WW1 Military Motors - 1916 set x 50 cards

[Rockdoc]

The Navy had thoughts about AA work before the Army did and they had some ships fitted by the start of WW1. Their weapon of choice was the 3-in 20-cwt, a better gun than either of the Army's 13-pdr guns but far heavier since it was not designed to be fitted to a lorry. When it was fitted to lorries for the Army, the weight was greater and centre of gravity was so high that they were very unstable away from decent roads. Inevitably, they ended up in rear areas guarding docks and main dumps. As far as I know, the Navy was always responsible for defending its own installations and would have worked alongside the RGA units.

Sights on the Army AA guns were geared so that the gun would put the shell where, as i wrote before, the gunners hoped the aircraft would be when it arrived. The British 13-pdr AA guns had a maximum altitude of about 15-18,000 feet and planes were flying comfortably at 20,000 feet by 1917. One has to remember, though, that shooting an aircraft down was not the sole objective. Keeping it higher than it would like to be was another consideration. The higher the plane the less detailed its photographs were and the more difficult it was for bombs to be dropped on specific targets.

I don't know anything, really, about Naval AA gunnery but I can't help thinking that six-inch gun would have been about as much use as a pea-shooter. A three-inch gun can fire at about 6 rounds a minute and the AA variants had a catch fitted to the breech so they could be loaded while at high elevations. Bigger calibre guns had, as can be seen in these photos, separate shells with the charge in bags, with the weight of charge being varied according to need. I find it difficult to believe that a gun of this calibre could be reloaded with the barrel elevated as in Post 2362 and if it had to be brought down, loaded and reset then the time between firings would have unrealistic for AA work. The recoil had better be very short, too, or the footplate would have taken a real battering.

The date is 1915, though, and this may have been an attempt, as Scalyback wrote, to be seen to be doing something. It may well be true that this was set up in the hope it would be useful against airships. It's mount looks to have been set to allow high elevations but, though I'll be more than happy to be proved wrong, it doesn't appear to be a practical solution to me.

Keith

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Having brought the shell wagon close to the 15 inch Howitzer, the gunners are using the Howitzer's shell loading gantry to off-load the 1400 lb 15 inch Howitzer shells from the wagon.

LF

IWM This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Two photographs showing the gunners using the 15 inch Howitzer's gantry and pulley to manoeuvre the 1400 lb shell onto the loading chute, which is aligned with the breech, prior to the shell being pushed into the breech.

LF

IWM These images are reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

2

LF

[Lancashire Fusilier]

With the shell now in position on the loading chute, it is ready to be pushed into the breech using the ramrod.

LF

IWM This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

In this photograph, we can see the 15 inch Howitzer's massive ramrod which needs 6 gunners to manhandle.

LF

IWM This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

With the 15 inch Howitzer loaded and aimed, and everyone standing clear, the Howitzer is ready for remote firing. Note the next shell to be fired, is already in position on the large wooden trestle.

This particular Howitzer was in action near Polygon Wood, 4 miles east of Ypres, on September 27, 1917.

LF

IWM This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[GRANVILLE]

LF. Do you have a final one in the series showing the firing of the gun?

David

[Lancashire Fusilier]

LF. Do you have a final one in the series showing the firing of the gun?

David

David,

Good clear photographs of the 15 inch Howitzer actually being fired, are surprisingly rare. Plenty of good photographs of before the firing, and I have just one taken during the actual firing ( copy attached ).

Here also, is a link to an extremely interesting and again probably rare, short film of one of these monster guns actually being fired.

http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675048366_British-soldiers_Battle-of-Somme_15-inch-Howitzer_shells-lined-up

Regards,

LF

This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

William Tritton was born in London on 19th June 1875, the son of a London Stockbroker. He was educated at Christ's College, Finchley and King's College, London, becoming an expert in agricultural machinery.

In 1906, he joined William Foster & Co. Ltd., of Lincoln, Lincolnshire, who at that time, were one of the world's leaders in the design and manufacture of agricultural machinery. In 1911, W. Tritton became the Managing Director of Fosters.

In 1914, at the request of the War Office, Fosters collaborated with Daimler to produce the ' Daimler Foster Heavy Tractor '.

Following the success of the ' Daimler Foster Heavy Tractor ', Tritton was again approached by the War Office to develop a machine that could negotiate the terrain of the Western Front and deal with front line obstacles such as barbed wire and trenches.

Tritton's initial idea was to have a heavily armoured and armed Daimler Foster Heavy Tractor, similar in design to Fosters' previous ' Fowler B5 ' armoured tractor, which was also equipped to deal with both barbed wire and deep trenches.

By May 1915, the prototype of ' The Tritton Trench Crosser ' was ready for War Office field trials in Lincoln. The Tritton Trench Crosser was a Foster Heavy Tractor fitted with a modified pair of in-line front wheels on an elongated chassis under which was hung a ' Trench Bridge ' . When a trench was reached, the machine ran forward until the second front wheel was at the near edge of the trench, the first wheel being in suspension over the trench. The chain catch was then released and the ' Trench Bridge ' was lowered to span the trench, allowing the Trench Crosser to cross over the trench followed by other vehicles and infantry.

