Medal Cards

[expatpom]

I have been unable to locate the site which enables me to see the Medal Card for a relative who served with the 7th Bn Royal Fusiliers.

He enlisted in the pre-war Army in 1901 aged 18. His unit at that time was the "Provisional Bn and Imperial Yeomanry".

He subsequently served with the 7th Bn R.F. during the war years. He held the rank of Captain (Hon Major).

Can someone please help me locate his record(s). His name was John Cameron Cartwright, He was born in Twickenham in 1883.

Thanks for any and all input.

[roughdiamond]

Here on Ancestry http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?MS_AdvCB=1&db=MedalRolls&rank=1&new=1&so=3&MSAV=2&msT=1&gss=ms_db&gsfn=john+cameron&gsfn_x=XO&gsln=cartwright&gsln_x=XO&gskw_x=1&dbOnly=_F0003FD8%7C_F0003FD8_x&_F0003FD8_x=1&dbOnly=_F0003FD9%7C_F0003FD9_x&_F0003FD9_x=1&uidh=000 if you don't subscribe, click on "View Record" and take the offered 14 day free trial.

Sam

[expatpom]

Hi Sam;

Thank you for the link. I have located the file OK. It tells me that he received a "badge" on the

16/9/16 would that be the SWB? There is no mention of any medal entitlement.....

Ernie

[rksimpson]

Hi Ernie

Indeed it is the SWB, Badge isssued in List 11 . File 9403/5

You have his address and the battalion he was in as well- http://www.1914-1918.net/royalfus.htm

As the 7th landed in France on 24th July 1916 it does seem strange he did not have any medals, but he may not have applied for them??

SWB roll does not give more detail, badge number 841

regards

Robert

[centurion]

Hi Ernie

Indeed it is the SWB, Badge isssued in List 11 . File 9403/5

You have his address and the battalion he was in as well- http://www.1914-1918.net/royalfus.htm

As the 7th landed in France on 24th July 1916 it does seem strange he did not have any medals, but he may not have applied for them??

SWB roll does not give more detail, badge number 841

regards

Robert

Doesn't the card show entitlement rather than issue? My Gt Uncle's card shows the medals and a note added later that he requested them on a particular date.

It's possible that the officer in question was sick and did not accompany his unit when they went to France. This would tie in with the date of his SWB (which was issued on discharge or later)

[tipperary]

That MIC is only for SWB an early one as they only introduced it that month.I cant see a second mic that matches him i will have another look.He would have had to apply for the silver war badge and unlike other ranks as an officer he would have had to apply for his medals i think had he not done so there would be no medal card.Another possible is that he did not serve overseas.And of course there is a chance it was lost.john

I have just looked at Roberts post if his batallion landed on 24/7/1916 and he received his discharge in september in that time scale i would say he was probably ill and did not go to france.

Edited 24 February , 2012 by munster

[expatpom]

Thank you all very much - this has turned out to be an interesting journey for me. The family had lost contact with

him and it may be that his illness went on for some time - although the family does not know the date on which he died.

All of your input is appreciated.

Ernie

[SteveE]

Ernie

There is a Newspaper Index Card on Ancestry that shows a Major John Cameron Cartwright died on 26th November 1945 at "Little Manor", Umdanzani, East London, Cape Province. He was formerly of The Carlton and the United Service Clubs Pall Mall, London S.W.

Regards

Steve

[expatpom]

Hi Steve;

Thank you for that gem - that explains why he could'nt be traced in the UK after 1918.

The family had thought he might have died in the 1918 flu epidemic. We'll try to locate

his place of burial thru other means.

During this research we have identified a Brother of John. His name was Walter Roland

Cartwright. Born in 1883 he too was a Captain with the 7th Bn Royal Fusiliers. He had a

chequered military career - having resigned his commission on the 14 July 1914 but was

subsequently appointed Acting Capt with the KRRC on the 17 May 1915.

Have been unable to locate any of his military records or MIC. We wonder now whether he

too left the UK for S.A.

Ernie

[roughdiamond]

Have been unable to locate any of his military records or MIC.

Ernie

MIC to Walter Rolande (the "E" isn't a typing error by me) Cartwright http://search.ancest...3FD9_x&uidh=000

Eddie, when searching for MIC's, it's better to check the National Archives first http://www.nationala...y=*&queryType=1

Sam

[lynncartwright]

HI

John Cameron Cartwright was my great-grandfather who died in 1945 - his brother was Walter Roland who died in 1925.

We do have some information about the family but by grand-father was estranged from his family in the early 1930's but did name my father John Cameron Cartwright.

You can see details of the family grave at Teddington at

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=87683699

How are you related to the family?

