museumtom Posted 24 April , 2019 Author Share Posted 24 April , 2019 A great document, Craig, I will pass it on to Terry. Thank you kindly for thinking of it. Kind regards. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 24 April , 2019 Share Posted 24 April , 2019 18 minutes ago, museumtom said: A great document, Craig, I will pass it on to Terry. Thank you kindly for thinking of it. Kind regards. Tom. Currently looking at something regarding pensions which help in some cases - might allow us to get from A to C where B is missing. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 24 April , 2019 Author Share Posted 24 April , 2019 I appreciate it Craig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Rayner Posted 24 April , 2019 Share Posted 24 April , 2019 Well done Dai. Great work I sort of stopped when I saw end of service and discharged. Didn't consider him signing on again. George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 24 April , 2019 Author Share Posted 24 April , 2019 Great work all round, and as Terry said at 19.37hrs 'Yes, he will fly' Thanks team, a great result! Kind regards. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 24 April , 2019 Share Posted 24 April , 2019 Glad to be of help Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 24 April , 2019 Share Posted 24 April , 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, ss002d6252 said: Currently looking at something regarding pensions which help in some cases - might allow us to get from A to C where B is missing. Craig A good find Craig. On the basis that the award of a pension for a medical condition was an acknowledgement that that condition was caused or aggravated by service, I think that this document is important in that it changes the default position about proving causation. This suggests that the tribunal shall only dismiss a claim if they are satisfied that advanced disease was diagnosed at the time of attestation. Doesn't this mean that the absence of tribunal documentation (showing causation or aggravation due to service), is no longer a bar to submitting cases for consideration by CWGC? Edited 24 April , 2019 by Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaJane Posted 24 April , 2019 Share Posted 24 April , 2019 On 23/04/2019 at 22:21, museumtom said: Well this answers the question. Sorry to interrupt the flow, but Arlington Cemetery's find-a-grave database is here, so you should be able to check on Ernest and maybe the others in the same lifeboat (there were more, weren't there?) if wanted; https://www.arlingtoncemetery.mil/Explore/Find-a-Grave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 April , 2019 Author Share Posted 25 April , 2019 Thank you Dai and Seajane. That is a very handy site to have, thank you very much indeed. Todays offering to you for dissection, for which I can find no answer on FMP is this lad. He died from T.B. which seems to have been rife with ex soldiers at Cork. Can you help please. I hate to steer ye one way or the other but the R.M.F. was the most popular unit there. Can you find him, and if possible the vital page or the url for it that will allow him to go forward please? Thanking you very much indeed in advance for any help you can provide. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Rayner Posted 25 April , 2019 Share Posted 25 April , 2019 Morning all Ancestry-and Fold3 of course has his pension docs. Name: Maurice Fenton Rank: Gnr Military Service Region: Ireland, Ireland Death Date:17 Apr 1917 Service Number:33133 Regiment: R. G. T. Title: Pension Record Cards Description: Pension Record Ledger Reference Number: 13/D/5906 George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 25 April , 2019 Share Posted 25 April , 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr said: A good find Craig. On the basis that the award of a pension for a medical condition was an acknowledgement that that condition was caused or aggravated by service, I think that this document is important in that it changes the default position about proving causation. This suggests that the tribunal shall only dismiss a claim if they are satisfied that advanced disease was diagnosed at the time of attestation. Doesn't this mean that the absence of tribunal documentation (showing causation or aggravation due to service), is no longer a bar to submitting cases for consideration by CWGC? It certainly reads that way to me Dai. (I'm still looking for something else regarding the often associated Dependents claims - if we can show the Dependent's claim relied on the man having a valid claim before he died then it strengthens the argument.) Craig Edited 25 April , 2019 by ss002d6252 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 25 April , 2019 Share Posted 25 April , 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, George Rayner said: Morning all Ancestry-and Fold3 of course has his pension docs. Name: Maurice Fenton Rank: Gnr Military Service Region: Ireland, Ireland Death Date:17 Apr 1917 Service Number:33133 Regiment: R. G. T. Title: Pension Record Cards Description: Pension Record Ledger Reference Number: 13/D/5906 George