IPT #51 Posted 3 November , 2012 Sidney Pelham Morter DSO went abroad 29/9/1915, was married to Madeleine and died in 1933. None of his siblings look likely either.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kathleen donaldson #52 Posted 3 November , 2012 I know, I have tried everything and all I get is Zero Zilch the Proverbial Brick Wall. Having a break from Captain Morter for now till I get to Liverpool. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kathleen donaldson #53 Posted 3 November , 2012 Just sent an inquiry to Edinburgh Archives to see if they can look in there records for Morningside Gardens. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
museumtom #54 Posted 3 November , 2012 I don't know about you lads and lassies but I find this all very exciting. The pleasure of the chase type of thing. Cheers, and thanks again all. Tom. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aradgick #55 Posted 4 November , 2012 I've tried the 1901 and 1911 Irish censuses, also Incoming Passenger lists on ancestry (in case it's a family coming in from India, etc) but there is absolutely nothing. So the only thing we have is newspaper entries. Do you believe everything you read in the newspapers? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kathleen donaldson #56 Posted 4 November , 2012 No I take whats in the papers with a pinch of salt but for two members of the same family reported killed something is amiss. I await a reply from Edinburgh Archives for the address mentioned. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
daggers #57 Posted 4 November , 2012 This may be a red herring but it has been put on a local forum as a possible clue: http://www.militarian.com/threads/kitty-morter.8726/ Its author has not been around for a couple of years but I have sent a message and will report any response. D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IPT #58 Posted 4 November , 2012 I'm just going to have to assume this is the work of spies until I hear otherwise. Although even that doesn't explain why the charade was still being carried on in Southport in the early 20s! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CGM #59 Posted 4 November , 2012 This may be a red herring but it has been put on a local forum as a possible clue: http://www.militaria...ty-morter.8726/ Its author has not been around for a couple of years but I have sent a message and will report any response. D The birth of MORTAR, Percy E was registered at Ashton under Lyne, Lancashire in Oct-Nov-Dec 1916. The mother's maiden name was Hooley. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bruce #60 Posted 4 November , 2012 Kathy's find led me to finding that Bruce Hubbard has or had a book on the Southport memorial. He is not accepting pms at present, but if he reads this, perhaps he could have a look for anything about Capt. Morter. D I have no idea why anyone might think I'm not accepting pms! From Bannister's book, Southport's Splendid Hearts, page 157 Morter, Percy Holland Captain.........Gordon Highlanders kia 10.12.14 Unable to identify from available records. (explanation of how she couldn't find him in ODGW, CWGC, Army Lists, officers' service files, or Mic) but...... Southport Visiter 2.1.15 (no photo) Among the latest casualties announced is that of Capt. Percy Holland Morter, Gordon Highlanders, husband of Grace Morter, Morningside gardens, Edinburgh (late of Cheshire and Birkdale). Capt. Morter, who was 47 years of age, was killed in action in France on december 10th. That would make his birth about 1867 or thereabouts. I am not sure that this actually advances things much though! Bruce Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
IPT #61 Posted 4 November , 2012 So the same information as the Liverpool Echo, except that the Echo gave the date of death as 17th December. The Southport Visiter and the memorial both give the 10th. Is it possible then, that someone took the information from the obituary, or would someone have had to submit an application? So Percy appeared in the Southport Visiter and the Liverpool Echo that we know of. Stanley appeared in the Irish Independent and the Liverpool Echo that we know of. I bet there would have been something in the Edinburgh paper too. