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Paul Chapman

Capt. Hon. C.H.M. Meysey-Thompson.

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Paul Chapman

Can anyone shed any light on Capt. the Hon. Claude H.M. Meysey-Thompson's place of burial?

Recorded as 3rd Rifle Brigade, died of wounds 17 June 1915. Info points to place of death being

Ypres.

Therefore : Why is he interred in the family mausoleum in Little Ouseburn (Holy Trinity)

Churchyard?

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Moriaty

According to a posting by Old Owl in 2011:

Captain the Hon. Claude Henry Meysey Meysey-Thompson ,3rd Bn.The Rifle Brigade, was severely wounded near Ypres 17/6/15 and died from these wounds the same day. His father, Lord Knaresborough, brought his body home and he now lies in the family plot at Holy Trinity church, Little Ouseburn, Yorkshire.

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sotonmate

His service file WO339/6592 entry in the NA Catalogue shows he was also in Connaught Rangers at some time.

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Liz in Eastbourne

Oddly, the York Conservation Trust website says the last person to be buried in the family mausoleum was his grandmother in 1910 - so is there a separate plot?

http://www.yorkconse...-mausoleum.html

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Philip Wilson

According to his entry in The Aristrocracy and the Great War by Gerald GLIDDON page 444:

'The 1st Baron KNARESBOROUGH had only one son, Claud MEYSEY-THOMPSON, born 1887, who became a Captain in the 3rd Rifle Brigade. In 1915 he was seriously wounded and brought back to England where he died 17 June. He was buried in the church near the former family home in the same cemetery as his father.'

Philip

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archangel9

His service file WO339/6592 entry in the NA Catalogue shows he was also in Connaught Rangers at some time.

I'd like to know his Connaught Rangers connection. Cannot find any mention of him in the Regimental History yet.

John

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sotonmate

John

I am quoting from the NA Catalogue entry for WO339/6592. The file would need to be read to see the details of his connection,unless it is an error in compilation.

Sotonmate

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Liz in Eastbourne

According to his entry in The Aristrocracy and the Great War by Gerald GLIDDON page 444:

'The 1st Baron KNARESBOROUGH had only one son, Claud MEYSEY-THOMPSON, born 1887, who became a Captain in the 3rd Rifle Brigade. In 1915 he was seriously wounded and brought back to England where he died 17 June. He was buried in the church near the former family home in the same cemetery as his father.'

Philip

His father, if the York Conservation Trust website is correct, must also be buried elsewhere than in the family mausoleum. I thought the CWGC record might clinch the question of whether he is buried in the mausoleum, as stated by the OP, or elsewhere in the churchyard, but the photo supplied is of the inscription on the war memorial in the churchyard to Capt. Meysey-Thompson and others. Perhaps the OP knows: someone will.

Liz

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Old Owl

Hi All,

Claude Meysey-Thompson is indeed buried in the churchyard at Little Ouseburn and I visited and photgraphed his grave in 2010. The family plot is seperate to the Mausoleum and to the left hand side of the church as you approach it from the road. If anyone should need a photo of Claude's grave then please send me a P.M. with an email address--as I believe that I still have the images on my camera. As far as I understand it the Mausoleum was full by 1910 and so a seperate family plot was started in the churchyard.

Claude was one of very few officers whose bodies were brought back and buried at home during the Great War--infact he may have been one of the last, as the practice was frowned upon by many.

Robert

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Old Owl

According to his entry in The Aristrocracy and the Great War by Gerald GLIDDON page 444:

'The 1st Baron KNARESBOROUGH had only one son, Claud MEYSEY-THOMPSON, born 1887, who became a Captain in the 3rd Rifle Brigade. In 1915 he was seriously wounded and brought back to England where he died 17 June. He was buried in the church near the former family home in the same cemetery as his father.'

Philip

Hi Philip,

Claude actually died from his wounds at Bailleul and his body was then brought home by his father and buried at Little Ouseburn. The full inscription on his headstone reads:

"In Loving Memory of Captain The Hon.Claude Henry Meysey Meysey-Thompson, 3rd Battalion Rifle Brigade. Only Son of 1st Lord Knaresborough. Born 5th April,1887. Wounded in the Trenches near Ypres 6th June,1915. Died at Bailleul in France 17th June,1915 in the presence of his father who brought back the body to England and it was interred here on the 22nd June,1915."

Robert

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Liz in Eastbourne

That's very interesting, Robert, thanks.

I noticed this thread because the Hon. Claude Henry's cousin, Hubert Charles Meysey-Thompson, was an officer in the Yeoman Rifles (21/KRRC) in whom as you know I have a particular interest. He was a London lawyer before the war, unlike Capt the Hon Claude Henry M M -T, who was I think at Sandhurst and was already adjutant in 1913 (London Gazette Sept 16 1913). Hubert Charles was badly wounded in 1917 but survived the war; I found his very interesting diary from his war service in the Imperial War Museum but never finished writing his mini-biography to post on my 21/KRRC thread.

