MickLeeds Posted 16 February , 2011 Share Posted 16 February , 2011 Hello, I wonder if anyone can tell me if there remains any lists at all of men who enlisted in the UVF prior to the war ? I've checked the PRONI catalogue but can't seem to find any reference to them. (I know this is slightly out of the bounds of the Great War but relates to relatives I'm researching who enlisted in the RIR in 1914.) Cheers, Mick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desmond7 Posted 16 February , 2011 Share Posted 16 February , 2011 Depends on what area (geographically) you are researching .. I have the unit papers of the North Antrim Regt. which gives names, townland or street addresses, unit numbers and badge numbers. I am unaware of any central database for other parts of Ireland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickLeeds Posted 16 February , 2011 Author Share Posted 16 February , 2011 Depends on what area (geographically) you are researching .. I have the unit papers of the North Antrim Regt. which gives names, townland or street addresses, unit numbers and badge numbers. I am unaware of any central database for other parts of Ireland. Hello Desmond, Thanks for the reply. My family were all in East Belfast (Willowfield) and a couple in Holywood, Down. Cheers anyway, Mick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob elliott Posted 16 February , 2011 Share Posted 16 February , 2011 Hi, There are not many lists left in general circulation now. I think in Co Down there is the Seaford Company lists available. I have Derry City, there is a section of Tyrone and as Des says, he's got North Antrim. Don't know of any East Belfast. Have just got two postcards relating to East Belfast, pics of individual members, neither identified. Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickLeeds Posted 16 February , 2011 Author Share Posted 16 February , 2011 Hi, There are not many lists left in general circulation now. I think in Co Down there is the Seaford Company lists available. I have Derry City, there is a section of Tyrone and as Des says, he's got North Antrim. Don't know of any East Belfast. Have just got two postcards relating to East Belfast, pics of individual members, neither identified. Rob Thanks for the reply Rob. I thought it might be a shot in the dark. Cheers, Mick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pietro Posted 16 February , 2011 Share Posted 16 February , 2011 Hi Rob Do you know where the Seaforde records are? Regards Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob elliott Posted 20 February , 2011 Share Posted 20 February , 2011 Peter, Seaforde enrolement list is in the Public Record Office Belfast. Should be file D.1263/3 Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnumbellum Posted 22 February , 2011 Share Posted 22 February , 2011 I wonder if anyone can tell me if there remains any lists at all of men who enlisted in the UVF prior to the war ? I've checked the PRONI catalogue but can't seem to find any reference to them. (I know this is slightly out of the bounds of the Great War but relates to relatives I'm researching who enlisted in the RIR in 1914.) The Ulster Volunteer Force was, according to one's point of view, a private army, a guerilla army, or a terrorist army. It was founded by Sir Edward Carson and other "die-hard" Unionists, as a response to the then proposed Government of Ireland Bill, which intended separate home rule for the two parts of Ireland. As a non-state entity its rtecords would not normally be found in the PRONI, but, if any surviving records were found, the PRONI might well accept them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desmond7 Posted 22 February , 2011 Share Posted 22 February , 2011 I beg to differ on the holding of 'non state' records - PRONI hosts the excellent 'Ulster Covenant' documents (searchable) which was most certainly not a government sponsored or organised initiative .. and bear in mind that, post partition, the very men who were responsible or the original UVF became 'the state' ... Des Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corisande Posted 22 February , 2011 Share Posted 22 February , 2011 The Ulster Volunteer Force was, according to one's point of view, a private army, a guerilla army, or a terrorist army. It was founded by Sir Edward Carson and other "die-hard" Unionists, as a response to the then proposed Government of Ireland Bill, which intended separate home rule for the two parts of Ireland.As a non-state entity its records would not normally be found in the PRONI, but, if any surviving records were found, the PRONI might well accept them. and bear in mind that, post partition, the very men who were responsible or the original UVF became 'the state' ... One could go through both those quotes and substitute IRA and NLI, De Valera and Republicans, etc and they would scan. Personally I am very grateful that NLI and PRONI hold records for both IRA and UVF. The records are all part of the rich, all be it violent, history of Ireland, and should