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bruce #62 Posted 4 November , 2012 All the papers refer to the fact that "among the latest casualties announced". Who announced them? Where were such lists compiled and by whom? If we can find that out, we might be able to follow the paper trail a bit further back. Bruce Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aradgick #63 Posted 4 November , 2012 Name: Percy Morter Birth Place: Derby Death Date: 7 Jul 1916 Death Location: France & Flanders Enlistment Location: Manchester Rank: L/Corporal Regiment: Loyal North Lancashire Regiment Battalion: 9th Battalion Number: 18386 Type of Casualty: Killed in action Theatre of War: Western European Theatre Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aradgick #64 Posted 4 November , 2012 Sorry - meant to say this is the Percy Morter referred to by Daggers. From the 1901 census, he was born at Derby in 1892, widowed father John Robert Morter Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bardess #65 Posted 4 November , 2012 Kathleen Morten married Robert Eckersley in Q3/1930 in Manchester S Kathleen Hooley married Percy Morter in Q4/1913 in Prestwich Has to be the LNL chappie Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdoyle #66 Posted 4 November , 2012 like most of you, I've looked at CWGC, SDGW, De Ruvigny, census etc.... No death or re-marriage record found for a Grace Morter. No will information found for either Morter. If a Captain in Dec 1914, presume the father would have been a regular soldier with LG entries for commission and promotions; nothing found. No family tree. Nothing on Findagrave.com. If the son was an old boy at Birkenhead Inst, he's not on the roll of honour http://www.freewebs.com/birkenheadinstitute/earlydays.htm looking at the military records on Ancestry for "Morningside Gardens" pulls up a number of soldiers (at numbers 5, 12 and 21) but not the Morter family. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaySearching #67 Posted 4 November , 2012 fascinating thread after much head-scratching and searching alongside forum members and found absouloutly zero I have reached the conclusion he is a 1915 version of THE MAN WHO NEVER WAS regards Ray Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Theletterwriter #68 Posted 4 November , 2012 From the 1915 Valuation Rolls for 18 Morningside Gardens, Edinburgh : - Owner : Mrs. Margeret Watson Rigg Tenant Occupiers : William Forgie, Robert John Harris, Mrs. Elizabeth Munro, Gardiner Turner and Mrs. Jessie Will Assuming Grace Morter had stayed at this address, it would look as if she had left (possibly when her son was killed??) by the time the valuation rolls were compiled. Douglas Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kathleen donaldson #69 Posted 4 November , 2012 While at Liverpool today I looked in the Gore Directories and there is no mention of Morter apart from Sidney Pelman Morter. The obituary was only published in The Liverpool Echo and the Daily Post. No other Liverpool newspaper published which I find unusual, the soldier Theakston who appears in the obituary with the 2nd Lt was also listed in The Liverpool Daily Courier. The deaths of these two in The Daily Post records Captain Percy Holland Morter as being killed 19th December 1914. I think the Southport Visitor may have got the information from the Liverpool Echo and published because of the connection to Birkdale. I am now starting to think that this is a hoax maybe a disgruntled relative of Sidney Pelman Morter Architect. Sidney's mother died 1913 and left a will she resided in Cheshire. His brother Allan William Morter died 1916 and left a will he also resided in Cheshire. Allan at one time resided in Great Crosby he was a chartered accountant. I will have a proper look at the local casualty lists tomorrow and see if anything is reported. I am now of the opinion that these two never existed I know there is a picture but can we be 100% certain that this is 2nd-Lt Stanley Holland Morter. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
daggers #70 Posted 4 November , 2012 Bruce Tried a pm again just now and got 'the member brucehubbard cannot receive any new messages', as yesterday. Thanks anyway for the lookup. D Kathy I am coming round to your opinion that there is some malice involved and we may never get to the root of this interesting exercise. Daggers Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aradgick #71 Posted 4 November , 2012 Well at least it's not 1st April! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Stephen Nulty #72 Posted 4 November , 2012 Seems like an opportune time to replay Tom's first few words from the OP..... Now this may look a doddle Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kathleen donaldson #73 Posted 4 November , 2012 Sidney Pelman Morter was a Architect & Surveyor (Bricks & Morter) Proverbial Brick Wall has been constructed here. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RaySearching #74 Posted 4 November , 2012 I'm just going to have to assume this is the work of spies until I hear otherwise. Although even that doesn't explain why the charade was still being carried on in Southport in the early 20s! Was there not a report in a Turkish newspaper about a Stanley Morter Being washed ashore on Gallipoli in 1915 with a briefcase handcuffed to his wrist regards Ray Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hazelclark #75 Posted 4 November , 2012 Was there not a report in a Turkish newspaper about a Stanley Morter Being washed ashore on Gallipoli in 1915 with a briefcase handcuffed to his wrist regards Ray Starting to look like that isn't it? H.C. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