Rechecking The Times Digital Archive and my notes, I've lost him after 1950 when he was made CBE for work as Legal Visitor in Lunacy - I don't know when he died. Must have another look on Ancestry. I wonder if he is buried in Little Ouseburn churchyard as well - from the Times notices it seems other members of the family who lived mainly in London or Sussex were taken there for burial.

Liz

Edited by Liz in Eastbourne

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Philip Wilson

Hi Philip,

Claude actually died from his wounds at Bailleul and his body was then brought home by his father and buried at Little Ouseburn. The full inscription on his headstone reads:

"In Loving Memory of Captain The Hon.Claude Henry Meysey Meysey-Thompson, 3rd Battalion Rifle Brigade. Only Son of 1st Lord Knaresborough. Born 5th April,1887. Wounded in the Trenches near Ypres 6th June,1915. Died at Bailleul in France 17th June,1915 in the presence of his father who brought back the body to England and it was interred here on the 22nd June,1915."

Robert

Robert - Thanks it just shows how important it is to go back to primary sources - for as we well know even the most well intentioned author can make a mistake.

My August 1914 Army List has him listed under 1557 as a Lieutenant with 3rd Rifle Brigade wef 14.Oct 1910.

and under 1558 as Adjutant 3rd Rifle Brigade 15 Sept 1913.

Philip

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Liz in Eastbourne

His service file WO339/6592 entry in the NA Catalogue shows he was also in Connaught Rangers at some time.

He was already in the Rifle Brigade in 1906 (LG 2 Oct 1906) when he was 19, having been to Sandhurst, and his MIC shows only 3rd Bn Rifle Brigade. But as you say, the record itself would have to be consulted to see how this came about.

Liz

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Philip Wilson

He was already in the Rifle Brigade in 1906 (LG 2 Oct 1906) when he was 19, having been to Sandhurst, and his MIC shows only 3rd Bn Rifle Brigade. But as you say, the record itself would have to be consulted to see how this came about.

Liz

Liz - Thanks. Yes the Graduation List of Officers of the British Army in the April 1909 Army List confirms his date of birth as 5 April 1887 and as 2nd Lieutenant Rifle Brigade from 29 August 1906.

Philip

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Old Owl

I wonder if this comes from some note made on his service papers?

I believe that all cadets from Sandhurst go through a selection process where they are invited to apply to join chosen regiments, each regiment then invite the respective cadets to visit them, and then both cadet and regiment decide if they like each other. More than one regiment may offer a single cadet to apply for a commission within their regiment, the cadet may then decide which regiment he wishes to join. This could result in a note on his service papers to the effect that CHMM-T had been offered a place by both the Connaughts and the R.B.? and of course he joined the R.B.

Just a thought!

Robert

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archangel9

I wonder if this comes from some note made on his service papers?

I believe that all cadets from Sandhurst go through a selection process where they are invited to apply to join chosen regiments, each regiment then invite the respective cadets to visit them, and then both cadet and regiment decide if they like each other. More than one regiment may offer a single cadet to apply for a commission within their regiment, the cadet may then decide which regiment he wishes to join. This could result in a note on his service papers to the effect that CHMM-T had been offered a place by both the Connaughts and the R.B.? and of course he joined the R.B.

Just a thought!

Robert

Sounds OK Robert. I'll have a look the next time I'm in Kew.

John

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Old Owl

Sounds OK Robert. I'll have a look the next time I'm in Kew.

John

Thanks John, I would be very intersted if indeed this was the case.

Robert

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archangel9

Might be September-October before I get there though.

John

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stiletto_33853

3rd Rifle Brigade's diary:-

6-6-15 Captain Hon. C.H. Meysey-Thompson wounded. 2 other ranks killed and 18 wounded.

17-6-15 Captain Hon. C.H. Meysey-Thompson died of wounds

Andy

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stiletto_33853

The Meysey-Thompson name is well known in the Rifle Brigade with Richard Frederick Meysey-Thompson and Harold James Meysey-Thompson also in the Regiment.

Colonel Richard Frederick Meysey-Thompson

2nd son of Sir H.S Meysey-Thompson, 1st Bart. born 17th April 1847; married 1879, Charlotte, youngest daughter of Sir James Walker, 1st Bart. one son and one daughter. Educated Eton. Medal for Ashanti campaigns and clasp for Coomassie, also Royal Humane Society's medal for bravery, and commanded 4th battalion West Yorkshire Regiment. Local director for Barclay's Bank, York. Member of York Race Committee, formerly member of Irish National Hunt Steeplechase Committee. Publications:- A fishing Catechism; A Shooting Catechism; A Hunting Catechism; The Course; The Camp; The Chase; The Horse. Address: Westwood Mount, Scarborough. Telephone Scarborough 367. Clubs: Army & Navy, Yorkshire County Club, York.

Died 1st September 1926.