Lynn

[ardhu]

Hi, I am also looking at Major John Cameron Cartwright. I found a record for him on Forces-War-records i think it is called an attestation record 967. On this in highlighted blue is the Victory and British War medal as well as the SWB. I am waiting to hear back from the site to see if they can explain the difference of information to the ancestry site. I have contacted expatpom - I recognised his info. Lyn my interest with John Cartwright may also be family related. My aunt left the UK with a Major Cartwrightee for South Africa, he died out there and I understand she returned home. She was also estranged from her family. She apparently left home to be his housekeeper in London . Jo

[ardhu]

Forces-War-record have come back they state: Major Cartwright is entitled to these medals but never awarded them. officers in WW1 had to specifically apply to receive campaign medals. It is possible he never did apply which is why they are not on his index card.

[lynncartwright]

Hi jo

My great grand father john Cameron Cartwright had quite an unconventional lifestyle. The family had made quite a lot of money from a chain of gentlemans clothing shops across London. He didn't work and from the little my dad was told by my grandfather it seems they lived for some time on a houseboat called the pathfinder travelling round the u.k. My great grandmother Blanche Richie seemed to have separated from her husband when my grand father was young probably in the 1920's. Do you know where abouts in London your aunt was housekeeper?

Lynn

[ardhu]

Hi Lynn, what happened to Ethel Le Brocq, born in St Hilier about 1883, married to John in 1904? The 1911 census shows her in Sheffield as an actress, I couldn't find her on the electoral role but I have just realised today that the vote for women didn't come in until 1918 and only then if they were 30 years old plus, I am know going to look for Blanche Richie, have I got it wrong some where?

Not a lot is known about my great aunts whereabouts at that time, I will see if my uncle knows. Her name was Victoria Rose Partridge, she came from a good family background, with many of her siblings living in the area they were born, even now we want to know more about her. The house boat sounds interesting, do you think that is why John had a PO box in 1918, I thought perhaps he had left for Africa. i had noticed John's father John Walter was a government contractor was this in the clothing industry? They had 4 or 5 servants in one census. The house on the Thames Popes Garden looked wonderful, John had an address ' bivouac popes garden' , I wondered if this was an annex to the house, or possibly the houseboat?

I appear to have become involved in his family and he may not be the major Cartwright I am looking for.

Thank you for replying jo

[lynncartwright]

Hi jo

I'm not sure we know about Ethel!

My grand father was born in 1912 and had a brother and sister. Given the colourful lifestyle maybe he didn't actually marry Blanche.

I have a box of paper records in the attic from my mums research. I'll have a look at the weekend to see if I can find any more info.

Lynn

[ardhu]

Hi, I have checked again and found Blanche on John's 1911 census, I thought I recognised the name and initially read the name of Blanch and the name below as the same surname, a German lady. They are similar. John married Ethel Le Brocq in 1904, his fathers name John Walter Cartwright is given on the certificate although he died a few years earlier. Ethel then appears on the 1911 census in Sheffield but I can't find her after that. The basic information for John can be found on ancestry.co.uk, they do a 14 day free trial (and then you become hooked). if you go onto ancestry and track Major John you will come across me through the little flags things (i think) and contact me through their site if you prefer, I am keen to keep in touch although away on Sunday for 2 weeks. We Will take the iPad with us but not sure about wifi access and anyway will keep looking over the next few days, I am intrigued. I hope you are ok with all this, this GWF site is fantastic, I spent ages looking at the postcard site, just amazing, I want to do more research on Vickys brothers; that is my grandfather and his three brothers all in WW1, they all came home. Good luck jo

[Ron Clifton]

Hello all

Going back to expatpom's original post, if he is described as "captain and honorary major" it is possible that he was the battalion quartermaster, or that he held a Special Reserve commission rather than a Regular one.

Either way, if you search the London Gazette (available online) under his full name you should be able to find the dates of his commission, any promotions, and his retirement/relinquishing commission in due course. Be warned, though, that the LG search engine is not the most user-friendly so if you can't find him at once, don't assume he isn't there!

Good hunting,

Ron

[lynncartwright]

Hi Jo

Good news you do have the right Major John Cameron Cartwright.

I have a copy of his will in which he leaves his personal posessions (excepting motor cars and yachts), an immediate payment of £100 an annuity of £260 and a further £140 whilst she remained unmarried to Victoria Rose Partridge, daughter of the late Josiah George Partridge, Gentleman of Hill House, Stroud.

The balance of his substantial estate after an annuity to his chauffer went to fund a ward at St Johns Hospital, Twickenham in return for them maintaining the family grave and there was also funding for the Royal Fusiliers Association in Hounslow. and the Royal Military Benevolent Fund.

