Jump to content
Free downloads from TNA ×
The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

Remembered Today:

Best book on Gallipoli- opinions sought please


Jim Hastings

Recommended Posts

Dear All,

Looking for a book covering the campaign in Gallipoli from the perspective of all participants, but with sufficient coverage of British Army operations at Bde or Bn level and Suvla operations. Any recommendations please?

Many thanks

Jim

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I Agree with George, no doubt about it, Pete Hart's book is the best. That said you should always read at least two books on any topic or subject.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Already a massive best seller in Australia - 'Gallipoli' by L.A.CARLYON published in 2002 - ISBN 978 0 553 81506 1.

Extremely well researched - good end notes section and an excellent bibliography.

Very easy to read and has prompted me to look again at my copy of 'Australia in Arms' by Philip F.E.SCHULER published in 1916. SCHULER was the Special War Correspondent of The Age Melbourne.

Another useful book:The 'Turkish Front 1914-18' by Field Marshal Lord CARVER ISBN 0 283 07347 0 published in 2003 which includes 4 chapters on Gallipoli with other chapters covering Mesopotamia and Palestine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you Gents, and since I also adhere to Peter's idea of reading two + books on a subject I think it'll be Peter Hart's and Carlyon's for me. I have read Carver before, re: WW2 Italian campaign and found him a difficult read i'm afraid to say.

By the way. on another point I think I served with one of your 'Old Boys' from the Warwickshire Yeomanry when he joined the Regs - Phil Smart, think he joined us in 96/7 - remember his t shirt with your emblem on.

Thank you very much

Jim

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Jim,

The best book on Gallipoli is surely the Official History which is a very readable book that summarises the events of the campaign in great style and considerable detail. The only problem is in the interpretation as the author Aspinall-Oglander was a senior member of Hamilton's staff. But look beyond that and the campaign is laid out in all its futile stupidity. The Australian Official History is also a brilliant construct: again with a heavy agenda but stuffed full of the raw material of history and a fantastic piece of work. These are the bedrock of Gallipoli studies. Years ago I enjoyed Alan Moorehead a great journalist historian in who's footsteps Carlyon ably follows. Many of the older books by the likes of Nevinson and North are also riveting reads, while the modern generation are also pretty good (Robertson, Hickey, Pryor & Travers etc) although the single-volume format is now more than a little 'tired', with a lack of space to explore the detail of operations.

For a personal experience account you can't beat Joe Murray and Gallipoli as I saw it. For fun, I really like David Cameron (not the Tory swine) whose books have been eye-opening and an excellent read. But watch out for the new book on the ANZAC Corps 25 April landings by our very own Crunchy - it is truly excellent and explodes so many myths. Gallipoli has been very well-served in war literature ever since 1915. Long may it continue to be so. Sadly as another thread shows some people are incapable of understanding the meaning of the word 'disaster'....

Pete

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jim,

Peter Harts book is amazing and one I'll read again, you could also try getting C E W Beans book from the library although you have to order it, it's called Gallipoli Mission and is an account of his time back on the peninsula in 1919 looking at the ANZAC sector four years after the struggle ended, it has a marvelous input by Zeki Bey who fought at Chunuk Bair he assists the party in their investigation and gives a fantastic account seen from the Turkish perspective.

Regards

Garry

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pete,

Many thanks for your comprehensive listing, I've been spending some time looking into these titles and have decided for starters to still go with Carlyon's and yours (I though your 'The Somme' and '1918 A Very British Victory' were superb - I even got the CD version of '1918' for when the missus drafted me into excess DIY, although Clive Mantle's German accent had me in fits!). I was lucky enough to get to Gallipoli while in HM Forces as a guest of the Turkish Army and was particularly struck by Suvla, where it turns out 2/4th Queens men (from my home town in Croydon) served, as did my final unit, the 1/3rd London Sharpshooter's Yeomanry.

Garry and all,

Thank you for all your contributions and advice, the Forum has always guided me so very well in furthering my knowledge of the GW and towards the right literature.