be preserved Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desmond7 Posted 22 February , 2011 Share Posted 22 February , 2011 Absolutely correct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pietro Posted 22 February , 2011 Share Posted 22 February , 2011 Thanks Rob I'll check them out when PRONI opens again, Peter Peter, Seaforde enrolement list is in the Public Record Office Belfast. Should be file D.1263/3 Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ulsterlad2 Posted 23 February , 2011 Share Posted 23 February , 2011 I have the unit papers of the North Antrim Regt. which gives names, townland or street addresses, unit numbers and badge numbers. Des - Were there many North Antrim UVF who didn't wait for Carson's call* and joined up earlier and ended up in the 6th or 7th RIRifles: 10th & 16th Irish Divisions? * (I am extremely sketchy as to the timeline of events at this time. Don't even know if it's right referring to it as Carson's call but I think you knw what i mean ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnumbellum Posted 23 February , 2011 Share Posted 23 February , 2011 I beg to differ on the holding of 'non state' records - PRONI hosts the excellent 'Ulster Covenant' documents (searchable) which was most certainly not a government sponsored or organised initiative .. and bear in mind that, post partition, the very men who were responsible or the original UVF became 'the state' ... I would point out that I said the PRONI would not normally hold non-state records, but might well do so if they were offered. It appears from Rob Elliott's original enquiry that the UVF records are not there and presumably have not been offered. This is the difference between state records, which should be there by law, even if sometimes under an embargo, and non-state records, which can only be there if private owners offer them. Since my original post it has occurred to me that another place to look is the Linenhall Library, Belfast, which has a specialist collection of everything that it can find to do with The Troubles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob elliott Posted 24 February , 2011 Share Posted 24 February , 2011 Just for clarity, Edward Carson did not form the Ulster Volunteer Force. A decision was made by the Ulster Unionist Council late in 1912, following on from the signing of the Covenant, to draw together the seperate organisations that had been formed via the Orange Order, Unionist Clubs and various private gun clubs and individuals. In January 1913 the UVF was constituted by the UUC to consist of not more than 100,000 men who had signed the Covenant. In fact it was not necessary to have signed in order to become a member. I have a number of papers of enlistment where the man states 'did not sign the covenant but am willing to abide by it'. The papers of the Ulster Volunteer Force belong to the Ulster Unionist Council and therefore the current Unionist Party and i understand are still held by them. Those papers that are in the PRONI are what have, as correctly stated, been donated to the PRO by individuals from Battalion or Company records. Most of these would have come from the Battalion/Company secretaries and have been handed in by the familes of these men at some stage. You can see these in the PRO catalogue system. ie UVF rolls to xxx company donated by the Smith family! The reason for this is the nominal rolls for each district were compiled and kept by the secretaries/Officers and only the returns of numbers would have been forwarded to the UUC, with senior Officers names/addresses. Therefore any rolls of names would remain with the individual. Due to the short life of the UVF as an active unit before the war it is unlikely that many companies had more than one secretary. It is likely that any surviving rolls that are not in the PRO are in private hands, possibly the original family [ i know to one set in Donegal but have not seen them]. I know of no rolls in the Linenhall library! When were the UVF disbanded? It stood down about 1919, after the war and when partition was assured, but did not disband. The West Belfast UVF was revived in 1920. In 1964 the secretary of Derry City UVF was still active on behalf of the City Battalions in trying to recoup monies off the Government for the use of UVF rifles & ammunition in the 2nd war, used for training [actually don't think they were ever used but probably a good excuse for the government to get hold of them during the war years]. Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steven belfast Posted 1 April , 2011 Share Posted 1 April , 2011 The old UVF hospital on the lisburn road, has anyone ever heard of records for it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
setanta59 Posted 31 October , 2012 Share Posted 31 October , 2012 Hi to all, I am trying to research the North Antrim UVF 2nd battalion which covered the Ballymoney area,, any help at all will be greatly appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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