I have a copy of the marriage certificate to Ethel in 1904 which was witnessed by his brother Walter Roland - there seems to be some confusion as to whether he actually married Blanche Florence Ritch/Ritchie but did have 4 children - my grandfather being the eldest. We think that she didnt die until the 1950's but my grandfather has lost touch with her and his siblings.

According to an affidavit which was sworn in the late 1960's in order to prove his claim to John's estate by grandfather Aubrey says that in around 1918 John bought the Naval Launch ML577 which was converted into the Pathfinder and they travelled around the UK mooring opposite the Houses of Parliament for some time - which is probably why he had a PO address.

The family then split up but it doesnt give a date (possibly somewhere in the mid 1920s and my grandfather left the Pathfinder to live in a flat above a shop in Kingston Upon Thames.

Apparently John had kept in touch with the family when he was in London but my grandfather wrote to him c/o The Author's Club or United Service Club and didnt learn about his death until sometime afterwards.

Interestingly during the 1914-18 war the family were in Scotland and although my grandfather recollects John being in the army before the war he doesnt remember if he served during it.

hope this helps

Lynn

[ardhu]

Lynn, thank you for all that information, what luck to come across each other and thanks to expatpom for starting the thread, I can start looking for Vicky. I can't believe it, quite an amazing feeling. I think we had come to the conclusion my aunt didn't marry her major, it would be good to know where she is buried I am sure she came back to the uk but need to check that out. I suggested we could go to South Africa to see if we could find any information, husband wasn't keen, not at all keen. Perhaps not. I wonder how you feel about this, what a story. Phew. Well good luck with your research, the information available is very good, however it's never quite enough. Jo

[ardhu]

Hi Ron, As mentioned above forces -war-records have Major John cameron Cartwright on their site and information about his medals, do you know when a medal record is written out, is it some years after the war has come to an end? Am feeling confused jo

[leibregiment]

Interesting, I have been researching Captain Walter Roland CARTWRIGHT. The King's Royal Rifle Corps. 1915-1919 his papers are in the UK national Archives Reference: WO 339/29904.

CAPT. W.R. CARTWRIGHT 13^th Battalion King’s Royal Rifles. Walter Roland Cartwright was from one of the most prominent early families in Ontario. His family had extensive land holdings in in the Kingston area including a historic mansion located in Kingston. His family was very politically active and his grandfather was a personal friend and mentor to the first Prime Minister John A. MacDonald. His Bio is included at the bottom of the listing.

Walter Roland Cartwright was born in Kingston in 1887. In 1899 he was attending school at Highbury House, England. In 1900 he enrolled at Upper Canada College, listed as a ward of A.B. Cameron of 88 Crescent Road, Toronto.

In 1904 he was commissioned 2^nd Lieutenant, 6^th Battalion, Royal Fusiliers. In June 1914 he retired from the military with the rank of Captain. In August 1914 he was in Austria when the war broke out. He became a civil prisoner, but for some reason the Austrians did not permanently interned him.

On the 17th of May 1915 he was back in England and enlisted as an officer in the B.E.F. He was appointed Captain in the 12^th Battalion of the Kings Royal Rifles Corps and served in France and Belgium including Zillebeke and Sanctuary Wood on June 2^nd, 1916 where the Canadian Corps suffered huge losses.

On the 17th of July 1919 he was serving in Russia at Battalion Staff Officer returning to the UK in October 26, 1919. He retired from the military in 1919.

Any further details or photos very welcome

[lynncartwright]

Hi

Walter Roland Cartwright was born on 19th August 1885 in Twickenham, Middlesex but along with his brother John Cameron Cartwright (my great grandfather) made several trips to their maternal relations in Canada. Their family home was Popes Gardens in Twickenham and Walter Roland is included in the family grave in Twickenham.

kind regards

Lynn

[Steve Turner]

Hi Cartwright family members.

 

I recently acquired this tin trunk which is W18"x D13" x H11". As you can see it is named as belonging to John Cartwright of 11 Well St EC. Having done some research I know that this is in the Hackney area of London. This is a shop with flat over.

 

The voter list data associates John with this Well St address from approximately 1915 to 1924 and from 1920 onwards he is recorded as being with Victoria Cartwright in the same lists.

 

That said, in the voters registers John's "abode" is recorded from 1915 as 86 Rodenhurst Rd, Clapham Park and then from 1923 with 64 Deverill Rd, Clapham.

 

At the point of finding your thread I had established no marriage to Victoria but in the 1939 voters list I did find John C with Victoria R at 25 Riverside, Esher, Surrey.

 

Does 11 Well Street and this trunk fit in with your story at all?

 

kind regards

Steve

 

[FROGSMILE]

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Edited 1 May , 2021 by FROGSMILE