Saeed Mustapha

[James A Pratt III]

In the oldweather.org there is mention of a Saeed mustapha who seems to be rather active in the Southern Red Sea area during the WW I period. He is mentioned at being transported by the Sloop HMS Cilo with his servant up and down the coast. he could be a intermeadary with the various tribes. Can anyone help me id this man ect? A Captain or Major Tibbets is also mentioned with him. Could he be a british Colonial officer dealing with the Arabs? Thanks in advance.

[michaeldr]

James

The ship involved here may have been HMS Clio (but not Cilo) and I wonder if the gentleman's name has similarly been mis-recorded?

Could it have been Seyyid Mohamed (instead of “Saeed mustapha”?)

quote below is from The Naval Review, Vol. XIII, No. 4, November 1925.

Article titled 'Naval Operations in the Red Sea 1916-1917',

page 648> and in particular pages 651/652

see http://www.naval-review.co.uk/issues/1925-4.pdf

The tribes in the northern portion around Lith are under the

influence of Mecca, but in Qunfudah and its hinterland Turkish

influence predominates. The centre and south are ruled by one

Seyyid Mohamed of the Idrissi family, a cadet of the Senussi

.clan

The Idrissi, as he is usually called, is a man of no mean

individuality. Educated in North Africa he returned to Sabbia,

the home of his family in 1906, and at once set to work to

establish himself as the independent ruler of the Asir.

He met with considerable success, but his extension to the

north was limited by the intervention of the Grand Sherif on

the Turkish behalf. Consequently no very friendly feeling;

existed between Sabbia and Mecca.

Siding with the Italians in the their war against the Turks,

the Idrissi was able by their help to consolidate his position,

and has since then been tacitly recognised by the Turks.

In 1915 the Idrissi entered into an agreement with Aden

whereby in exchange for certain trading privileges he undertook

to take joint action against the Turks.

He cannot be said to have proved a very energetic ally, but

could not be altogether disregarded by the common foe.

The Indian government forced upon the Idrissi four

batteries of old 15-pounder field guns, and some howitzers of an

antique pattern, and at one time he was in possession of 32 guns

with nine partially trained men to serve them.

The Idrissi's capital is at Sabbia, some 20 miles inland from

Midi, and between the two he journeys in a Ford car presented

to him by the British Government

regards

Michael

[rmcguirk]

In the oldweather.org there is mention of a Saeed mustapha who seems to be rather active in the Southern Red Sea area during the WW I period. He is mentioned at being transported by the Sloop HMS Cilo with his servant up and down the coast. he could be a intermeadary with the various tribes. Can anyone help me id this man ect? A Captain or Major Tibbets is also mentioned with him. Could he be a british Colonial officer dealing with the Arabs? Thanks in advance.

James,

I've found the following in Arab Bulletin No 14, 7 Aug 1916:

"Sheikh Suleiman Ibn Ali is the hereditary sheikh of the Al Musa, and has always supported the Turks. The Bahar tribe must refer to the Bahr Ibn Skeinah living along the Muhail Birk road. This tribe threw in its lot with the Idrissi at an early date, and its chief sheikh, Sayed Mustapha, is the generalissimo of the Idrissi's northern army."

This is a explanatory note by British Intelligence Cairo on information gathered from "six prisoners from Kunfuda", the latter location being near the Red Sea. This may be the man you are looking for as Saeed and Sayyid are often confused in transliterating from the Arabic. Both are proper names. The man described in the Bulletin appears to be the same man Michael is referring to above????

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Russell

[michaeldr]

The man described in the Bulletin appears to be the same man Michael is referring to above????

Russell,

I think that you have already answered your own question here

The naval officer who wrote the article for The Naval Review has “Seyyid Mohamed of the Idrissi family, a cadet of the Senussi clan. The Idrissi, as he is usually called...”