On a linked note, am I correct in the view that many Allied participants of the Gallipoli campaign saw themselves in some way linked to the Trojan War of the Illiad etc? This may necessitate a new post, but just wondered if there was any evidence of these (or similar) sentiments?

Thanks again one and all

Jim

PS Pete are you working on anything new, or would you rather not say?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Jim,

A lot of the British participants at Helles found the Illiad and Troy in mind as they could actually see the mound in the distance across the Straits. It crops up a lot in the letters, diaries and general writings of those who had a classical education amongst the British in particular. Others ever since have sort of tagged along with that literary 'conceit'.

At present I am (still!!!) working on the editing of single-volume history of the Great War to be published next year.

Another oral history of the war based on my interviews done for the IWM in the 1980s is completed but not yet edited. I'm not sure when that is coming out - it was actually finished before the other one!

I am about to start on the BEF in 1914 where - to grossly simplify - I think that Zuber had most things wrong about the German Army and most things right about the many, many terrible inadequacies of the BEF for a modern continental war! But the real detailled research has not yet been done, so this informed impression may be abandoned yet. In a way I hope so as I am fed up of taking unpopular viewpoints. People do prefer it if you just peddle the myths and legends...

Any way cheers Jim and thanks for your kind words.

Pete

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Pete

I am very interested in the BEF in 1914 so will look forward to that one! History is the search for truth as accurately perceivable from the available evidence, so please do not bend from a viewpoint because of its possible reception - remember for centuries they thought the world was flat until ...

That is very interesting about the association with the Illiad and the Gallipoli campaign by its participants - I'm currently on a Classical Myths course to finish my History Degree and our final dissertation is on how myths and legends changed and were applied through time and I think that would be a very good topic to research (have to get my WW1 interest/hobby in there somewhere!!!)

Thanks again, look ing forward to your 'Gallipoli' and best wishes with your future writings

Cheers Jim

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I shudder to have to agree that Pete Hart's book is the best. Carlyon is also a good read, and Bean's is also worth a read.

It is disappointing that there is nothing in English from the Turkish side of affairs. There are two volumes of memoirs of German officers, but they are both rather puff pieces, but any other Turks who wrote at the time did so in Ottoman script which Ataturk swept away and so there is hardly anyone who can translate. The only book in English that I could find to give some sort of Turkisk perspective was a novel...The Long White Cloud by Buket Uzuner.

You could always try Robert Rhodes James' book......(ducking from whatever Pete has to hand to hurl at me!)

Bruce

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have already referenced Pete’s book as the best single book to cover the scope of Jim’s initial enquiry for “a book covering the campaign in Gallipoli from the perspective of all participants, but with sufficient coverage of British Army operations at Bde or Bn level and Suvla operations.” Pete has helpfully summarised some of the published sources which were most useful to him when writing his book – of which the OH is, of course, key. Others have mentioned Carlyon, and that is indeed a solid, extremely readable account.

But to go off the beaten track a little, here’s a couple of further recommendations.

The 2007 first edition of my good chum Haluk Oral's 'Gallipoli 1915: Through Turkish Eyes' was only ever printed in a sumptuous limited edition of English-language copies. Both that and the Turkish text version have long been sold out, and only obtainable on the second-hand book market at high prices. The good news is that it has just been re-republished and revised under the aegis of the Gallipoli Centenary Centre, founded by Haluk at Istanbul's University of Bahçeşehir. So English-speaking students of the Great War can once again readily buy a copy of this terrific book. It is not, and does not pretend to be, a history of the campaign, but is instead a delightful pot pourri of perspectives on various incidents, happenings and personalities at Gallipoli, with light being thrown on the bigger picture through focusing on some of the detail. It contains a wealth of very interesting illustrations not otherwise readily available to non-Turkish readers.

