KIA Themes

[Bingo794]

I collect medals to the Lincolnshire Regiment prefering local, also medals/plaques to the name Humberstone, of which quite a few are Lincoln's.

Also, anything to men of the 4th (Special Reserve) Battalion of the South Stafford's who were KIA on the 10th April, 1918, when my grandmothers brother was with them and lost his life.

I must say, however, that a 1914 Star trio with SWB to the 2nd Lincolns (he served with the 8th, 10th and again the 2nd Battalions as the war went on) to an old chap who came from our village are my favourites. They are worn, polished, with beerstained and pipe smoke stained ribbons, with the original ribbon bar. In fact, I remember him when I was a kid, sitting outside the pub with his medals up.

I just wish I had the presence of mind to have talked to him. He died in 1974. My first year at secondary school.

His medals were sold off in a house clearance and came to me a number of years later. This is the closest I have come to knowing anyone who served in WW1.

Remembering him as I do, it gives me a real connection to the time, even though I was too young to realise when he was here.

RichardW

[Terry]

Hi Cameron,

I have been collecting since the seventies, and like many others, I have gone through several collecting themes - I spent some time with US medals, then got into the world of the green jackets (Rifle Brigade and KRRC). Later I was a serious collector of medals to the Punjab Frontier Force. Since about 1994 I have concentrated on the 1914-18 Canadian Expeditionary Force. Even within this area, I have gone in several directions, but eventually my first target was a complete group (trio or pair) to each CEF combat unit which served at the front. Over the years I reached that goal, but then I decided to "upgrade" a bit and get a casualty KIA/DOW group to each unit. I took longer to achieve that goal! In fact one unit,the 3rd Canadian Mounted Rifles only lost about five or six men before being broken up so I am still hunting.

At the same time I have built up a dandy sub-collection of CEF prisoner of war medal groups, and finally I have dabbled in gallantry to enlisted men. To date I have three DCM groups; thirty-three MM groups, five MSM groups and twelve MID groups. This has ocurred over a 15-20 year period.

I have been able to build up a good collection because in part the CEF is a limited field. Obviously attempting to find a KIA group to every unit in the BEF might be considerably tougher! Perhaps you could consider (a) 1914 star groups, ( "first day" groups, © a specific campaign such as Gallipoli,(d)a specific battle in France & Flanders such as Loos or Passchendaele,(e) casualties to your local area,etc. The possibilities are endless.

Best of luck. It is a fascinating hobby. I can't understand why people fiddle around with stamps and coins when this is so much better!

Cheers,

Terry

[old joe]

I collect to kia for the Somme who have a gravestone so I can visit and thank them for what they did.

It also makes me focus on particular aspects of the battles in depth so I can try and work out where they

fought and pay my respects in that area as well.

At some point maybe a member of the family sold the medals without a thought as to what their relative gave them

i.e. their life, and I think it is a shame thefamily do not remember their sacrifice.

Tony

2 months ago I bought a pair on ebay, the auction was ending oon a Saturday night and no one had bid on them and they were to a Royal Navy rating I wanted so I bid on them without a cursory bit of research and won the auction. The BWM was pin brooched and obviously worn with pride and I figured that the old fella had lived a long life and worn his medals with pride. A member of the British Medals Forum then informed me that the man appeared to be a casualty. But someone, one of his parents perhaps, had mounted and seemingly worn the medal.

This is my first casualty group and to be honest I feel a bit melancholy about them. Family lines change and die out over time and perhaps this is what happened in this man's case and that is how they ended up being auctioned on ebay, or perhaps younger generations of the family with no memory of him could care less and sold them off. I've tried to talk to my own nieces about my grandfather's service in the Great War (their gg grandfather) but because he has been dead for some years and they never knew him and they have little sense of history I might as well have been talking about someone from the middle ages judging by their reaction. They have no direct memory and therefore cannot connect with their past. It's a shame and a loss for them and us. But someone wore Mr. Goad's BWM and didn't just throw them in the back of the drawer.

I haven't downloaded the man's papers but I suspect he may have died in the great influenza epidemic that was sweeping the world at the time. I've often wondered how many families felt about family members who were casualties in the last month of the war. There were so many casualties with the big pushes on yet the war was coming to an end and there was supposed to be relief if not joy and then comes the dreaded telegram. In my grandfather's unit with the AEF, most of their causlties occurred Nov. 2 to the 9th, 1918 and then they were pulled back for the last two days of the war.

I live in the States and hope to get across the pond one of these days but until I do if anyone is ever in the area of Matfield, Brenchley, Kent and are near Matfield (St.Lukes) Churchyard maybe they could stop in and pay respects to Royal Navy man William Albert Goad, died Oct. 11th 1918 aged 20.

Regards,

Joseph

[auchonvillerssomme]

Checking back over various medal books and dealers lists the real upsurge in KIA prices and intrest seems to date back to the early 1980s ? July 1st being the obvious collected but then a intrest in 1914 KIAs , those were the days of checking Soliders Died if you collected a regimental intrest ,or sending a list of names off to CWWG with a SAE ! now i have stood at a boot fair with me I phone checking on line .

