museumtom Posted 24 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 24 July , 2020 Thank you Margaret, we also posted that yesterday, But thank you for thinking of us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 24 July , 2020 Share Posted 24 July , 2020 I think we need to take a step back on this one and determine exactly what we need to look at. There's no doubt that #9907 died in 1916 so it can't be him. John's pension card lists his father as John snr, aged 68. It also seems he had a brother called Christopher. The pension ledger shows 3 Church Place. We know we also have a James of 9 Church Place died in 1921 aged 58 and we have a James who married in 1921 and gave the place of residence as 3 Church Place. The James who married in 1921 gives his fathers' name as John (and apparently still alive). Now, in 1911 we have a family with a John as the father (age 62) - would be 68 in 1917. And 3 sons of the right age - John, James and Christopher (the eldest). I suspect this is the family on question for that which is later at 3 Church Place. I would suggest that the James who married in August 1921 is the son (born 1899)http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Stillorgan/Annaville_Avenue/93254/ This still leaves us with James, who died aged 58 - I would suggest that he is probably the brother of John Snr and the uncle of the the younger John,James and Christopher. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 24 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 24 July , 2020 Excellent analysis Craig, thank you kindly for that. There is a lot to consider but you have put it all together. Somewhere in there lies the answer I reckon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 24 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 24 July , 2020 (edited) Can anyone please translate the reason for discharge in line one please? This man died from Myocarditis and heart failure And I hope they are connected. Edited 24 July , 2020 by museumtom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 24 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 24 July , 2020 Yes the more I look at it the more I am sure it is conjunctivits. Kind regards. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bardess Posted 24 July , 2020 Share Posted 24 July , 2020 Somewhere in the recesses of my brain I seem to recall evidence of heart disease directly from having defective teeth/gum disease. Could be majorly wrong though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 24 July , 2020 Share Posted 24 July , 2020 19 minutes ago, Bardess said: Somewhere in the recesses of my brain I seem to recall evidence of heart disease directly from having defective teeth/gum disease. Could be majorly wrong though Oral bacteria can certainly cause heart problems Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 24 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 24 July , 2020 Thank you Bardess and Craig, it sounds great but selling that to Terry is expecting too much I reckon. Kind regards. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bardess Posted 25 July , 2020 Share Posted 25 July , 2020 7 hours ago, museumtom said: but selling that to Terry is expecting too much Perhaps @Dai Bach y Sowldiwr could offer his opinion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 25 July , 2020 Share Posted 25 July , 2020 (edited) Yes, as Craig mentioned, some bacteria like Strep. viridans found in the mouth can spread into the blood stream and lodge on heart valves if those have previously been damaged by rheumatic fever.This used to happen after dental extraction in the pre antibiotic era. Assuming the cause of death was correct, subsequent death was from myocarditis and heart failure is a possible but not inevitable scenario of complication of "Defective or deficient teeth". I don't think there's enough evidence to state unequivocally that his death was directly caused or aggravated by his service. Edited 25 July , 2020 by Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 25 July , 2020 'I don't think there's enough evidence to state unequivocally that his death was directly caused or aggravated by his service.' Thank you Dai! I have to agree. terry will want it to state in his records and showing they were connected to each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 25 July , 2020 Two death certs for the same man, different dates and different names. What chance does a fella have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 25 July , 2020 Buried in Deans Grange under 17/05/1921. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 25 July , 2020 Here is one that looks at first glance to be a doddle. Please help, because I cannot find him anywhere. Edward J Ryan, S.I.H., 5 First Street, Chelsea, London. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IPT Posted 25 July , 2020 Share Posted 25 July , 2020 15 minutes ago, museumtom said: Here is one that looks at first glance to be a doddle. Please help, because I cannot find him anywhere. Edward J Ryan, S.I.H., 5 First Street, Chelsea, London. There are some pension papers here.Is this him? - https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/categories/mil_pension/?name=edward+j_ryan&count=50&keyword="south+irish"&keyword_x=1&location=3257.3250&name_x=1_1&priority=united-kingdom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 25 July , 2020 Sorry IPT I dont have Ancestry. May I have his details please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IPT Posted 25 July , 2020 Share Posted 25 July , 2020 2 minutes ago, museumtom said: Sorry IPT I dont have Ancestry. May I have his details please? Me neither, sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 25 July , 2020 Is his number 541 please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 25 July , 2020 Share Posted 25 July , 2020 9 minutes ago, museumtom said: Is his number 541 please? Yes it is Tom. I'll have a flick through now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 25 July , 2020 Thank you Dai. I am looking at it on FMP at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Rayner Posted 25 July , 2020 Share Posted 25 July , 2020 Medically unfit on mobilization George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 25 July , 2020 Good one George, thank you for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 25 July , 2020 Thank you guys that was very satisfying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark1959 Posted 25 July , 2020 Share Posted 25 July , 2020 (edited) There are 3 ledger cards for a John Downing living at 5 Belmont Cottages. 388404 Labour Corps. Born 1870. Discharged 2/3/19. Debility. Widow Annie. DoD 19/5/21. Same cause of death so definitely your man. Formerly 6181 RMF. Medal pair so served abroad. No other records. As debility not defined and not shown as attributable this seems as far as we are likely to go. Edited 25 July , 2020 by Mark1959 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 July , 2020 Author Share Posted 25 July , 2020 Fantastic finds Mark, thank you very much for that. He was a tricky one to be sure. Kindest regards. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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