yelob Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi everyone, Wondering about the Old Contemptibles and any branches or associations that they might have had in Ireland and any info in general on this. The man I am researching Joseph Kearns Connaught Rangers 8526 was discharged in 1918 and I am trying to build a picture of what post war activities he may have been involved in and I am trying to find any records of what Irish based British Army organisations he may have belonged to. Thanks,Liam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 I have some Kearns casualties in my notes but none from Dublin. Here he is from the 1911 census; http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai000223913/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yelob Posted 16 July , 2011 Author Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi museumtom,he was from Galway originally I think,thanks for the info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archangel9 Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi Liam, I can't answer your questions but I will follow this topic with interest. Here is his SWB Roll information just in case you don't have it yet - Enlisted 28/4/1905. Discharged 4/1/1919. Badge Number - B83697. Cause of discharge - Wounds (Para. 392 xvi, K.R.) Age - 34 years, 282 days. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
museumtom Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 The census says he was born in Dublin. I went by the back of the MIC to find him. Regards. Tom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yelob Posted 16 July , 2011 Author Share Posted 16 July , 2011 John thanks for that info as I was about to ask Kew to send it on to me,can you let me know how you got it for future reference,is it available online as I am researching another man who I need medal roll info for. museumtom,thanks too there seems to be conflicting info from the family as to where he was born,perhaps he lived in Galway at some stage but as you say the census confirms Dublin. Best Wishes,Liam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhifle Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi, This might be him 1911 Census 1st Battalion at Gough Barracks Ferozepore Punjab India “H” COMPANY Private KEARNS, Joseph Single . 26 1885, Nursing Orderly, Co Dublin Dublin, Absent Regards Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archangel9 Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 John thanks for that info as I was about to ask Kew to send it on to me,can you let me know how you got it for future reference,is it available online as I am researching another man who I need medal roll info for. Unfortunately not available on line. I have copies of the SWB rolls for Cork so if the other man has a SWB on the "A" rolls let me know and I'll get you the details. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yelob Posted 16 July , 2011 Author Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Thanks Mark,looks like him OK but I'm curious what Nursing Orderly may mean,I have never seen that in relation to a soldier.Also for my info does the 1911 England Census include all the empire,I'm curious how a man in India pops up on an English census.All new to me as I'm based in Ireland and don't know the extent of the England census. Many thanks,Liam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yelob Posted 16 July , 2011 Author Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi John,thanks too just saw your post but my other man was Dublin and RDF 9 BN. Mark I'm really confused now,can you let me know what census you got that from,I assumed it was 1911 England but that doesn't seem to be online or is it an absent voter list you are accessing? Thanks so much to you all for your help! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhifle Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi Liam, I think Nursing Orderly would be occupation he gave when enlisting. The 1911 England & Wales census included the Army posted overseas and Navy vessels. 'Absent' would indicate he was not actually with the Battalion when the census was taken. I have found with other men with 'absent' that they are attached to another unit at the time. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhifle Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi, Here is the listing, I am not sure if Nursing Orderly would also relate to his 'Trade' while serving in the Connaught Rangers, since only about 10% of the men have a trade listed. Regards Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yelob Posted 16 July , 2011 Author Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Many Thanks Mark,I see now the 1911 census is available,I just couldn't find it on Ancestry. Really appreciate the help.Liam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhifle Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi, Looking at his medal card he was with the 3th Battalion Connaught Rangers when the War started. He was part of a draft with Lieutenant L N Aveling who left to join the Expeditionary Force with a draft of 93 other ranks to join the 2nd Battalion 26 Aug 1914. It also indicates he was promoted to Corporal. Applied for Clasp & Roses 9 Nov 1926, address:22 Halles Street, Dublin. Clasp & Roses Issued 25 Nov 1926 If he enlisted 28 April 1905 the 1st Battalion was at Mullingar at this time. It is noted in the 1st Battalion History in April 1905 'The drafts which began to arrive from the depot now included men enlisted for 9 years colour service, in order to meet the difficulty of finding suitable men for the 2nd Battalion in India.' If he is one of these men it would take his service with the colours up to April 1914. 