Although the ' Tritton Trench Crosser ' performed satisfactorily, it was generally considered to be too cumbersome, and was not accepted or adopted by the War Office.

However, Tritton and Fosters were retained by the War Office's ' Landship Committee ' with their subsequent work resulting in the development of the first ' Tank ', for which William Tritton was knighted in 1917.

In 1919, William Tritton was also awarded the than very large sum of 15,000 pounds for his work on the development of the tank, and he was officially recognized as the Tank's co-inventor along with W. G. Wilson.

LF

Fowler's prototype armoured ' Fowler B5 ' Traction Engine.

IWM This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

The ' Tritton Trench Crosser ' produced by William Foster & Co. Ltd., of Lincoln, shown crossing the ' Trench Bridge ' its has just laid.

LF

This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

The Tritton Trench Crosser's front wheel touching down on the far side of the trench, prior to positioning the ' Trench Bridge ' over the trench.

LF

IWM This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

The Tritton Trench Crosser is shown in position over the trench, and about to drop the ' Trench Bridge ' into place.

LF

IWM This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

British Army Officers supervising the field trials of the Tritton Trench Crosser in Lincoln, watch as the machine crosses the ' Trench Bridge ' is has just laid.

LF

This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

British Army Officers supervising the Tritton Trench Crosser's field trials in Lincoln, take their turn driving the machine.

LF

This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

William Tritton and his ' Tritton Trench Crosser ' machine.

LF

This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[GRANVILLE]

Remarkable set of photos but you can't help but feel for those involved. I imagine there must have been such high hopes for a machine such as this and yet you can see at a glance just how inadequate it would have been in practice.

David

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Remarkable set of photos but you can't help but feel for those involved. I imagine there must have been such high hopes for a machine such as this and yet you can see at a glance just how inadequate it would have been in practice.

David

David,

" Necessity is the mother of invention ", and during those critical times some bright minds came up with all sorts of inventions. It was however fortuitous for William Tritton, Fosters, and the British Army that the Trench Crosser was not proceeded with, as a result of that rejection, Tritton proceeded with further ideas for an armed and armoured vehicle able to negotiate the terrain of the Western Front and deal with barbed wire and trenches, and as a result of those ideas, was born Foster's ' Little Willie ' based on designs by Tritton and Lt. Wilson, the rest is tank history.

Regards,

LF

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Bramah Joseph Diplock, born 1857 in Middlesex, may not be a name which immediately springs to mind in connection with the development of the WW1 Tank, however, Mr. Diplock was certainly one of the key players in the early development of an armoured tracked vehicle, later known as a ' Tank '.

As early as September 1900, Bramah J. Diplock had filed a Patent for his ' Diplock ' walking wheel, which later featured in the name of his Company, ' Pedrail ' based in Fulham, London, and in 1902 he wrote a book " A New System Of Heavy Goods Transport On Common Roads " in which he expounds on his walking wheel vehicle system, which later evolved into a tracked vehicle system.

In November 1914, Diplock wrote to the War Office suggesting that his ' Pedrail ' tracked vehicles could be used to transport men and equipment over rough ground, such as that being encountered on the Western Front. After various preliminary meetings with War Office referrals, Mr. Diplock was eventually referred to Mr. Winston Churchill at the Admiralty, who at that time was taking responsibility for the development of various armoured vehicles. Mr. Churchill was interested in Diplock's proposals, and asked for a demonstration of one of Pedrail's one-ton tracked vehicles, which was held on Horse Guards Parade, London on 12th February, 1915. Churchill was extremely impressed with Diplock's ' Pedrail ' tracked vehicle, and on March 28th, 1915 approved the order of 12 Pedrail tracked vehicles.

This ' Pedrail ' Armoured Tracked Vehicle was originally intended to carry a trench storming party consisting of up to 70 soldiers and their machine guns. It was to be 38 feet long, 12 feet 6 inches wide, and 10 ft 6 ins high, weigh 25 tons, and powered by 2 Rolls-Royce 46 hp engines driving 2 single wide ' Pedrail ' tracks. The thickness of the vehicle's armour plate was to be 8 mm at the sides, and 6 mm on the top.

The original design showed this vehicle as having an armoured turret for its main armament, a 12 pdr gun, however, the turret was subsequently dispensed with.

The original ' Pedrail ' construction contract was awarded to the heavy vehicle manufacturer Foden Ltd., of Cheshire., with the complete chassis coming from Rolls-Royce. However. due to a labour dispute at Foden, in April 1915 the ' Pedrail ' contract was transferred to the Metropolitan Carriage, Wagon and Finance Company of Birmingham, whose expertise was in the construction of railway carriages and wagons, and they are known to have built at least one ' Pedrail ' prototype.

In the Summer of 1915, Metropolitan, citing their having too much work in hand, asked to be released from the ' Pedrail ' contract, which was then passed on to Fosters of Lincoln.

Following further trials and evaluations carried out in France, the Landship Committee's Consulting Engineer, Col. R. Crompton, redesigned the ' Pedrail ' tracked vehicle as an articulated vehicle in two sections to better negotiate some of the canal bridges and narrow village roads the vehicle would encounter on the Western Front, in addition, the number of soldiers the vehicle would carry was reduced to 56 men.

