River97 Posted 5 August , 2011 Share Posted 5 August , 2011 I'm hoping this is not a long shot and somewhere one of you will have the answer. As a member of the In From the Cold Project I have spent a portion of time identifying the missing Australian's. Over the period of a couple of years I have noticed that some of these soldiers died at Broughton Hall, Sydney, either during or just after the war. The problem we have is that to get these heroes onto the CWGC Debt of Honour, they need to have a place of burial. (I know there are memorials, just believe me) I have never been able to find the final resting place for any of these men. They may have been broken, both mentally and physically, but they still deserve the right to have their names remembered. If anyone could point us to a cemetery that would be awesome. Thanks in advance, Cheers Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(nzef) Posted 5 August , 2011 Share Posted 5 August , 2011 Hi, I take it the hospital no longer exists? - So no records at all? Are you saying you have no names to go on ? Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
River97 Posted 5 August , 2011 Author Share Posted 5 August , 2011 Wow, that was a quick reply The building still exists, now Callan Park, serving as an elderly care home. I do have names, a couple of which are: 1863 Private John Lewis Strong, 2nd Infantry Battalion, AIF, DoD 19/07/1918, 4822 Private Frederick Ingleby, 15th Infantry Battalion, AIF, DoD 1914-1919, There is one more, that if Archway was up, I would confirm, but here are his details: 21251 Private George Graham, 16th Reinforcements, NZEF, DoD 11/04/1920. Yes, there is a New Zealand non-com without a grave, there is another who died in Melbourne, but that's another story. Cheers Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waddell Posted 5 August , 2011 Share Posted 5 August , 2011 Andy, As you say Broughton Hall is part of the Callan Park complex at Rozelle. It might be worth contacting the Friends of Callan Park or Leichardt Council. http://www.callanpark.com/ Local cemeteries I would look at would be Rookwood, Field of Mars,Bondi, Parramatta. Oddly enough I have been researching an old A.I.F soldier who died there in the 1940's and have not been able to find where he was buried, so I understand your frustration. Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
River97 Posted 5 August , 2011 Author Share Posted 5 August , 2011 Scott, Thanks for the reply, I will give them a bell. I have a strong hunch that I have some buried in Rookwood (not just the above three) but their website seems to be as dead as a door nail. At least I'm not the only one to draw blanks from this place. Cheers Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(nzef) Posted 5 August , 2011 Share Posted 5 August , 2011 Good luck! Keep us informed Cheers Grant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CGM Posted 5 August , 2011 Share Posted 5 August , 2011 Were they returned to their families when ever possible? So buried "back home". Regards CGM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
River97 Posted 5 August , 2011 Author Share Posted 5 August , 2011 CGM, As far as I'm aware, throughout Australia was the same as o/s. Fallen service members were buried in the same locality as they died. There are obvious exceptions to this but I do not think it was that common. They are buried somewhere and there is a cemetery index with their details, I've just got to find it. Cheers Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CGM Posted 5 August , 2011 Share Posted 5 August , 2011 Ah, OK. Good luck with your searches. Forgive me if this is irrelevant but did you see that the Rookwood Deceased Search program is not yet compatible with Google Chrome or Safari. Regards CGM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
River97 Posted 5 August , 2011 Author Share Posted 5 August , 2011 CGM, I use firefox when I'm looking in their site. It seems to be working again, both of them. Unfortunately it seems as though the three mentioned above are not there as they draw a blank. More hunting to do then. Cheers Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisharley9 Posted 6 August , 2011 Share Posted 6 August , 2011 Andy Do you think that the ADF would sub me the flight ticket so I could have proper snoop around Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
