Home leave for troops in theatres other than the Western Front

[John_Hartley]

I know that troops on the Western Front might expect to get home leave about every year or thereabouts. But did the same apply to men in other theatres, say Egypt?

What would have been the arrangements? It seems a long schlep from Egypt to England & back again for a week or so home leave. Away from their unit for around 6 weeks?

[charlesmessenger]

John

No, there was no home leave for theatres other than France & Flanders. The same applied during WW2.

Charles M

[centurion]

A great uncle serving as a captain in Palestine was sent all the way back to France for a Trench mortar course (possibly when they switched from 2 inch toffee apple to 6 inch Newton) and then all the way back to Palestine afterwards - never got the option of spending some leave back in England

[Rockdoc]

Home-leave arrangements were made from Salonika but not until very late in the War and, as you'd expect, began with men who'd been out there from late 1915, i.e. having a couple of years in Greece. Even after the change to travelling via Taranto and by rail through Italy & France it was a long trek so I wonder whether this was a reaction to the French introducing mandatory leave following a period of service after the mutinies? You can't imagine this wouldn't be heard of by the British troops and would have caused difficulties if something hadn't been implemented.

Keith

[centurion]

Home-leave arrangements were made from Salonika but not until very late in the War and, as you'd expect, began with men who'd been out there from late 1915, i.e. having a couple of years in Greece. Even after the change to travelling via Taranto and by rail through Italy & France it was a long trek so I wonder whether this was a reaction to the French introducing mandatory leave following a period of service after the mutinies? You can't imagine this wouldn't be heard of by the British troops and would have caused difficulties if something hadn't been implemented.

Keith

I wonder if this coincided with the effort to bring culture, education and entertainment (in the form of music and drama) to the forces all round the Med. This drive provided Gustav Holst with the chance to serve in some capacity overseas. (He is reputed to have told Vaughan Williams later that laying on supplies of decent British beer might have been more efficacious in raising moral).

[Chris_Baker]

I have seen records that show men going on home leave from Italy and leave to India from Mespot.

[Clare]

I can pin point my grandfather Private John Clare of the South Lancs Regiment at Hebral Camp, Bangalore, India on Dec 17th 1917. He was given a prayer book there inscribed with this information together with his army number. I can only presume he was on leave from Mesopotamia.

[Seany]

John

No, there was no home leave for theatres other than France & Flanders. The same applied during WW2.

Charles M

Certainly there was leave from Italy although not much of it - I have the OC 94 Brigade RGA bemoaning the fact that the majority of men had not enjoyed home leave for 18 months and we have reports of orders being read out on parades explaining why there was so little leave (from senior officers at HQ who enjoyed more than their fair share). Equally from my battery of interest men were granted leave but this was not common until after battle of Piave when things started to settle down a bit - instead a holiday camp was established at Sermione on the shore of lake Garda.

[centurion]

I can pin point my grandfather Private John Clare of the South Lancs Regiment at Hebral Camp, Bangalore, India on Dec 17th 1917. He was given a prayer book there inscribed with this information together with his army number. I can only presume he was on leave from Mesopotamia.

Possibly you mean Hebbal Camp in Bangalore. However I think that this was an ordinary army camp and training area and not a leave area. I note there are other members of the South Lancs Regiment who died and were buried there between 1917 and 1918 ( as are men from other regiments). This doesn't sound like a leave establishment. It doesn't seem to have been that unpleasant though - see this photo taken at the camp

http://i.dailymail.c...699_634x444.jpg

[T8HANTS]

A few officers from the 8th Hants had UK leave from Egypt, and one at least to South Africa. Of the rank and file not one appears to have made it home.

[jhill]

Part of the issue is the particular meaning of the term "leave" in the Army in those days.. It seems to me that "leave" meant a temporary absence from one's unit. "Temporary" was a specific interval, often about twenty days. An absence of more than twenty days meant the man had to be struck off the strength of his unit. Similarly, sick at a field ambulance were kept on strength if they were likely to return within twenty days; otherwise they were struck off. Men on leave from France sometimes had their leaves extended; for example, if they became sick while in England. In these cases procedures were spelt out. If the man was likely to be away from his unit more than twenty days, he was struck off strength and posted to some home unit.

This policy was important. A unit could not request a reinforcement to replace a man unless he was struck off. Thus, if men were on "leave" for months at a time, the unit might often be too understrength to fight.

For men far from home, there could be no "leave" for this reason. This issue comes up in various War Diaries of Canadian units. There was no "home leave" to Canada. The only hope for those fellows was "furlough". There were procedures set up for this, but they were only for medical or "compassionate" reasons. There was no expectation that this would be available just because someone had been out a long time.

Even the ten or twelve day leave from France and Flanders was not guaranteed. It was always dependant on shipping space. Most leave ships departed from Boulogne. By early 1918 it was said four thousand men were processed each day each way. However, many days sailing were cancelled because of weather or submarines in the channel. The armies in France were very large by then.

