British MT/HT Map Western Front

[BSM]

Does any Forum member have a Brit. Mechanical Transport/Horse Transport Map in their possession and would be kind enough to share some info from same please? Particularly interested in seeing an example of the MT specific "legend" that was added to said maps for vehicle operation in the respective Corps areas. Regards ... Rod

[BSM]

I must admit that it is a tad intriguing that not one member has even looked at the post (according to the count) let alone added a comment. Luck of the draw as they say!! These maps are rarities these days. A small number came up for auction on Aust. ebay (one at a time) a couple of years back and whilst I was keen to acquire an example I could not justify the price tag at the time .... last seen in the hundreds of AUD. Given the advances in the use of MT in WW1 it is somewhat surprising that another forum member has not come across same in their travels...... Rod

[CROONAERT]

I must admit that it is a tad intriguing that not one member has even looked at the post (according to the count) let alone added a comment.

I think that's more due to a counter error as I'd taken a look soon after you posted it and it's suddenly reading 35 now. As to a comment, well, if I've nothing constructive to say, then it's a bit pointless passing a comment. Maybe others think the same too?

Maybe if you actually explain what these maps actually are, you may get further replies (some people may call them something different). I've collected ,studied and actively sought out WW1 maps (mainly trenchmaps, but I always stumble across others) for the best part of 35 years and couldn't actually tell you whether I've got any (though I don't think I've ever come across any ASC specific maps, so probably don't) ....because I don't really know what I'm looking for!

Dave

[BSM]

Dave, sorry about that but it was showing zero over a couple of checks so I queried same. Technology glitch as you say, thank you for answering and I appreciate your comments. From what you say and given the length of time you have been interested in maps it would seem to re-enforce the idea that these examples are uncommon. I trust you find the attachments interesting and I look forward to further input should it arise. First off ... Don't know if you are familiar with same but Colonel Henniker (Imp. ASC) wrote a great reference to ASC Transport Ops in Europe (all types) from which the following extract comes. This in turn will better describe the initial thrust of the thread.

"At normal times motor traffic was excluded from certain branch roads so as to keep them in good condition for use during a period of active operations. ‘Normal’ and ‘Operations’, motor circuit maps were printed for each Army. The usual arrangement was that roads coloured red might be used in both directions by all traffic; roads coloured blue might be used in both directions by cars, box-cars and motor-cycles, but all other traffic might use such roads only in the direction shown by blue arrows on them; uncoloured roads were not to be used by motor lorries, motor buses or steam tractors; horses were not to be exercised on coloured roads. On the operation motor-circuit maps additional circuits for motor ambulances were shown by red or blue dotted lines, and close to the front line there were modifications of the normal circuits designed to facilitate the advance of columns from the rear."

The attached images are not very good quality but they will give you an idea. Thanks again.....Rod

[Phil Evans]

Rod,

The only one I know of is held at Kew in WO 153/1155 (Part 17) and is of Vignacourt Administrative Area. Looking at the title block, date etc, it is probably another copy of the one you have posted.

Phil

[BSM]

Phil, thanks much for the added input. During the research for a book on MT that I did a while back I came across a number of references by Unit Officers etc regarding said maps but did not fully understand the import of them until the examples came up on ebay. Over a period of a few weeks there were three from memory and I should have grabbed some more information at the time. Easy to be wise in hindsight. I do remember that they were all different and as noted previously, they fetched a good price. Attached is the remaining "legend" piece that I copied for this example. Not clear I'm afraid but best I could do at the time. Even though the Western Front was basically a "static" situation there was sufficient movement back and forth to warrant a number of such maps being prepared for each Army which in turn would have been prepared and issued in sufficient numbers to filter down to the ASC troops etc. on the ground who used them. I think it still raises a question re their scarcity. No doubt a logical explanation will surface at some time..... Regards...Rod

[BSM]

Phil wrong attachment....try again.....Rod

[Phil Evans]

Rod,

The latest post looks like the successor to mine, with additional legends that I have not seen before, including on the Army Administrative maps. I would think that it was little used outside of the ASC and had limited circulation. Hence the scarcity.

PM sent

Phil

[BSM]

Thanks Phil....have responded to your PM etc. Rod