Hospital Ships - Gallipoli

[Guest]

Hello - does anyone know if there are detailed records of Hospital Ships or Transport ships converted for transporting the injured from Gallipoli. I am looking for a list of ships and the dates that they sailed (if they exists). Also does anyone know if (injured) passenger lists were kept and where I might race them? I am researching a man who died at sea on 14th July 1915 and wondered if it was at all possible to trace the actual vessel he was on. Regards MG

[Old Owl]

Martin,

If you pull his service papers at the N/A, then these may tell you aboard which ship he died from wounds and presumably from which ship he was buried at sea.

I would say a fairly good chance

Robert

PS You're not letting this one go without a struggle!!!

[Guest]

Martin,

If you pull his service papers at the N/A, then these may tell you aboard which ship he died from wounds and presumably from which ship he was buried at sea.

I would say a fairly good chance

Robert

PS You're not letting this one go without a struggle!!!

Old Owl - many thanks.By chance on New Year's Eve a friend mentioned her great uncle and the fragments of what they knew about his death at Gallipoli. I promised to research it for them - hence the threads - it is of some related interest as I was once commissioned in the RE as well two life-times ago although was privileged to have served entirely in the Queen's Gurkha Engineers. Regards MG

[kjharris]

Hi Martin

I've consulted my lists of hospital ships, black ships and transports that carried wounded from Cape Helles (assuming that if he is commemorated on the Helles Memorial, that's where he was!) during the Gallipoli campaign and the only reference I have for July was the Grantully Castle hospital ship. It spent 10 days acting as a casualty clearing station off Helles but I don't have exact dates for when this happened.

Grantully Castle does have a war diary in the National Archives - War Diaries WO 95/4145

but like almost all hospital ships, does not have the information for 1915 contained in the file.

Other ships transporting the sick and wounded from the beaches at Gallipoli before the landing at Suvla in August, included: Gascon, Sicilia, Hindoo, Guildford Castle, Galeka, Delta.

At Lemnos, men were transferred to hospitals or sometimes to other ships for voyages to Malta, Alexandria or England so looking at your soldier's file is going to be the easiest method of getting more information.

cheers

Kirsty

[Guest]

Hi Martin

I've consulted my lists of hospital ships, black ships and transports that carried wounded from Cape Helles (assuming that if he is commemorated on the Helles Memorial, that's where he was!) during the Gallipoli campaign and the only reference I have for July was the Grantully Castle hospital ship. It spent 10 days acting as a casualty clearing station off Helles but I don't have exact dates for when this happened.

Grantully Castle does have a war diary in the National Archives - War Diaries WO 95/4145

but like almost all hospital ships, does not have the information for 1915 contained in the file.

Other ships transporting the sick and wounded from the beaches at Gallipoli before the landing at Suvla in August, included: Gascon, Sicilia, Hindoo, Guildford Castle, Galeka, Delta.

At Lemnos, men were transferred to hospitals or sometimes to other ships for voyages to Malta, Alexandria or England so looking at your soldier's file is going to be the easiest method of getting more information.

cheers

Kirsty

Many thanks Kirsty. I really appreciate your help. I will have to trek down to TNA to retrieve his service records and hopefully it will give some indication of which ship he died on. With so many ships in the theatre unless I can get a register of sailing dates I think it will be impossible to pinpoint the ship he was on. This is new territory for me, so thank you for your help.

Regards

MG

[alantwo]

Hi Martin

I visited Kew yesterday and came across a list of ships in and out of Mudros from Friday 25th June 1915 to Firday 11 February 1916. I'm not sure whether it is what you are looking for but a random example follows:

December

Saturday 18th

PANAMA Hospital ship arrived today from Malta.

ABERDONIAN arrived today from Helles. Hospital Ship.

GLOUCESTER CASTLE Hospital ship arrived today from Helles.

DEVANHA Hospital ship arrived today from Anzac.

CARRON arrived today from Suvla with 7th Gloucester Regt 12 Officers 339 Other Ranks, 9th North Staffs 3 Officers 150 Other Ranks, R.E. 2 Officers 82 Other Ranks, R.A.M.C. 2 Officers 23 Other Ranks, R.F.A., 1 Officer 12 Other Ranks, 1st Garr. Batt. Notts & Derby 16 Other Ranks. Various Details Sick and Wounded.

PRINCESS ENA arrived today from Suvla with Details 29th Divisional 12 Officers, 98 Other Ranks, 9th Lancs Fusiliers 20 Officers 400 Other Ranks, 7th Gloucester Regt, 12 & 339. 9th North Staffs Details.