Rifle Brigade, 2nd Lieut. 14th August 1866, Lieut. 22nd February 1871, Captain 31st January 1879, Major 7th March 1883, retired 3rd December 1884. appointed Lt.-Col. 4th battalion P.W.O. West Yorkshire Regiment 19th January 1889, honorary rank of Colonel 11th October 1890, resigned 2nd September 1893.

Andy

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stiletto_33853

Liz,

For you on Hubert Charles, although I am sure you have most of it

MEYSEY-THOMPSON, Hubert Charles

C.B.E. 1950; Lord Chancellors Visitor, 1928-1955. Born 1883; oldest son of late Albert Childers Meysey-Thompson, Q.C.; heir - pres. to Captain Sir Algar De Clifford Meysey-Thompson, 3rd bart; married 1936, Millicent Mary, daughter of late Edmond Wallace Blake. Educated Marlborough; Trinity College, Cambridge, B.A.1905. Called to the Bar, Inner Temple, Hilary Term 1907 and practiced on the North Eastern Circuit. Joined Inns of Court O.T.C. 1914; served European War 1914-18, commissioned 2/4th Royal Berkshire Regiment 1914, transferred to 21st (S) Bn. K.R.R.C. 1916 and served in Flanders and France. Acting Captain 1917 (wounded). President of Pensions Appeal Tribunal for England and Wales, 1924. Recreations: Fishing, shooting, tennis, golf. Address: Chestnut House, Long Melford, Sudbury, Suffolk, telephone Long Melford 281. Clubs: Travellers Leander, M.C.C., Royal Tennis Court (Hampton Court).

Died 9th November, 1956.

Andy

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Liz in Eastbourne

Thank you very much indeed, Andy, you have filled in his death date for me and some details of his later life.

Liz

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Liz in Eastbourne

His service file WO339/6592 entry in the NA Catalogue shows he was also in Connaught Rangers at some time.

As I was going to the National Archives at Kew yesterday for other reasons, I had a look at this file, which is slim and doesn’t take long to go through. I could see no mention at all of the Connaught Rangers on it, despite the fact that the online description only mentions this regiment and not The Rifle Brigade. It seems to be a complete mistake so I have sent a message from the NA’s website to suggest the description should be revised.

It is for Claude Henry Meysey-Thompson all right, but (I suppose through weeding rather than because any other file exists) is almost entirely concerned with his last days, his will and subsequent correspondence with his family.

There is a War Office telegram of 11 June 1915 permitting Lord Knaresborough ‘to assist his son dangerously wounded 2 Clearing Station Bailleul. Pass will be sent to A pm Boulogne.’

The following year, on 23 February 1916, Lady Knaresborough’s secretary wrote to Personal Services to ask for details of Capt. Meysey-Thompson’s career so that she could write a biographical account of her son. Not much was sent, just a few bits of standard information:

Adjutant 15.9.1913

Distinguished in Musketry Nov 1909

Passed signalling Aldershot 1908

Maxim gun course Hythe Dec 1910

Rangefinding Hythe April 1913.

If I get a reply to my message to the NA I'll let you know, as several people were interested, but I can't see how this can be anything other than a mistake as Sotonmate suggested. There's nothing at all about his early career on the file to enable one to check Robert's idea that he might have been offered a commission with the Connaught Rangers from Sandhurst, but I think all the family connections in this case would suggest that this wasn't so.

Liz

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Old Owl

As I was going to the National Archives at Kew yesterday for other reasons, I had a look at this file, which is slim and doesn’t take long to go through. I could see no mention at all of the Connaught Rangers on it, despite the fact that the online description only mentions this regiment and not The Rifle Brigade. It seems to be a complete mistake so I have sent a message from the NA’s website to suggest the description should be revised.

It is for Claude Henry Meysey-Thompson all right, but (I suppose through weeding rather than because any other file exists) is almost entirely concerned with his last days, his will and subsequent correspondence with his family.

There is a War Office telegram of 11 June 1915 permitting Lord Knaresborough ‘to assist his son dangerously wounded 2 Clearing Station Bailleul. Pass will be sent to A pm Boulogne.’

The following year, on 23 February 1916, Lady Knaresborough’s secretary wrote to Personal Services to ask for details of Capt. Meysey-Thompson’s career so that she could write a biographical account of her son. Not much was sent, just a few bits of standard information:

Adjutant 15.9.1913

Distinguished in Musketry Nov 1909

Passed signalling Aldershot 1908

Maxim gun course Hythe Dec 1910

Rangefinding Hythe April 1913.

If I get a reply to my message to the NA I'll let you know, as several people were interested, but I can't see how this can be anything other than a mistake as Sotonmate suggested. There's nothing at all about his early career on the file to enable one to check Robert's idea that he might have been offered a commission with the Connaught Rangers from Sandhurst, but I think all the family connections in this case would suggest that this wasn't so.

Liz

Thanks for looking this up Liz. It must be a mistake by the N.A., but it will be interesting to see if they have any comments to make.

Robert

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archangel9

Thanks Liz.

John

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