quite something with a King's South Africa as well.

Agree on the trade badge - Artificer; the cap badge - RA; the Home Guard shoulder title.

Agree with 6 bars on the QSA, also the 1901 and 1902 Bars on the KSA, so it looks like he served a fair amount of time in South Africa. I'd also take a guess at a 1914-15 Star trio as the centre scroll seems too long for the 1914 Star and definately a Mentioned in Dispatches.

There is a William White in 17th Bty RFA who got the KSA and QSA. HE is listed as Bde Wheeler if that fits in with the badge. His number was 56374 but it doesn't seem to have been used for a MIC.

The rank would fit as a "Wheeler" was essentially a "Wheelwright" responsible for the maintenance of carts and wagons.

Working on the assumption that as a WW2 Home Guardsman his rank may have been close to his WW1 rank (probably bogus but worth a pop) there's this Serjeant William G White RA http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/SearchUI/Details?uri=D6264094 I don't have Ancestry, but maybe worth a look. Would the "T" prefix to his early number represent "Territorial" or "Technical"?

Jenny

You need to start asking around the family to see if anyone knows who has his medals, there's a good chance they have stayed in the family and he should have WW2 medals to go with the ones in the photo.

Finally, if he served in the Home Guard as the photo shows, he'll have WW2 service records with the MOD, you can apply for them for £30 here https://www.gov.uk/requests-for-personal-data-and-service-records you'll need to fill in the "General Enquirer's" form and the "British Army Part 2" form, his service records should include his previous service in the Boer War and WW2. You will need a copy of his Death Cert.

Sam

[spof]

Working on the assumption that as a WW2 Home Guardsman his rank may have been close to his WW1 rank (probably bogus but worth a pop) there's this Serjeant William G White RA http://discovery.nat...ls?uri=D6264094 I don't have Ancestry, but maybe worth a look. Would the "T" prefix to his early number represent "Territorial" or "Technical"?

That is a William George White who landed in France 1.4.15. Discharged with an SWB on 5.9.17 due to sickness. His enlistement date was 6.8.14.

He could have been time expired (esp with all those SA bars) and enlisted in the local TF artillery. as he was later renumbered with a 6 digit number. An SWB is not something he'd be likely to have worn while in uniform for WW2 even if regs didn't ban that.

[Roger Thompson]

Is anybody good at looking up the London Gazette, if he as a Mentioned in Dispatches leaf on his trio medal then he should be Gazetted, I can't work it out.

[roughdiamond]

Found this man who was 242nd Bde RFA only 4 numbers away from the man I pointed out http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/67385/BOLSTRIDGE,%20ALEX the Bde was part of 48th (South Midland) Div http://www.1914-1918.net/48div.htm a Territorial Div who started moving to France on 13th March 1915 and cocentrated on 3rd April, sounds about right.

Sam

[dannyboy1807]

I still think it's 5 bars on the first medal

[Stebie9173]

The closest I can see from the Boer War Rolls is 95708 Gunner W White of No. 4 Mountain Battery Royal Garrison Artillery with 4 clasps to his QSA (Orange Free State, Transvaal, Tugela Heights and Relief of Ladysmith) plus KSA with 1901 and 1902 Clasps. FMP shows a WO97 record for 95708 William White, born at "Bristol, Somerset" about 1874.

Though it may be wishful thinking I think there are 4 bars above the spindle for the medal?

That would make him about 40 at the outbreak of WW1 and about 65 for WW2, if it is the right man.

Steve.

[roughdiamond]

I still think it's 5 bars on the first medal

As you can see on the 6 Bar QSA, there is no part of the medal that sits on top of the ribbon, just 6 even width, even spaced bars above the clearly defined spindle, just like the photo IMHO

[Blackblue]

Do you know where his medals are Jenny? They will be impressed/engraved with his details. Do you have any correspondence relating to him?

Rgds

Tim D