River97 Posted 6 August , 2011 Author Share Posted 6 August , 2011 Chris, As a member of the ADF I would have you out here in a heart beat. If anyone could find them it would be you. But, on the other hand our priorities are not the same as others. Of the 90-odd remaining to be found, most have died in and around Sydney and Melbourne. It is very frustrating that they are proving so hard to locate. Cheers Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angrybudgie Posted 6 August , 2011 Share Posted 6 August , 2011 Hi Andy, Could he possibly have been buried at the Gladesville Mental Hospital Cemetery???? These headstones and remains were removed in about 1960 and reinterred at another location....will try to track it down in the morning... Elizabeth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
River97 Posted 7 August , 2011 Author Share Posted 7 August , 2011 Elizabeth, It looks as though anything is possible with these guy's, they could be anywhere. Any additional help I can get is much appreciated. Cheers Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
River97 Posted 7 August , 2011 Author Share Posted 7 August , 2011 Elizabeth, Been doing some hunting around the net and have come up with some things. The Gladesville Mental Hospital Cemetery Act was passed in November 1960. It would appear that only 24 indentifiable graves were transferred to the Field of Mars Cemetery. There is supposed to be a register that was compiled under the Act but I have been unable to trace it. I do have information pertaining to the cemetery, If you would like to give me details of your enquiry I may be able to help. This is from a letter written on Rootsweb, Ancestry. There is also an article in the SMH here that states that the burials were never moved and they no longer have headstones. Wouldn't it be a turn up for the books if the three above were there. To confirm this possibility we would need to get a hold of that register. I guess we will just have to wait and see. Cheers Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angrybudgie Posted 7 August , 2011 Share Posted 7 August , 2011 I've got a couple of other leads to follow this morning...was busy and tired yesterday. No I think they were moved and have a hint on where they were taken, but will follow up this morning. If I do track down the graves, it may need boots on the ground in Sydney to do the final chase up... As for the register, I think the whole complex now belows to Macquarie Hospital. Might be worth seeing if they have a historical section. If the grave of the new zealander has been lost, that would be careless, as he was apparently recognised as a war grave by the government of the day - according to his military paperwork. Both he and Ingleby had relatives living in Sydney at the time of their deaths. Ingleby a sister at Double Bay and Graham a wife at Glebe. Elizabeth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdoyle Posted 7 August , 2011 Share Posted 7 August , 2011 not sure if this helps but Strong and Grahams deaths were registered in South Balmain whilst Ingleby's was registered in Petersham. Graham appears in the long list of NZEF chaps who died after discharge from wounds or disease attributable to war service (NZEF Roll of Honour). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waddell Posted 7 August , 2011 Share Posted 7 August , 2011 I've got a couple of other leads to follow this morning...was busy and tired yesterday. No I think they were moved and have a hint on where they were taken, but will follow up this morning. If I do track down the graves, it may need boots on the ground in Sydney to do the final chase up... As for the register, I think the whole complex now belows to Macquarie Hospital. Might be worth seeing if they have a historical section. That's interesting Elizabeth. Field of Mars Cemetery and Macquarie Park cemeteries are very close by, but these names don't show up on their registry's on-line. I wouldn't regard that as conclusive though. Andy, If you want boots on the ground Andy send me a PM once you've worked out your plan of attack. I work in the area so its no drama if you give me a bit of time. Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angrybudgie Posted 8 August , 2011 Share Posted 8 August , 2011 Scott & Andy, Found this as the supposed location where the graves were moved to, http://www.poidb.com/poi/location.asp?poiid=318046... of course there is no guarantee that these gentlement are there. I will keep looking for information on these men. Elizabeth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