H.M.S.MARS arrived today from Anzac with 7th I.M.A.Bde,4 Officers 75 Other Ranks, N.Z.Field Ambulance 6 Officers 91 Other Ranks, N.Z.Mounted Ambulance 5 Officers 51 Other Ranks, 3rd Light Horse Field Ambulance 5 Officers 17 Other Ranks, N.Z.Engineers 3 Officers 63 Other Ranks, N.Z & A Divisional Train, 13th Light Horse, 17th Batt.A.I.F.10 Officers, 339 Other Ranks, 417 Other Ranks, 29th Bat.A.I.F. 3 Officers 260 Other Ranks.

No passenger lists I'm afraid (other than HMHS Assaye that I'm aware of) but if you have uncovered the casualties unit I might be able to locate a ship. Hope that helps.

Regards

Alan

[Guest]

Alan.

This is very interesting.thank you for the response. I have a general interest so I would be extremely grateful if you are able to provide the TNA reference for these files as I hope to be at Kew on Saturday. It will be useful for tracing reinforcement drafts and resolving them against the War Diaries. As you know the Bn, Bde and Div War Diaries sometimes conflict on reinforcement draft numbers and arrival dates. My particular interest is for the period of the month of August for the Sulva based units, but I also have a specific interest in tracing a reinforcement draft of the 4th Bn Worcestershire Regt at Helles who allegedly arrived in the last days of July or very early August as they only appear on one of 3 levels of War Diary.

Separately I was researching an RE Officer- Lt George Maclachlan Allan RE- from 54th Divisional Engineers who died at sea of wounds received at Helles. He died on 14th July 1915, and I was trying to narrow down the possibilities. I don't know if he was on a hospital ship or a black ship and no idea where the ship was heading - Alexandria, Malta or England. If only a few ships had departed days before and there were records of the departure dates it might help narrow the possibilities.

A real long shot.

Regards MG

[JoMH]

Hello Alan,

I would also be very interested to know the reference number(s) at Kew for the files you mention for ships in and out of Mudros. Could you post the reference here? Or PM me?

Thank you.

Joanna

[alantwo]

Hi Joanna and Martin

TNA reference: WO 95/4359 Lines of Communication, Embarkation Officer (Mudros). As far as I'm aware it isn't available on line. I have photographed the file, about 50 sheets, if that can be of any help.

Martin, there are seveal references to 9th Worcesters on 11th, 13th, 14th July 1915. There are quite a few mentions of reinforcements to 29th Division without the specifics of which Regiment it refers to. The first mention I can find for 4th Worcestershire Regiment is Saturday 18th September 1915 as attached below (I have had to crop the page due the 100KB limit). The only other specific entry for 4th Worcester is on 5th January 1916: 'CALEDONIA sailed for Alexandria today with ......4th Worcesters, and Various Details, of Artillery.'

There are no hospital ships mentioned after14th July until 8th August when DEVANHA and DONGOLA arrived (no mention of where from). I believe it took around [11 hours]* to get to Mudros from Suvla. Prior to 14th July; on 7th July ASTURIAS arrived and on 6th August GLOUCESTER CASTLE arrived both from Malta which suggests that they were heading for the peninsula.

Regards

Alan

*[Edit]

[JoMH]

Alan,

Thank you for posting the reference. I'll put that on my list of things to look up next time I visit TNA.

Joanna

[Guest]

Hi Joanna and Martin

TNA reference: WO 95/4359 Lines of Communication, Embarkation Officer (Mudros).  As far as I'm aware it isn't available on line.  I have photographed the file, about 50 sheets, if that can be of any help.

Martin, there are seveal references to 9th Worcesters on 11th, 13th, 14th July 1915.  There are quite a few mentions of reinforcements to 29th Division without the specifics of which Regiment it refers to.  The first mention I can find for 4th Worcestershire Regiment is Saturday 18th September 1915 as attached below (I have had to crop the page due the 100KB limit).  The only other specific entry for 4th Worcester is on 5th January 1916: 'CALEDONIA sailed for Alexandria today with ......4th Worcesters, and Various Details, of Artillery.'

There are no hospital ships mentioned after14th July until 8th August when DEVANHA and DONGOLA arrived (no mention of where from).  I believe it took around two to three days to get to Mudros from Suvla.  Prior to 14th July; on 7th July ASTURIAS arrived and on 6th August GLOUCESTER CASTLE arrived both from Malta which suggests that they were heading for the peninsula.