If this is correct, then the author of the Arab Bulletin No 14, 7 Aug 1916, which you quote, appears to indicates that “Sayed Mustapha, is the generalissimo of the Idrissi's northern army."

regards

Michael

[michaeldr]

The definitive answer appears when the story of the Red Sea Patrol (R.S.P.) is continued in a later edition of The Naval Review - see http://www.naval-review.co.uk/issues/1926-1.pdf

quote:

Seyyid Mustapha el Idrissi comes to the fore now. He is a distant relative of Seyyid Mohamed - " the Idrissi," and was acting as a Political Agent for us, under the wing of the political representatives at Aden. A splendid type of Arab gentleman, this Mustapha; a great friend of the R.S.P., and a most zealous worker for the Allied cause. He quickly won the Idrissi's confidence in us and in himself, and it was largely his forceful character that eventually got the Idrissian troops to move. Mustapha had a delightful sense of humour; on one occasion, after a very strenuous sojourn ashore, he returned aboard the ship accommodating him, was ushered by the interpreter into the Captain's presence, and, after the usual exchange of greetings, caught sight of his face in the glass and burst into a most hearty and infectious laugh, with a remark which set the interpreter laughing even more boisterously. Now Mustapha's complexion is of a dark walnut hue. At last the interpreter was able to translate the joke: " Seyyid Mustapha says he is sunburnt."

(my emphasis)

regards

Michael

[rmcguirk]

The definitive answer appears when the story of the Red Sea Patrol (R.S.P.) is continued in a later edition of The Naval Review - see http://www.naval-rev...sues/1926-1.pdf

quote:

Seyyid Mustapha el Idrissi comes to the fore now. He is a distant relative of Seyyid Mohamed - " the Idrissi," and was acting as a Political Agent for us, under the wing of the political representatives at Aden. A splendid type of Arab gentleman, this Mustapha; a great friend of the R.S.P., and a most zealous worker for the Allied cause. He quickly won the Idrissi's confidence in us and in himself, and it was largely his forceful character that eventually got the Idrissian troops to move. Mustapha had a delightful sense of humour; on one occasion, after a very strenuous sojourn ashore, he returned aboard the ship accommodating him, was ushered by the interpreter into the Captain's presence, and, after the usual exchange of greetings, caught sight of his face in the glass and burst into a most hearty and infectious laugh, with a remark which set the interpreter laughing even more boisterously. Now Mustapha's complexion is of a dark walnut hue. At last the interpreter was able to translate the joke: " Seyyid Mustapha says he is sunburnt."

(my emphasis)

regards

Michael

Well done, Michael! The gentlemen in the Arab Bureau must have had fun trying to identify who was who among the Idrisi clan...

Regards,

Russell

[bushfighter]

James

If you haven't already seen it you may be interested in downloading this book, and reading Chapter XIX:

http://www.archive.org/details/navyeverywhere00cato

Harry

[bushfighter]

James

I found these two interesting photos a few years ago when trawling through the Liddle Collection at Leeds University, UK.

Harry

[michaeldr]

Russell,

The gentlemen in the Arab Bureau must have had fun trying to identify who was who among the Idrisi clan...

Your right - Everyone an Idrisi and everyone a Seyyid Idrisi at that! I wonder how many more there were?

Having got the first one sorted out in the end, it's strange that so far there is no trace of a strait forward name like Tibbets

Harry,

Thanks for the link to that book

regards

Michael

[Holger Kotthaus]

Dear James

His complete name was:

Mehmed bin ´Alí alias Sejjid Muhammad Ibn Ali al-Idrísi (1876-1923)

If you are interested, here is a good background information:

The Idrisi state in 'Asir, 1906-1934

http://www.smi.uib.no/publ/bang-c.html

A newspapernotice in the TIME about his death on 20. March 1923

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,716200,00.html#ixzz1JfVRVUSZ

And a overlook about his family / clan:

http://i43.tinypic.com/swcthe.jpg

Corcerning to your question about a connection between him and a Captain or Major Tibbets;

I am not sure, but I think Lieutenant-ColonelHarold Fenton Jacob (1866-1936) 1st Assistant Resident and

Chief Political Officer in Aden during the Great War have had visited Mehmed bin ´Alí in 1916 or 1917 with

The HMS "CLIO" or HMS "PHILOMEL" http://www.nzetc.org/tm/scholarly/tei-WH1-Effo-t1-body-d4.html

Here is the book from Jacob: Kings of Arabia, The Rise and Set of the Turkish Sovranty in the Arabian Peninsula

http://oudl.osmania.ac.in/bitstream/handle/OUDL/13581/216702_Kings_Of_Arabia.pdf?sequence=2

Or you know the book Pan Islam from G. Wyman Bury?

http://www.freefictionbooks.org/books/p/5672-pan-islam-by-g-wyman-bury

Here you find more about the items: The memoirs of Sir Ronals Stoors

http://www.archive.org/details/memoirsofsirrona001290mbp

Maybee it is a help?

Cheers Holger