von Smallhausen Posted 4 April , 2012 Share Posted 4 April , 2012 Hello, A catalogue of 1923 mentioned pipemusic written by Mc Killop ( or Mc Killap). Title is "Advancing on Wervicq". Now, Wervicq was liberated by the 30th Division, no Scottish units except for the 2/14th London Regiment ( London Scottish). So I was wondering if this pipemusic was written for or by this battalion/ regiment ? Any additional information would be gratefully received. With kind regards from Flanders, Jef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HERITAGE PLUS Posted 4 April , 2012 Share Posted 4 April , 2012 Jef Not an answer for you but here is the music: http://www.ceolsean.net/content/Logan/Book08/Book08%2016.pdf Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Smallhausen Posted 5 April , 2012 Author Share Posted 5 April , 2012 Jef Not an answer for you but here is the music: http://www.ceolsean....Book08%2016.pdf Dave Thank you Dave, that's a nice begin. Jef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrel Posted 5 April , 2012 Share Posted 5 April , 2012 Hello, The Pipe Majors of Scottish regiments traditionally write pipe tunes to commemorate their part in some battles as do some Irish regiment's Pipe Majors and/or Drum Majors. There is a pipe tune, The Battle of The Somme for instance, and I am sure that there would be others written for WW1 battles. Perhaps Steven Broomfield might be able to find out if your tune was written by a member of the London Scottish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Smallhausen Posted 5 April , 2012 Author Share Posted 5 April , 2012 Hello, The Pipe Majors of Scottish regiments traditionally write pipe tunes to commemorate their part in some battles as do some Irish regiment's Pipe Majors and/or Drum Majors. There is a pipe tune, The Battle of The Somme for instance, and I am sure that there would be others written for WW1 battles. Perhaps Steven Broomfield might be able to find out if your tune was written by a member of the London Scottish. Thank you, Squirrel for this information. I will send a PM to Steven. kind regards, Jef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Broomfield Posted 6 April , 2012 Share Posted 6 April , 2012 Jef - PM received. I'm afraid I don't know the answer: the regimental history mentions Wervicq, but the 2 Battalion seem not to have assaulted that place, their advance on 14th october being on the road running between Wervicq and Mons, and only two mentions in the history seem to support the thought tht the LS weren't particularly involved with the place. Te 2nd Civil Service Rifles (2/15th London) were to the right of the LS, so Also the name of the McKillop doesn't seem to appear in the index either, so I don't know. However, I will give RHQ a call next week and see if there is any information which might help. Another thought: the history of the Civil Service Rifles comments that the 14th Division were also in the area and effected a crossing of the Lys near Wervicq. Given that the 14th Div had the 14th Ardylls (42nd Brigade) and 10th HLI (43rd Brigade), is it possible one of these regiments produced this march? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Smallhausen Posted 6 April , 2012 Author Share Posted 6 April , 2012 Another thought: the history of the Civil Service Rifles comments that the 14th Division were also in the area and effected a crossing of the Lys near Wervicq. Given that the 14th Div had the 14th Ardylls (42nd Brigade) and 10th HLI (43rd Brigade), is it possible one of these regiments produced this march? Thank you Steven for your answer. In fact, your other thought might be a possibility. Again new possibilities to think about. kind regards, Jef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom A McCluskey Posted 6 April , 2012 Share Posted 6 April , 2012 Jef, It might be an Irish pipe tune. Aye, Tom McC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4thGordons Posted 6 April , 2012 Share Posted 6 April , 2012 Off the wall thought: It is possible that the reference is to a much earlier war? I think the Battle of Tourcoing, 17-18 May 1794 was fought in the vicinity of Wervicq and I belive the Brigade of Guards (inc the Scots Guards) were involved in this battle so I thought it might be possible this is the reference? However it does not appear until Vol 7 of Logans Collection of Highland Pipe Music (see HERE) along with lots of other WWI tunes so that would suggest it is a Great War reference. Has anyone checked Seton and Grant (Pipes of War) for McKillop this might reveal regiment - I can look when I get home. Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Smallhausen Posted 6 April , 2012 Author Share Posted 6 April , 2012 Hello Tom and Chris, Thank you for your answers, gentlemen. It's always possible it's an Irish tune (Squirel wil be glad if it is , aren't you Tony)... we will wait and see. Chris, I would be grateful if you could look in your list, maybe it contains valuable information. Kind regards and thanks once more, Jef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRab Posted 20 May , 2012 Share Posted 20 May , 2012 Jef, I am going into the Piping Centre in Glasgow tomorrow night. I will see if anybody has any more information on the tune and its composer. You could try this Bagpipe Forum. http://forums.bobdun...orums/index.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRab Posted 21 May , 2012 Share Posted 21 May , 2012 Hi Jef, Sadly no joy on finding anything about the tune or composer. But I have a few other piping friends I can ask. So I will get back to you once I have spoken to them Cheer Rab Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CGM Posted 21 May , 2012 Share Posted 21 May , 2012 There are a few references if you do a google search It's mentioned in The Piping Times, but I only know this because I found the index See here Scrolling down to 62/4 will tell you it was composed by A MacKillop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Smallhausen Posted 23 May , 2012 Author Share Posted 23 May , 2012 Hello Rab, Thank you so much for your efforts and posts. Sorry for waiting so long to answer Sometimes I don't see the wood for the trees in this wonderful forum. Sometimes I have to go to my content to find back my posts .... Kind regards, Jef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanCurragh Posted 29 May , 2012 Share Posted 29 May , 2012 Information