13 March 1907 1st Battalion sailed on HM transport ‘Braemar’ for Malta 23 March 1907 Arrived Malta 27 Feb 1908 1st Battalion left Malta for Karachi, India on transport ‘Rewa’ 11 March 1907 Arrived at Karachi, India 15 March 1908 1st Battalion at Dagshai 20 Nov 1908 1st Battalion at Umballa 19 Nov 1910 1st Battalion at Ferozepore Between 1 April 1913 and 31 March 1914, 118 men joined from the home battalion, and 5 men on transfer. During the same period 124 men left the battalion from various causes. Regards Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhifle Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi, This looks like a possible on the 1901 Census, working in Galway, born in Dublin and the correct age 16. Regards Mark 1901 Census. Clough (Cappalusk, Galway) Cloonan Hanoria 43 Female Head of Family Roman Cathol Co Galway Farmer Read and write Irish and English Widow - Cloonan John Joe 17 Male Son Roman Cathol Co Galway Farmer's Son Read and write Irish and English Not Married - Kearns Joseph 16 Male Servant Roman Cathol Dublin City Farm Servant Read and write - Not Married - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yelob Posted 16 July , 2011 Author Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi Mark, Thanks again for all this great info it really fills out the history of this man.I'm curious about a couple of things that you might know 1)was the period of enlistment 9 or 7 years and then the reserves,as he was working in civvy life in June 1914 in the railway 2)have you any idea why a Dublin man might have enlisted in the Rangers as opposed to a Dublin regiment 3)can there be any certainty which battles he fought at least in 1914 seeing as he was awarded the 1914 Star. I reckon I owe you a few pints at this stage... Best Wishes,Liam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhifle Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi, I think it was generally 7 years but it looks like a change was made in 1905 to allow 9 years, but I am not an expert on terms of service. If was still working/living in Galway in 1905 the Connaught Rangers would have been the local regiment. I konw at certain times depending on numbers needed the Conaught Rangers were allowed to recruit in Dublin. Without his service records it will be difficult to be certain about which battles he was involved in. Regards Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhifle Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi, I have just found him on a list of wounded in the Irish Times 25 May 1915. Looks like he was promoted to Acting Sergeant and had been transferred from the 2nd to 1st Battalion at some point. List of wounded dated 8 May 1915 1st Battalion Connaught Rangers Wounded. Kearns, 8526, Acting Sergeant, J: Regards Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yelob Posted 16 July , 2011 Author Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi Mark,wonderful stuff again really appreciate it.Any idea what acting Sergeant might mean as it seems from his MIC he was a private then a corporal. Many Thanks,Liam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhifle Posted 16 July , 2011 Share Posted 16 July , 2011 Hi, Probably there was no Sergeant available at the time to replace a casualty, so he was made Acting Sergeant until one became available, when he would be a regular corporal again. Looking at the date he was wounded it would have been during the 2nd Battle of Ypres. Regards Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yelob Posted 17 July , 2011 Author Share Posted 17 July , 2011 Hi Mark,I have passed on all your info to my friend and he is really delighted and says a big thanks. A couple of other questions if I can: 1.what was the purpose of the cap badge numbering if they already had a regiment number 2.is there any means of finding out if he went with the division in late 1915 to Palestine etc as I believe they were amalgamated into the 1bn and then Lahore division Thanks and thanks also to John and Tom,Liam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhifle Posted 17 July , 2011 Share Posted 17 July , 2011 Hi, The Badge Number - B83697 refers to the silver war badge which was issued when a man was discharged from the army. It will be difficult to establish his complete service without his Service Records. Do you have any idea what he did after the war? Regards Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yelob Posted 17 July , 2011 Author Share Posted 17 July , 2011 Hi Mark, He joined the railway company and died ironically in a railway accident in 1939. There is a whole can of worms regarding Irish soldiers who returned home from ww1 and after the rising against Britain and that's an area I would dearly like to dig at.I get a sense that not all of these men were welcomed home even by their own family etc. That's why I was trying to find out if there was a south Irish branch of the old contemptibles and to see if he pops up on any of their records,assuming they exist. It does look odd that he didn't apply for his clasp and roses till 1926,I do wonder about that. Best Wishes,Liam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhifle Posted 17 July , 2011 Share Posted 17 July , 2011 Hi Liam, I thought this might be him from the Irish Times March 1939 Regards Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yelob Posted 17 July , 2011 Author Share Posted 17 July , 2011 Thanks again Mark,great stuff it is him and great too because the railway company have no record of the details of the accident on file. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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