Zimmermann Telegram

[wiking85]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zimmermann_Telegram

Quote:

The Zimmermann Telegram (or Zimmermann Note) was a 1917 diplomatic proposal from the German Empire to Mexico to make war against the United States[1]. The proposal was caught by the British before it could get to Mexico. The revelation angered the Americans and led in part to a U.S. declaration of war in April.[2]...

The portrayal of its contents in the American press on March 1 caused public outrage that contributed to the U.S.'s declaration of war against Germany and its allies on April 6.

The Note included offers to Japan and Mexico about attacking the US in an alliance with Germany if war was declared.

How much did the Telegram really contribute to Wilson's declaration of war in April 1917? As it was the final trigger was the sinking of an American ship without warning headed for Le Havre. The declaration of unrestricted submarine warfare in January resulted in the breaking off of relations with Germany, before the note came to Wilson's attention, and resulted in the policy of armed merchant ships, but also economic disruption along the US East Coast, as merchant ships refused to sail into a war zone, setting off a bitter debate about the rights of neutrals in war that started the slide of the US into war.

However biographers of Wilson suggest that Wilson stopped trying to avert war and actively began psychologically preparing the US for war once the Telegram was revealed to him, even before receiving Zimmermann's confirmation of the note's authenticity. Apparently he gave up on Germany being a 'civilized' nation and now viewed them as a 'mad dog' that the US would have to confront eventually. Still he held back until there had been an 'overt' act of war by Germany, at is the sinking without warning of an American ship in March that led to deaths of American sailors. Its been said that he was still holding out hope for Germany to come to their senses and call of the (unrestricted) Uboat war.

But what if the Zimmermann Telegram is either not sent or sent via Uboat so that it is not intercepted? Will the lack of the diplomatic crisis that resulted keep the US out of the war longer or at all?

It seems that the Note created fear in two areas untouched by the war and were neutral in the outlook: the South, which would have been affected by the Mexicans, and the Pacific Coast, which would have been threatened by the Japanese. This turned American public opinion against Germany, which, even with the Uboat threat, likely made war possible in April.

So what say you all? Did the Note really lead to war in April or was it the Uboats? Or both in conjunction, remove one and the other wasn't enough to declare war on?

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[TonyE]

......It seems that the Note created fear in two areas untouched by the war and were neutral in the outlook: the South, which would have been affected by the Mexicans, and the Pacific Coast, which would have been threatened by the Japanese......

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A minor detail, but the Japanese were on our side in WWI.

Regards

TonyE

[truthergw]

Wilson does seem to have been very reluctant to get involved but the telegram not only was in direct contravention of the Monroe doctrine, German interference in Mexico was a re run of the French filibustering at the time of the Civil War. I doubt if any president could have kept the US out of the war after the details of the telegram were made public.

[wiking85]

Wilson does seem to have been very reluctant to get involved but the telegram not only was in direct contravention of the Monroe doctrine, German interference in Mexico was a re run of the French filibustering at the time of the Civil War. I doubt if any president could have kept the US out of the war after the details of the telegram were made public.

Without the telegram would there have been war?

[Moonraker]

A minor detail, but the Japanese were on our side in WWI.

Regards

TonyE

Nothing to stop them changing sides.

Moonraker

[truthergw]

Without the telegram would there have been war?

I'm not good at what ifs but I suspect that the U boat losses to US shipping were already pushing them into a war. I think the telegram was a diplomatic blunder of the first magnitude which presented another reason for going to war and may have speeded the process. Wilson had promised no war so the telegram was a get out of jail free card which allowed him to renege on that promise and indeed, more or less demanded that he go back on it.

[ph0ebus]

Well, clearly the sinking of ships with Americans on board (resulting in quite a few American deaths) was not sufficient in and of itself.

-Daniel