I well remember the thrill of my favourite dealer list, Fred S Walland arriving and finding a medal I wanted then hope dashed because someone phoned 2 minutes before I did or excitement because I spotted a gem and managed to grab it. Ebay isn't quite the same.

[Guest exuser1]

Now your talking good old Fred , up to then i had been dealing with the normal run of dealers who to me a lad from East End they all seemed a bit posh , then my neibour introduced me to Fred ,with his very un PC catalogue with his comments page ,phoned him back in the mid 1980s , Victorian group 3/4 if i recall , yes still here he said but its EF ,i think the bloke wore em all the time ? the way they have been banged together even when he was shagging the Mrs! but may not have put it that polite !

He had some superb stuff over the years ,never any issues ,and had some real crackers off his list .

Now living in France no more dealers lists , the markets turn up some good local stuff in frames which are not rated here, collectors in France just dont seem to do medals and Great War is still bargin basment , their big thing seems to be German WW2 and WW1 and the WW2 airborne, if French medals then its Mexico in the 1860s or any thing Para Indo China ,and rare badges of the French Army .

[CameronStockton]

Hi

Thank you all for your in depth responses. Its great to see all the diffident opinions on KIA themes so it has certainly broadened my horizons.

Cameron

[woollamc]

I live in the States and hope to get across the pond one of these days but until I do if anyone is ever in the area of Matfield, Brenchley, Kent and are near Matfield (St.Lukes) Churchyard maybe they could stop in and pay respects to Royal Navy man William Albert Goad, died Oct. 11th 1918 aged 20.

Regards,

Joseph

Joseph - this is very near me. Will pay my respects next time I'm passing. Shout if you'd like some photos.

[Sepoy]

From the Naval History Net - http://www.naval-history.net/xDKCas1918-10Oct.htm

President III, Accounting Base, London and other location

GOAD, William A, Armourers Crew, M22566, killed

He was not an influenza victim. There may be a story here - you should research him Joseph.

Sepoy

[old joe]

Joseph - this is very near me. Will pay my respects next time I'm passing. Shout if you'd like some photos.

If you get a chance that would be fine and I would appreciate it.

Regards,

Joseph

RIP Mr. Goad

[old joe]

From the Naval History Net - http://www.naval-history.net/xDKCas1918-10Oct.htm

President III, Accounting Base, London and other location

GOAD, William A, Armourers Crew, M22566, killed

He was not an influenza victim. There may be a story here - you should research him Joseph.

Sepoy

Sepoy,

Thank you for this and I will research this further.

Thanks again, and for the work and interesting posts on the board,

Joseph

[Coldstreamer]

At one point I had 3% of the entire Coldstream Guards medals in casualty terms - the main reason being at the time the only research you could easily do was to those killed as soldiers died gives a place of birth and residence

[westkent78]

Joseph,

William Goad died 11th October of pneumonia aged 20 in Belmont Road Military Hospital, Liverpool according to the Kent & Sussex Courier 28th Oct 1918. Having said that his listing in the ADM 104 Reporting of Naval Deaths shows a different form of illness ending in "isis" His father was informed of the death on 12th October. The question is, was the pneumonia a result of influenza or negligence on someone's part- hence the 'killed'?

Cameron,

One other factor that hasn't been mentioned yet regarding casualty medals is that it pinpoints the individual in that particular action, whereas you can never quite be sure that a non-casualty was not in the rear details or on a course, in hospital or on leave unless his papers have survived.

Best regards,

Matthew

[old joe]

Joseph,

William Goad died 11th October of pneumonia aged 20 in Belmont Road Military Hospital, Liverpool according to the Kent & Sussex Courier 28th Oct 1918. Having said that his listing in the ADM 104 Reporting of Naval Deaths shows a different form of illness ending in "isis" His father was informed of the death on 12th October. The question is, was the pneumonia a result of influenza or negligence on someone's part- hence the 'killed'?

Best regards,

Matthew

Matthew,

Thanks for this and it is indeed worthy of further research.

Regards and thanks again,

Joseph

[westkent78]

Joseph,

It gets better. I've just found his picture and a letter from his commanding officer. If I can just work out how to post it....

Regardless, if you pm me an email address I'll send the pages off to you.

Matfield has my favorite West Kent village green, played cricket on it a few times, and is only about 5 miles from where I grew up.

Matthew

[westkent78]

Here he is.

[old joe]

Here he is.

Thank you, I have sent a PM.

Thanks to all the posters who have posted information on Mr. Goad.

Best wishes,

Joseph

[old joe]

Thanks to West Kent 78 for emailing me two pages from the Kent and Sussex Courier of Oct. 28th and Nov. 1st, 1918, reporting on the death of Mr. Goad and quotes from a letter sent to the family from his commanding officer.

I am appreciative for all the input today, thanks.

Regards

Joseph

[woollamc]

If you get a chance that would be fine and I would appreciate it.

Regards,

Joseph

RIP Mr. Goad

Have been there this morning. The grave is well kept and I am sending some photos by PM.

[old joe]

Have been there this morning. The grave is well kept and I am sending some photos by PM.

Thanks for taking the time to visit and the photos.

Since your first post we have a photo of the man and contemporary newspaper accounts reporting his unfortunate demise and a visit to his grave.

Thanks again for your time and trouble.

Best wishes,

Joseph