With the development of other tracked vehicles now rapidly moving forward, Colonel Crompton again revised the designs for the ' Pedrail ' vehicle and in place of the 2 single ' Pedrail ' tracks he now substituted 2 pairs of ' Bullock Creeping Grip Tracks ' and re-introduced the armoured turret, thereby making the vehicle an armoured fighting vehicle rather than an armoured troop carrier.

Other modifications followed including reducing the vehicle's height to 7 foot 6 inches, and then again down to just 6 feet, and in place of the ' Bullock ' tracks, the new Killen-Strait tracks were added.

Eventually, all the work on the original ' Pedrail ' vehicle was abandoned in favour of the new Armoured Tracked Vehicle ' Little Willie ' designs coming from Tritton and Lt. Wilson.

Although the ' Pedrail ' tracked vehicle was abandoned by the Landship Committee, the Trench Warfare Department subsequently approached the Pedrail Company concerning the construction of a large 12,000 gallon petrol flamethrower tracked vehicle, and Pedrail suggested their original tracked vehicle design would be suitable. The Trench Warfare Department placed an order for one Pedrail tracked vehicle to be used as a ' Flamethrower ' vehicle, which was to be constructed by Stothert and Pitt of Bath, with the ' Pedrail ' tracks being manufactured by the Metropolitan Carriage, Wagon and Finance Co. Ltd., and the vehicle's fame being built by Messrs. William Arrol.

The new ' Pedrail ' Flamethrower Vehicle weighed 32 tons ( unloaded ), and was powered by two 100 hp Astor engines, which gave the vehicle a speed of 15 mph.

A 1915 prototype ' Pedrail ' Flamethrower Tracked Vehicle was built and tested on Salisbury Plain, however, it was not adopted and no further examples were built.

LF

Diplock's September 1900 ' Diplock ' walking wheel Patent drawing, and an early ' Diplock ' walking wheel concept design for a traction engine.

These images are reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

2

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Early examples of Diplock's ' Pedrail ' vehicle system.

LF

These images are reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

2

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Circa 1913 ' Pedrail ' tracked vehicles, the type which would have been demonstrated to Winston Churchill on Horse Guards parade.

LF

These images are reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Prototype of the ' Pedrail ' Armoured Tracked Vehicle which was originally intended to carry a trench storming party consisting of up to 70 soldiers and their machine guns.

LF

This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Although the ' Pedrail ' tracked vehicle was abandoned by the Landship Committee, the Trench Warfare Department subsequently approached the Pedrail Company concerning the construction of a large 12,000 gallon petrol flamethrower tracked vehicle, and Pedrail suggested their original tracked vehicle design would be suitable. The Trench Warfare Department placed an order for one Pedrail tracked vehicle to be used as a ' Flamethrower ' vehicle, which was to be constructed by Stothert and Pitt of Bath, with the ' Pedrail ' tracks being manufactured by the Metropolitan Carriage, Wagon and Finance Co. Ltd., and the vehicle's fame being built by Messrs. William Arrol.

The new ' Pedrail ' Flamethrower Vehicle weighed 32 tons ( unloaded ), and was powered by two 100 hp Astor engines, which gave the vehicle a speed of 15 mph.

Two photographs of the 1915 prototype ' Pedrail ' Flamethrower Tracked Vehicle which was tested on Salisbury Plain, however, it was not adopted and no further examples were built.

LF

IWM These images are reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.

2

[GRANVILLE]

Incredible photos once again - I've never seen this particular beast before. Couple of things spring to mind. I can just imagine how the mechanics reacted at the thought of repairing the Pedrail wheel set-up and as for this beast above, impressive though it might look, you can't help but suspect the most likely appraisal was "oh dear".

David

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Incredible photos once again - I've never seen this particular beast before. Couple of things spring to mind. I can just imagine how the mechanics reacted at the thought of repairing the Pedrail wheel set-up and as for this beast above, impressive though it might look, you can't help but suspect the most likely appraisal was "oh dear".

David

David,

It was certainly a sign of things to come !, with the Mark I Male Tank weighing a hefty 28 tons, and the later the Mark V Male Tank weighing 34 tons, roughly the same weight as the 1915 Pedrail Flamethrower.

I can certainly see the idea behind the Trench Warfare Department's concept of a 32 ton 12,000 gallon flamethrower spewing liquid fire all over the German trenches ! It would have been quite a sight for the German troops in their trenches seeing that monster trundling towards them !

Bramah J. Diplock is rarely mentioned, and yet, his ' Pedrail ' tracked vehicle was one of the first tracked vehicles to be considered by the Landship Committee.

Regards,

LF

[Lancashire Fusilier]

Advertisement for the Metropolitan Carriage, Wagon and Finance Co. Ltd., of Birmingham, who built the prototypes for both the ' Pedrail ' Trench Storming Tracked Vehicle and the ' Pedrail ' Tracked Mobile Flamethrower.

LF

This image is reproduced strictly for non-commercial research and private study purposes as permitted under the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended and revised.