Leave was often offered to France or even Italy instead of to the U.K. to save shipping space. This often appealed to Canadians who had no family in the U.K.

I am sure our various "experts" can quote official regulations about all this.

[centurion]

Part of the issue is the particular meaning of the term "leave" in the Army in those days.. It seems to me that "leave" meant a temporary absence from one's unit. "Temporary" was a specific interval, often about twenty days. An absence of more than twenty days meant the man had to be struck off the strength of his unit.

Some courses were three or more weeks long and I'm pretty sure that men going on them were not struck off the strength.

[David Porter]

BQMS Albert Titford of Somerset RHA was granted leave to the UK from Palestine. He left there on January 21, 1918 and returned on May 1, 1918. His little pocket diary, which is now at Somerset Record Office, gives a few details of the trip home via Italy and back via Marseilles and Malta. He took the opportunity to marry his sweetheart.

Also John Squire, who had left Somerset RHA and become an officer in 266th Bde RFA, was given 3 weeks in the UK during July 1918. He left Jerusalem on June 12, 1918 and reported back to his unit on August 21, 1918. His trip also involved going home via Italy and back via Marseilles.

[centurion]

John

No, there was no home leave for theatres other than France & Flanders. The same applied during WW2.

Charles M

The examples provided in this thread indicate that home leave was not restricted to the WF but that it was very limited in other theatres. It would be interesting to know what was the criteria for granting it and how the very lucky ones were selected.

[centurion]

there was so little leave (from senior officers at HQ who enjoyed more than their fair share).

Evidence please

[Tunesmith]

Home-leave arrangements were made from Salonika but not until very late in the War and, as you'd expect, began with men who'd been out there from late 1915, i.e. having a couple of years in Greece. Even after the change to travelling via Taranto and by rail through Italy & France it was a long trek so I wonder whether this was a reaction to the French introducing mandatory leave following a period of service after the mutinies? You can't imagine this wouldn't be heard of by the British troops and would have caused difficulties if something hadn't been implemented.

Keith

Here are extracts from letters written home by my great-uncle, an infantry 2^nd Lieutenant in Salonica from November 1916.

20th June 1917

Re Leave, please don’t imagine I shall get it – it is out of the question. The regiment has now been in active service (France & here) 22 months & 4 officers have had leave so far, my turn will come at the end of the war & no sooner.

30^th December 1917

If the leave progresses as at present, I might be home in 1918, but don’t put too much hope on it. I shall not till it actually does turn up.

3^rd January 1918

Another officer has left our regt: & as far as I can gather I am either 5th, 6^th or 7^th for leave (according to which of 3 of us goes, who came out on the same boat). In any case however slowly they go, I think I should be home sometime this year. Anyhow let us hope for the best.

January 13^th 1918

As far as I can tell, I am 5^th for leave now in the regt, so if only they hurry things up, I might be home on leave this year.

In the end he didn't get home leave before his battalion was sent to France in June.

No indication from this, I’m afraid, whether leave was given to all ranks or just to officers.

[Rockdoc]

Leave was given to OR from Salonika but, as far as I can tell, not until mid-1918 at the earliest and only then to the old stagers who'd been out there since at least early 1916. Unsurprisingly, it became more common after the War ended but the men still had to return to Greece even when demobiliastion was taking place. AA Section Diaries record men returning in January 1919, for example.

Previously leave to the UK was very rare. Officers might get a few days at Stavros or Salonika but OR went to one of a number of rest camps, if they were lucky. Officers who were being trained or refreshed in AA work would be attached to the AA Section for the period. OR who were sent to help train OR in specific tasks at newly-arrived Sections were similarly treated.

As has been said, people who were going to be away for some time were struck off the fighting strength but they would have been struck off the ration strength as soon as they left, however long they were going to be absent. Men returning from illness usually came back via the appropriate Base system. There seems to have been one for each "branch" of the Army, i.e. RA, RE, ASC etc. I assume that wasn't solely done in Salonika.

Keith

[Clare]

I hope it's not to late to thank Centurion for his post on 24.9.12. The clarification that it was Hebbal camp has led onto so much more fascinating stuff.And thank you for the photos. Brilliant!

[Ed ROBINSON]

Everything in this life, or presumably any other, is relative. The soldier whose lot it was, pleasant or otherwise, to work in Salonica thought of leave only as a journey home to England. But the soldier up the line had a different point of view. Leave for Home was a thing hardly to be dreamed of. But for the officer there was always the possibility of leave to Salonica, although it was not until late in the campaign that it was possible to bring parties of men down, and some of these saw their first town for two and a half years.

From the book Salonica and after by H Collinson OWEN .

Cheers Ed

[Seany]

From 'The Dump' Italy, Christmas 1918

[Seany]

and this one,