Also worth a look is the two-volume set published by the Turkish General Staff in 2009, ‘Prisoners of War at the Çannakkale Battles – Testimonies and Letters’. These volumes have Turkish and English text, and focus on reproducing the interrogations of Allied POWs by the Turks, supplemented by POW letters and diaries which never made it home and are now in the Turkish archives. These offer a unique glimpse into what our chaps were saying when they went ‘into the bag’. One can discern quite clearly the naïve blabbermouth from those who’d paid attention at briefings on how to mislead the enemy if captured. Some of the French troops seem to have become particularly loquacious after being captured by the Turks. These books, despite occasionally less than perfect Turkish-English translations, provide a valuable resource which is not otherwise readily available to UK based researchers.

Finally, Janda Gooding’s ‘Gallipoli Revisited - In the Footsteps of Charles Bean and the Australian Historical Mission’ (2009), published in association with the AWM. This book tells the story of Bean’s Historical Mission to Gallipoli in 1919, and aside from an informative text, it’s real value lies in the wealth of contemporary photographs and paintings made of locations on the Peninsula by the expedition, documenting their appearance just after the Armistice. These images are fascinating, and although it’s a large format hardback book, it was well worth taking to Gallipoli for comparison purposes (and left with Peter Hart Battlefield Tours’ fabulous Turkish tour guide, Bulent, who went all covetous when he saw the book – thus saving us carrying it back on subsequent trips!)

53992_10151166541894500_448940178_o.jpg

545478_10151166540874500_2002999613_n.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jim,

I would totally agree with all of the suggestions put forward so far, and for books covering the Turkish side, George has mentioned some of the very best. There is one other Turkish book in English I would put forward, that being the "Companion to the Feature Length Documentary, GALLIPOLI," by Tolga Ornek & Feza Toker. The documentary itself is exceptionally good.

This book has a good over view of the Gallipoli campaign from all participants and includes some excellent maps.

HM

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I also recomend Haluk Oral's book as well as Gallipoli 1915: Bloody Ridge (Lone PIne) Diary of Lieutenant Mehmed Fasih which is a good Turkish account avaialble in English. Sadly it is late on in the campaign - October onwards but it is still fascinating.

Thanks to George for the Allied POW interviews tip - I haven't seen them!

Pete

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Jim,

I am about to start on the BEF in 1914 where - to grossly simplify - I think that Zuber had most things wrong about the German Army and most things right about the many, many terrible inadequacies of the BEF for a modern continental war! But the real detailled research has not yet been done, so this informed impression may be abandoned yet. In a way I hope so as I am fed up of taking unpopular viewpoints. People do prefer it if you just peddle the myths and legends...

Pete

Please Pete try and follow your train of thought. Mr Zuber and I have crossed swords on another platform and I would love you to destroy him; or at least his blinkered view on the German Army. I've spent over 30 years in Germany but it doesn't make me see them as some kind of Übermensch, if I may misuse Nietzsche use of the word. Also the thought of you 'peddling' makes me shudder! :P

Jim

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For the Turkish side, I am surprised that Erickson's Gallipoli: The Ottoman Campaign has not been mentioned. Covers the entire campaigns from the Ottoman viewpoint. Recommended.

Jeff

post-4942-0-16651700-1350094617_thumb.jp

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The 2007 first edition of my good chum Haluk Oral's 'Gallipoli 1915: Through Turkish Eyes' was only ever printed in a sumptuous limited edition of English-language copies. … …*

It is not, and does not pretend to be, a history of the campaign, but is instead a delightful pot pourri of perspectives on various incidents, happenings and personalities at Gallipoli, with light being thrown on the bigger picture through focusing on some of the detail.

*'sumptuous limited edition' as befits a cultural project of one of Turkey's leading banks: Türkiye Iş Bankasi Kültür Yayinlari.

Neither does it pretend to be anything other than Anzac orientated: Zafer Toprak's 'Foreword' concludes with a sentence defining the period under Haluk's scrutiny as “25th April – 20 December 1915.” Outside of the main Anzac theme, the book has interesting chapters on 'Propaganda,' 'A Grave at Bolayir' and 'Lawrence at Gallipoli' – the latter describing the maps produced during the campaign.