Regards

Alan

Alan, many thanks for the references. I was at TNA yesterday (thankfully empty due to the weather) and got copies of these. An interesting file. Every box there is like an Alladin's cave. Regards MG

[Guest patsymac]

Hi, looking for the name of a hospital ship at Gallipoli. Serviceman papers say admitted to HS "ELYS???S" on 19 Aug 1918 does anyone know of a ship by that name please?

thanks

Patsy

[Doc2]

Hello - does anyone know if there are detailed records of Hospital Ships or Transport ships converted for transporting the injured from Gallipoli. I am looking for a list of ships and the dates that they sailed (if they exists). Also does anyone know if (injured) passenger lists were kept and where I might race them? I am researching a man who died at sea on 14th July 1915 and wondered if it was at all possible to trace the actual vessel he was on. Regards MG

Plumridge's "Hospital Ships and Ambulance Trains" has a list of Hospital Ships and other vessels used for the reception, treatment and movement of casualties during the Gallipoli campaign. Page 169, Appendix D. Unfortunately, it is only a list of names, without any dates or other details. Other details are found elsewhere in the book.

[Guest]

Plumridge's "Hospital Ships and Ambulance Trains" has a list of Hospital Ships and other vessels used for the reception, treatment and movement of casualties during the Gallipoli campaign. Page 169, Appendix D. Unfortunately, it is only a list of names, without any dates or other details. Other details are found elsewhere in the book.

Thanks. Much appreciated. MG

[TEW]

Interesting but incomplete narrative on evacuating 29th Div wounded from Sulva Bay 25/4/1915. Mentions the ARAGON, NEWMARKET, CLACTON, DONGOLA.

TEW

[Guest ian mcneil]

Hi I am also trying to get information on a soldier who died of wounds at sea on July 14th 1915 Leslie Tulk from the Manchester Regiment. and don't seem to be getting very far, any help would be appreciated.

[Kath]

Unfortunately 'Soldiers Effects' records on Ancestry just says Place of Death: At Sea and Died of Wounds.

Sometimes the HS name is given.

Kath.

[BarbaraG]

Hi I am also trying to get information on a soldier who died of wounds at sea on July 14th 1915 Leslie Tulk from the Manchester Regiment. and don't seem to be getting very far, any help would be appreciated.

Just back from trip to Gallipoli and visited Helles Memorial. Not sure what info. you may have but I can send some details.

Knellie

[lancashire]

HMS Soudran (on wikpedia) also in the area, my grandfather was on it march 1915, near Gaba Tepe, unable to locate any naval logs so far for it.

[Lawryleslie]

HMS Soudran (on wikpedia) also in the area, my grandfather was on it march 1915, near Gaba Tepe, unable to locate any naval logs so far for it.

Think you mean HM Hospital Ship Soudan. My grandfather too was evacuated on this ship to Bighi Hospital in Malta. This was after the 3rd Battle of Krithia and he arrived in Malta on 11th June.

I recently read a book called Roses of No-Man's Land. It's about the medical services during WW1. I described in great detail the horrors on these Gallipoli hospital ships with the injured soldiers lying on bare decks with little more than a blanket and often lying among the dead and dying. Medical resources including personnel were few because they were spread so thinly across the theatre of war. A very harrowing read knowing that my Grandfather was probably one of those men. Fortunately he survived returning to England late June 1915 but was medically discharged because of the shrapnel wounds to his back. He carried the shrapnel in his back for the rest of his life until he died in 1970.

[lancashire]

Yes, I found a photograph of the ship it does say HMSH Soudan, my grandfather was on it for a week or so after his plane suffered a self disintegrating propeller!, I know this from the Ark Royal Logs. The picture is of the ship leaving Malta, I can pdf / jpeg it and I guess attach it, rgds J

[Hedley Malloch]

Does anyone know if lists of passengers on such hospital ships were kept, and if so, do they survive today?

[Kath]

Hedley,

Lists of those who died and were buried at sea exist in the Soudan's logs.

Also, I think, men taken on board or transferred to other ships.

I would have to look at the Soudan's 1915 log I have.

Kath.

[alantwo]

Hedley

There are nine Admission and Discharge books for HMHS Assaye at Kew, about 6000 names, for Gallipoli. I've transcribed all of them, if you are looking for someone in particular let me have details and I'll help if I can.

Regards

Alan

[Hedley Malloch]

Alan and Kath,

Thanks very much. The ship is the S.S. Neuralia. I am interested in a Private James Walsh, Irish, born in Tullamore, regiment unknown, but a time-expired regular. Seriously wounded with two bullets in his head, he was pronounced dead whilst in transit on the Neuralia. As his body was being prepared for burial at sea, he sat up and asked for a drink. The date is August 11 1915. He survived the war.