River97 Posted 8 August , 2011 Author Share Posted 8 August , 2011 Scott, Elizabeth, Thanks for what you have offered and done so far, it is greatly appreciated. George Graham appeared on the radar some time ago as he was on the NZEF Roll of Honour, but not on the CWGC Debt of Honour. Through the IFCP we had his service records loaded onto Archway and this pointed us to his place of death. The site listed above directs me to a list of hotels and tourist parks??? I think this will require boots on the ground and thats even if the still have a headstone. I started this topic as I was drawing blanks with every cemetery register I could find on the net. Thanks again, Cheers Andy. Elizabeth, I've just noticed you are from Adelaide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waddell Posted 8 August , 2011 Share Posted 8 August , 2011 Found this as the supposed location where the graves were moved to, http://www.poidb.com/poi/location.asp?poiid=318046... of course there is no guarantee that these gentlement are there. I will keep looking for information on these men. Elizabeth, The link doesn't work for me. Can you give me the location? Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angrybudgie Posted 8 August , 2011 Share Posted 8 August , 2011 Now that's weird......however, a work around....on the page that comes up, in the search for POI box put "Gladesville (tarban Creek) Asylum Headstones" . On the page it takes you to, there should be a map appearing on the right of the page... If that fails, the location is at - Latitude: S33.83996 Longitude: E151.13532 hope this works, Elizabeth ps this will be worth it if any of them are there, otherwise back to square one..... yep that's me in sunny Adelaide Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
River97 Posted 8 August , 2011 Author Share Posted 8 August , 2011 Elizabeth, It worked with the second idea. Having a look at the map and clicking on the satellite tab points the headstones to the Gladesville Hospital. Very strange indeed. Cheers Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waddell Posted 8 August , 2011 Share Posted 8 August , 2011 Andy, Elizabeth, I'll check it out. It is a few kilometres north of Callan Park, but I guess you never know! Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted 9 August , 2011 Share Posted 9 August , 2011 Andy If it helps the State Records Office of NSW has the following listings when I typed in Broughton Hall in their search database. 69 - Agency Callan Park Hospital for the Insane (1878-1914) / Callan Park Mental Hospital / Callan Park Hospital (1915-1976) On 11 June 1878 the buildings at Callan Park were appointed by the Governor to be a Public Lunatic Asylum.(1) The Report for the Inspector General of the Insane lists the proclamation date for Callan ... 01 Aug 1878 ~ 01 Sep 1976 70 - Agency Broughton Hall Psychiatric Clinic Situated adjacent to Callan Park Mental Hospital, No 13 Auxiliary Military Hospital, Broughton Hall was used from 1915 for the treatment of returned soldiers suffering from shell shock and other nervo... by 30 Jun 1922 ~ 01 Sep 1976 1857 - Agency Broughton Hall, No 13 Auxilliary Military Hospital Situated adjacent to Callan Park Mental Hospital, No 13 Auxiliary Military Hospital, Broughton Hall was used from 1915 for the treatment of returned soldiers suffering from shell shock and other nervo... by 31 Dec 1915 ~ by 30 Jun 1920 1858 - Agency Broughton Hall (Branch) Psychiatric Clinic Situated adjacent to Callan Park Mental Hospital, No 13 Auxiliary Military Hospital, Broughton Hall was used from 1915 for the treatment of returned soldiers suffering from shell shock and other nervo... by 30 Jun 1920 ~ by 30 Jun 1922 2080 - Agency Municipality of Ulladulla On 13 January 1874, the NSW Government Gazette published a petition signed by one hundred residents proposing the establishment of the Municipality of Ulladulla. (1) The petition proposed the municipa... 14 Apr 1874 ~ 23 Jun 1948 4978 Series Miscellaneous correspondence [broughton Hall Psychiatric Clinic (No.13 Auxiliary Military Hospital)] The correspondence in this series refers to staffing, requisitions and supplies, military orders, defence circulars, donations, financial matters and war pension claims. (14/8979-80). 2 boxes. ... 1915 ~ 1920 4979 Series Case papers (males) [broughton Hall Psychiatric Clinic] These files provide a record of a patient's treatment. They contain such information as admission and discharge details; a medical summary; progress notes; behaviour and treatment records; test result... 1921 ~ 1955 4980 Series Case papers (females) [broughton Hall Psychiatric Clinic] These files provide a record of a patient's treatment. They contain such information as admission and discharge details; a medical summary; progress notes; behaviour and treatment records; test result... 1921 ~ 1955 Record of appropriations made from annual vote under the title "Mental Hospitals Generally". Chronological entries show date of demand, voucher number, particulars (ie. name of claimant, number and am... Jul 1895 ~ Jul 1941 Item No.7. Broughton Hall and Coast Hospital Extensions Construction. 20 Nov 1919 ~ 20 Nov 1919 B.20/737 Item Broughton Hall 08 Jan 1920 ~ 05 Jul 1920 Regards Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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