“It contains a wealth of very interesting illustrations not otherwise readily available to non-Turkish readers” - this is certainly correct and a very valuable aspect of this excellent book

As Jeff has also pointed out above, Col Edward J Erickson's book is an absolute must for every Gallipoli enthusiast's bookshelf. Like Haluk Oral, Erickson does not try to be 'comprehensive,' but rather in his case, he presents the view from the Turkish lines, with the benefit of access to Turkish general staff's archives in Ankara, concentrating on the operational side, and with very few of what he describes as 'human-interest vignettes.'

Michael

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

For anyone visiting Kew, Gallipoli Revisited, is available at £8.99 from the NA bookstall (it may be out of sight now as they were removing quite a number of the reduced titles to make way for seasonal material, but there were several copies left after I bought mine on Friday.

Peter's book was on the shelves at FULL PRICE. Not even autographed.

Keith

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Jim,

Peter Harts book is amazing and one I'll read again, you could also try getting C E W Beans book from the library although you have to order it, it's called Gallipoli Mission and is an account of his time back on the peninsula in 1919 looking at the ANZAC sector four years after the struggle ended, it has a marvelous input by Zeki Bey who fought at Chunuk Bair he assists the party in their investigation and gives a fantastic account seen from the Turkish perspective.

Regards

Garry

I am currently revisiting C.E.W.BEAN's book Gallipoli Mission (first published 1948) reprinted in 1991 .ISBN0 7333 0022 7." It is the story of the attempt to decipher, mainly from marks left for several years on the ground, some of the events of a famous campaign; to trace them from relics we came upon - sometimes exactly where we expected to find them, sometimes quite unexpectedly ........"

Its good to go back and look at Gallipoli from the perspective of those present in 1919 and then compare it with what has transpired since by way of additional information.

Philip

Link to comment
Share on other sites

<snip>.

Peter's book was on the shelves at FULL PRICE. Not even autographed.

Keith

That must be the one he gave to George. It's the only copy in the entire print-run that escaped the ravening pen!

Cheers,

Simon

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Looking for a book covering the campaign in Gallipoli from the perspective of all participants, but with sufficient coverage of British Army operations at Bde or Bn level and Suvla operations. Any recommendations please? ... Was Jim's question.

If you have only limited time I would -as Peter said- read the official (British) History bearing in mind the pitfalls Peter pointed out..

If you have more time I would read Tim Travers' and Peter Hart's Gallipoli and ...

As a last one Robert Rhodes James' Gallipoli as you will be able to put it into pespective.

If by now you are interested you could read (to get some views from the "men in the trenches") Peter Hart and Nigel steele's Defeat at Gallipoli and Joe Murray's Gallipoli 1915.

In the meantime (to get visual support) I would by Steve Newmans' Gallipoli then and now.

eric

PS : If you finish all this you will have picked up an uncurable disease : gallipoli fever. Uncurable but fever attacks can be controlled by buying more books and regular visits to the sanatorium called "gallipoli".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A recent rather vituperative exchange on another part of the forum about Easterners and Westerners drove me to an old second hand book on my shelves which, to my shame, I hadn't looked at properly. MEMORIES OF FOUR FRONTS by Lt.- General Sir William Marshall, with an introductiion by General Sir Ian Hamilton, published in 1929, has within it more than one hundred pages describing the author's experiences with the 29th Division at Gallipoli. It makes a tremendous read, even if you get the impression that Marshall might have been Hamilton's water carrier. There is plenty of anecdote, both about high command and front line experience, with the humorous and the harrowing combined to great effect.

In the realm of fiction, I was profoundly moved by Louis de Berniere's depiction of Gallipoli through Turkish eyes in BIRDS WITHOUT WINGS.

Phil (PJA)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just my 2 pence. Found Les Carlyon's book a fantastic read - very engaging and all the factual characters really brought to life (particularly liked his portrayal of Stopford). As with all the very best writers his background in journalism is a hugely positive influence. Minor drawback: it's a bit of a tome and the girlfriend got tired of me getting her to carry it in her handbag!

Hoping to read Peter Hart's book in the not so distant future.

S

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...