The are actually 2 ledgers when you check Fold 3 itself https://www.fold3.com/image/645029067https://www.fold3.com/image/645809214 First is a basic ledger for Maurice (which notes he received a Chelsea Pension 63094E*), 2nd is for his dependent Father's claim. He is stated as having TB as his disability (as usual though the attrib/non-attrib line is not completed, not a killer but always helpful where they do). * my list of pension numbers puts the Chelsea number between Aug & Oct 16 so it looks like he was discharged for 6-8 months before death. Craig Edited 25 April , 2019 by ss002d6252 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Rayner Posted 25 April , 2019 Share Posted 25 April , 2019 He has medal cards and rolls on Ancestry but no relevant dates on either George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 April , 2019 Author Share Posted 25 April , 2019 Thank you George and Craig, I have sent the links and info to Terry to see if he can nail it down. Without your help I would have been in a position to do this, for which I am very grateful, thank you very much indeed. Kind regards. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 April , 2019 Author Share Posted 25 April , 2019 Craig, if I may please, does it give his next of kin details please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 25 April , 2019 Share Posted 25 April , 2019 Just now, museumtom said: Craig, if I may please, does it give his next of kin details please? Father, Mr John Fenton. Ballinacurra , Midleton, Cork. On Maurice's card it shows that he had been living at 1 Harringon Place, Cork before his death. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 April , 2019 Author Share Posted 25 April , 2019 Brilliant, thank you very Craig, all very useful information indeed. Kind regards. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 25 April , 2019 Share Posted 25 April , 2019 Hmm. Can't find anything on Ancestry I'm afraid. Is he the RGA man or the RMF man? 3 men with MICs, I think we can discount the Labour Corps/& (IIRC Essex Regt) man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 25 April , 2019 Share Posted 25 April , 2019 2 minutes ago, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr said: Hmm. Can't find anything on Ancestry I'm afraid. Is he the RGA man or the RMF man? 3 men with MICs, I think we can discount the Labour Corps/& (IIRC Essex Regt) man. Fenton was RGA. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 April , 2019 Author Share Posted 25 April , 2019 RGA is right, I assumed it might be RMF, sorry lads. This soldier looks like he would qualify, but I cannot find the necessary sheet in FMP, can you help please? James Last name Gallagher Age 34 Birth year 1881 Service number 6493 Regiment Royal Garrison Artillery Year 1915 Series WO 363 Series description Wo 363 - First World War Service Records 'Burnt Documents' Archive The National Archives Record set British Army Service Records Category Military, armed forces & conflict Subcategory First World War Collections from Great Britain, UK None Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 25 April , 2019 Share Posted 25 April , 2019 41 minutes ago, museumtom said: RGA is right, I assumed it might be RMF, sorry lads. This soldier looks like he would qualify, but I cannot find the necessary sheet in FMP, can you help please? James Last name Gallagher Age 34 Birth year 1881 Service number 6493 Regiment Royal Garrison Artillery Year 1915 Series WO 363 Series description Wo 363 - First World War Service Records 'Burnt Documents' Archive The National Archives Record set British Army Service Records Category Military, armed forces & conflict Subcategory First World War Collections from Great Britain, UK None Record on Ancestry for #6493 Gallagher, Discharged medically unfit - can't see any reason given. Widows pension was paid so this is one I suspect may be looked at again on that basis once I can figure out some bits on that. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 April , 2019 Author Share Posted 25 April , 2019 Thanks Craig, I appreciate that very much. Fingers crossed! Kind regards. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Rayner Posted 25 April , 2019 Share Posted 25 April , 2019 Don't know if it will garner further information but FMP has three service numbers for him First name(s)James Last name Gallagher Year 1914-20 Service number SR/6493, 281493 Second service number 281493 Rank Gunner, Gunner Second rank Gunner Regiment Royal Garrison Artillery Second corps Royal Garrison Artillery George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 25 April , 2019 Author Share Posted 25 April , 2019 Thank you George, I only see two numbers and I put them in to FMP and did not get a hit, what's your secret? Thanks for the help! Kind regards. Tom, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Rayner Posted 25 April , 2019 Share Posted 25 April , 2019 (edited) Blind faith and persistence!...and I cant count either George Edited 25 April , 2019 by George Rayner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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