supplied to the GWFTeam email - please contact me if you want Lloyd's email address -- Hello; There is a thread on your forum, having to do with the pipe tune "Advancing on Wervicq" The following information may be of use to one of your contributors. John Francis McKillop was awarded the M.C. for his actions at Wervicq on October 14 1918 ... He was at the time serving with the London Regiment, but was formerly from the Highland Light Infantry. (ref: several mentions in supplement to the London Gazette) I've been informed that one Angus McKillop was formerly Pipe Major to the Camerons, and I'm attempting to research a possible family connection. My thought is that Angus may well have been the "A. McKillop" who composed the tune, possibly as a tribute to John (about whom I've learned very little.) You have my permission to provide my email address to any of your members who may wish to exchange information on this. Below is one of the Gazette references to John Francis McKillop: Thank you, for any assistance you can provide. Lloyd M. Bogart ______________________ 9754 SUPPLEMENT TO THE LONDON GAZETTE, 30 JULY, 1919 http://www.gazettes-online.co.uk/issues/31480/supplements/9754/page.pdf [This last appears to be a Military Cross Commendation -- it reads:] Lt. John Francis McKillop, 2/24th Bn., attd. /23rd Bn., Lond. R. During the operations at Wervicq on October 14th, 1918, he led his company with splendid courage and dash. In spite of considerable machine-gun fire he gained the final objective with very few casualties. During his advance he rushed several machine-gun posts and captured 150 prisoners and several machine [page break to 9755] guns. Though, wounded he refused to leave, his company until he had seen his posts in the final objective properly established. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Smallhausen Posted 29 May , 2012 Author Share Posted 29 May , 2012 Hello Allan, Thank you for this great information. I tried to sent you a PM but I'm afraid it doesn' t work. Maybe your inbox is full? I would be grateful if you could PM Lloyd's mailaddress. Thank you again, Jef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Abbott Posted 17 March , 2014 Share Posted 17 March , 2014 There was a Pipe-Major Angus Paul McKillop who served in the Queens Own Cameron Highlanders in the 1890s and who lived until 1942. He was from Nairn as was his son, John Angus McKillop (also Camerons), who apparently died from wounds received at the Battle of Arras in 1917. In an interview by the National Piping Centre in 2013, another piper, namely Jimmy McIntosh mentions a piper called Angus MacKillop 'from Perth' who beat him in a piping competition in 1945. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Smallhausen Posted 17 March , 2014 Author Share Posted 17 March , 2014 Thank You Ron, I'll give the info to my "Wervicq" friend. Jef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Abbott Posted 19 March , 2014 Share Posted 19 March , 2014 Mention of another piper called Angus McKillop (page 7) albeit in 1958: http://archives.ubalt.edu/acgs/pdf/1959.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Uistman59 Posted 4 April , 2014 Share Posted 4 April , 2014 The Angus MacKillop 'from Perth' mentioned by Jimmy McIntosh is more than likely the same one in Ron's link. Angus MacIntyre MacKillop (Born 21 Feb 1918 Died: 30 July 1994) Big Angus was an architect and a very good piper. His father was from Berneray, Harris and his mother from Benbecula, South Uist. I think it is more likely that the composer of the tune was Angus Paul McKillop (born 1863 and sometimes called Angus Paul) born in Nairn. There is a photo of his father Pipe Major Paul McKillop at ambaile.org which is noted as 1890. Angus Paul's son, John Angus Paul McKillop, D Coy. 7th Cameron Highlanders, died on 9 May 1917 of wounded received at the Battle of Arras, aged 26. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Smallhausen Posted 4 April , 2014 Author Share Posted 4 April , 2014 Thank you Ron and Uistman. Jef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Abbott Posted 6 April , 2014 Share Posted 6 April , 2014 I agree with Uistman59. However, it also begs the question as to why he would choose to compose a tune commemorating that specific military action? It presumably meant something to him or someone close to him. The tune also appears to be the only one by the same composer that has been published (based on Bob Pekaar's tune list). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Abbott Posted 11 April , 2014 Share Posted 11 April , 2014 I just obtained 'Floo'ers o' the Forest - Fallen Pipers of the Great War'. By coincidence, there is a Piper Malcolm MacKillop (S/22590) recorded in that book as having served in the 7th (Service) Bn. Cameron Highlanders and then being posted to the depot at Cameron Barracks in Inverness where he died on 15th Feb 1917. He was 20 years of age and survived by his mother, Mrs. Marion MacPherson (formerly MacKillop), of 3 BaInain Street, Inverness. Buried in the Clachan Sands Burial Ground, Inverness and commemorated on the Trumisgarry War Memorial, North Uist. Obviously not the tune's composer, but worth mentioning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Smallhausen Posted 12 April , 2014 Author Share Posted 12 April , 2014 Thank you Ron, I will give the info to my friend, Jef Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboode Posted 4 May , 2014 Share Posted 4 May , 2014 [/size] The Angus MacKillop 'from Perth' mentioned by Jimmy McIntosh is more than likely the same one in Ron's link. Angus MacIntyre MacKillop (Born 21 Feb 1918 Died: 30 July 1994) Big Angus was an architect and a very good piper. His father was from Berneray, Harris and his mother from Benbecula, South Uist. I think it is more likely that the composer of the tune was Angus Paul McKillop (born 1863 and sometimes called Angus Paul) born in Nairn. There is a photo of his father Pipe Major Paul McKillop at ambaile.org which is noted as 1890. Angus Paul's son, John Angus Paul McKillop, D Coy. 7th Cameron Highlanders, died on 9 May 1917 of wounded received at the Battle of Arras, aged 26. Uistman59, Do you happen to know in which regiment the father (Paul McKillop) was a Pipe Major and what his year/place of birth and death are? Aad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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