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Remembered Today:

museumtom

I need your help again lads and lassies.

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museumtom

Great finds Mark, than you for that. Very much appreciated. 

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little bob

Both Vice-Admiral Stokes and James Towey had died before the war started.

 

Bob

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museumtom

On the ball Bob, on the ball. I did not notice that.

Thanks for keeping me on the straight and narrow. 

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little bob

The age is wrong but Find my Past has a record for 285796 Patrick Shanahan.

 

Bob

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Mark1959

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/search/collections/60522/?name=john_sliney&event=_cobh-cork-ireland_843935&birth=1875&count=50&f-Self-ServiceNumber=156150&f-Self-ServiceNumber_x=1&location=3257.3250&name_x=_1&pcat=39&priority=united-kingdom&viewMode=category

Is RN records for Sliney. Struggling to fin on fmp

His late service from 1914. Discharged 15/3/1919

MID LG 18/5/18. Born 5 Feb 1875. Service from at least 1893.

Star, BW and VM issued to his widow. 

His discharge seems not to be due to disease. So I think we will not get very far with him

 

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Mark1959

Shanahan

There is WFA Pension Card for a man with same address as on Death Certificate. He is 29355 or 39355. RGA. Just says deceased. Searching....

https://www.fold3.com/image/645093440?xid=1022

Looks like 29355. Discharge 15/7/19 

https://www.fold3.com/image/645817651. Claim from father also Patrick

29355 SW Badge https://www.findmypast.co.uk/transcript?id=GBM%2FSILVERWAR%2FBADGES%2F86347 or

on ancestry here

Enlisted 27/7/08.To France 17/9/14 with 4th Siege Battery

Not sure we will get a lot further ithout knowing why discharge, SWB indicates unfit but what with?

Note

I would add 285796 suggested by littlebob was discharged with attributable TB and died 27/4/19.

His records https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBM%2FWO363-4%2F007281189%2F00129&parentid=GBM%2FWO363-4%2F7281189%2F14%2F129

 

 

Edited by Mark1959

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museumtom

Well Mark, you found me out. Little Bob send me the same message and I told him I only realised we had done him before when I re-checked my files. I did not want to say anything to save the embarrasment. Little Bob was going to keep my secret but now, then, mark ols son, the whole world knows I messed up. Seriously though Mark, it was a super piece of sleuthing, thank you kindly all the same.

Shhhhh.

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museumtom

I get you Mark, point taken. I will leave that one behind.

Thanks for all the help Mark!

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little bob

The NA has a service sheet for  Engineman  ES4163 William McLean of Coleraine, who accidently drowned at Queenstown.whilst serving aboard H M D Expectation.  BT377 /7/133568.

 

Bob

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Mark1959

Munns

This appears to be him in 1911

https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBC%2F1911%2FRG14%2F12373%2F0167&parentid=GBC%2F1911%2FRG14%2F12373%2F0167%2F8

WFA Card

https://www.fold3.com/image/669302654?xid=1022

shows discharged 8/12/15. 165760

However served from 1892

Medal Roll shows Star, Vic and BW medals

Struggling to find naval records on fmp but on ancestry see

here

Looks like discharged for "Aortic Regurgitation". On service record That is due to a problem with a valve in the heart  

edit So nothing to do with TB on face of it

Edited by Mark1959

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little bob

Find my Past.  Royal Navy Seamen Records only run from 1899 - 1924. Anyone before 1899 doesn't show up.

 

Bob

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Mark1959

Meyer

Born Birkenhead but died 1920 - death reg in Cork

https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBM%2FADM188%2F549%2F0%2F0013&parentid=GBM%2FADM188%2F71839

Invalided 1/7/19.Disease of ?. Also mention of shell shock

Served from 1903 by the looks of it

Was at Jutland. 

Looks as if I have investigated before. 

This card says disease of brain but does not say attributable or not

https://www.fold3.com/image/644987783

See also

https://www.fold3.com/image/669253073

Shows widow Matilda and correct address

He married Matilda (nee Warren) in Cork in 1911.

Edited by Mark1959

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Mark1959

Moynihan

Could be 132003 born 9/4/1862 Rushbrook, Queenstown. Age a bit out. Served 1885 to 1907. Invalided out but record does not say what for

Service record on ancestry

here

Looks right if this is them in 1911

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Cork/Queenstown_No__2_Urban/Ringacoltig__part_of__Rushbrooke/406034/. Wife Bridget and he is 49 in 1911. 

132003 got the Ashanti Medal 1887-1900 on HMS Racer for an action June 1893. See here

Edited by Mark1959

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museumtom

Excellent Bob and Mark.

 I have sent both mens records and Death Certs to Terry straight away and await news. Fingers crossed they will get through.

Fantastic finds lads.

 Kind regards.

 Tom.

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museumtom

Munns refused as  Discharged with aortic regurgitation ( heart disease) but he died of TB. Meyer refused as 'No obvious connection to service'

I am appealing this as he was discharged with 'disease of brain'. He died from 'cerebral degurgitation' which I reckon are connected.

Edited by museumtom

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George Rayner

Good luck with that Tom

 

George

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museumtom

Thanks George, only time will tell.

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museumtom

I read this as disease of brain, but himself does not see it.

image.png.925d383ba525cce1d16c4a1f7c6e4840.png

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George Rayner

How about pursuing the other cause of death-asthenia?

He was recognised as having shell shock, and also cerebral degurgitation on death certificate so that may help with the persuasion?

But it is difficult to read on service record!!

And there are several cases of this being an accepted cause of death related to service men for commemoration on GWF

 

George

Asthenia is caused by a number of things, but the most common culprits are lifestyle, age, infections, chronic diseases, pregnancy, anxiety or depression,

Edited by George Rayner

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museumtom

It was worth a try George, but the reply is 'His pension confirms ‘Brain’ but there is no indication that it was due to or aggravated by service (the required evidence). With this type of illness (and cancers), it is very unlikely to have been due to service but could have been aggravated by it. Sadly, there is no mention of that being the case so he cannot progress.'

I did not ask about the Asthenia, maybe at a later time.

Kind regards.

Tom.

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museumtom

I thought the discharged with disease of brain might do the trick. I said that I thought there was a bit of leeway with the naval lads, but no, the latest pension cards  tighten up the lot. -' There was but the new pension records are providing the required due to/aggravated by evidence. In any case, the leeway was for illnesses which were almost certain to be service related – TB, nephritis, VDH etc.'

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Mark1959

Pity about Meyer. Will have another search for Melody and Vine from the last two lists - was not having any luck with them.

edit

I do wonder if my brain is getting a bit mushy sometimes. first search today and I find:

https://www.fold3.com/image/645065225

Thomas Melody. Bollyhoully, Co Cork. WFA Card says died 24/1/21. Discharged from Labour Corps  29/3/19 . Card says "Debility". No entry in the attributable/aggravated section. 409839

edit

Medal Roll for BW and VM say previously A/Bdr 3337 RGA.

And makes these his service papers

https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBM%2FWO363-4%2F007273392%2F00710&parentid=GBM%2FWO363-4%2F7273392%2F66%2F710

On ancestry here

Previous service in Royal Irish Regiment 1892-1909. Sadly nothing on his debility

These seems to be his early RIR records. Dates match to the day with summary in the later docs.

https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBM%2FWO363-4%2F007273287%2F00441&parentid=GBM%2FWO363-4%2F7273287%2F50%2F441

On to Vine..

 

Edited by Mark1959

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