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sooty

Territorial Force War Medal WW1

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sooty

Does anyone know the entitlement to the WW1 Territorial Force War Medal ?

My Uncle Toms joined 3rd Batt West Yorkshire Regiment as a Reservist in 1910.

In August 1914 he was assigned to 1st Battalion West Yorkshires and went to France, Flanders. He was awarded Mons Star., British War Medal and the Victory Medal.

Because he was a 'reservists' (are they the same as Territorial s ?) - should he also have been awarded to the Territorial Force War Medal ?

Its somewhat academic now, he wasn't. But he left me his 'Pip, Squeak and Wilfred' when he died and I had a nice case made for them.

If his 'collection of medals' is incomplete, I would buy the 'missing' one for him, if it was he should have been entitled to it.

Believe you me, if was entitled to something and had not received it - he would certainly want it!

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David Porter

Follow the link and it will tell you about entitlement to the medal.

Territorial Force War Medal

Sadly, your uncle was in the Regular reserves and not a Territorial

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shippingsteel

Off hand I believe it was a full 4 years of TF service PRIOR to the war to establish eligibility for the medal. Plus then of course service during the war.

Cheers, S>S

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Andrew Upton

He was awarded Mons Star., British War Medal and the Victory Medal.Because he was a 'reservists' (are they the same as Territorial s ?) - should he also have been awarded to the Territorial Force War Medal ?

Follow the link and it will tell you about entitlement to the medal.

Territorial Force War Medal

Sadly, your uncle was in the Regular reserves and not a Territorial.

As Davids link shows, entitlement to either the 1914 Star or 1914/15 Star automatically precluded the award of the TFWM. So he wasn't entitled to it.

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Nigel Marshall

Given that the entitlement for this medal is basically four years TF service prior to the outbreak of the war, AND, service in a theatre of war which did not qualify for either of the stars is it fair to suggest that the majority of the medals awarded are to Officers and NCOs of the second line TF units?

I base this theory on the fact that many TF soldiers opted to stay in UK with 2nd line TF units to help train recruits to the new battalions because of an increased likelihood of promotion. This ensured that those soldiers with the required four years peacetime TF service did not qualify for stars as most second line TF formations didn't go over until well into 1916 and 1917, and this seems to fit the profile for the medal quite well.

Any further thoughts?

Cheers,

Nigel

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HarryBettsMCDCM

TFWM Elegibility {From LLT}:~This is the least commonly issued medal. It was insituted in 1920 and only applicable to men or women who had served in a unit of the Territorial Force. To qualify, the soldier must have completed four years or more service prior to 4 August 1914, and if not still serving must have rejoined by 30 September 1914; they must have agreed to serve overseas by the same date; they must have served overseas at some point up to and including 11 November 1918; and they must not have otherwise qualified for a 1914 or 1914-15 Star.

HB

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centurion

Given that the entitlement for this medal is basically four years TF service prior to the outbreak of the war, AND, service in a theatre of war which did not qualify for either of the stars is it fair to suggest that the majority of the medals awarded are to Officers and NCOs of the second line TF units?

I base this theory on the fact that many TF soldiers opted to stay in UK with 2nd line TF units to help train recruits to the new battalions because of an increased likelihood of promotion. This ensured that those soldiers with the required four years peacetime TF service did not qualify for stars as most second line TF formations didn't go over until well into 1916 and 1917, and this seems to fit the profile for the medal quite well.

Any further thoughts?

Cheers,

Nigel

My great uncle Sidney Hansell Kirby was a trooper with the Glamorganshire Yeomanry at the outbreak of war - by 1915 he was a sergeant and he was commissioned shortly before the regiment left for Egypt in early 1916. Attached to the Imperial Camel Corps he fought against the Sennusi in the Western Desert before being reattached to the Glamorgans (by now infantry) in Palestine. He ended the war a captain in the RFA. His MIC shows the TFWM but his profile doesn't match the above.

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clive_hughes

Centurion is right -

there were some units such as the Glamorgan, Montgomery, Denbigh and Pembroke Yeomanries, or the Welsh (Carnarvon) Battery RGA whose First Lines were retained in the UK till after 1 January 1916.

Awards of the TFWM should in a sense be commensurately higher in such formations than in others whose First Lines had departed overseas in 1914-15 (I seem to recall that the Monmouthshire Regiment (TF) with three battalions all landing in France in 1914 only had 55 Other Rank awards of this medal).

LST_164

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Nigel Marshall

Thanks for your input, gents.

I had formed my theory after reading the battalion history of 1/6th West Yorkshire Regiment. Their historian, asserts that a good number of the privates and NCOs in the battalion opted to move to 2/6th W. York. R. as it was either stated explicitly that they would find promotion more easily achieved or they were lead to understand that this would be so.

This seems to clash against the qualification criterion that a soldier must have agreed to serve overseas by 30 September 1914. There is no mention of those men who formed the cadre on which the 2/6th Bn was built receiving TFWM in increased numbers, it was simply an assumption I made, wrongly as it turns out.

Cheers,

Nigel

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Dave W

My great uncle Sidney Hansell Kirby was a trooper with the Glamorganshire Yeomanry at the outbreak of war - by 1915 he was a sergeant and he was commissioned shortly before the regiment left for Egypt in early 1916. Attached to the Imperial Camel Corps he fought against the Sennusi in the Western Desert before being reattached to the Glamorgans (by now infantry) in Palestine. He ended the war a captain in the RFA. His MIC shows the TFWM but his profile doesn't match the above.

I am not sure why you think that his 'profile does not match the above' - he was a pre war trooper in the Glamorgan Yeo., must have volunteered for overseas service but did not enter a theatre of operations on the strength of a unit until 1916. Here is what I have on him.

Kirby,S.H: Glamorgan Yeomanry & 24th (Pembroke & Glamorgan Yeomanry) Bn Welsh Regt.

Sidney Hansell Kirby, 2Lt. 15.4.15: T/Lt., 11.5.16: Lt: 1.6.16: A/Capt: 29.4.17: Capt: 9.4.18:

Appears as 24th Welsh Regt. in AL for July 1917.

Pre war service with Glamorgan Yeo. On amalgamation serving att. 24th Bn Welsh Regt.

Address given in "Glamorgan Its Gentlemen & Yeomanry", as Station Road, Dinas Powis, Glam.

He is listed in the Nominal Roll of the Officers of 24th Bn Welsh Regt. which notes that he embkd. 4.3.16.

Adm. Egyptian Govt. Hosp. Muria (Dysentery) 14.5.16.

Rejoined unit, 27.5.16.

T/Lt. 11.5.16.

1st Class at Stokes Gun Course, Zeitoun, 23.3.17.

A/Capt. whilst commanding L.T.M.B., 2.6.17.

Lt. 1.6.16. (L.G. 21.6.17.).

Adm 66 CCS, 7.9.17. Discharged to Yeo. Base 30.10.17.

Rejoined 231 TMB Palestine, 11.11.17.

Relinquished A/Rank of Capt. on ceasing to command T.M.B. 8.9.17.

A/Capt while commanding T.M.B. 1.11.17.

Embkd Alex. 30.4.18.

Disembkd Marseilles 7.5.18.

Posted to 24th Bn. for pay etc. but employed with 231 T.M.B.

Leave to U.K. 5.6.18. to 19.6.18. Rejoined ex leave 22.6.18. To England to report to War Office 12.9.18.

The MIC indicates service as 2Lt. & Capt. Glamorgan Yeo., & Capt. 81st Brigade, R.F.A.

BWM & VM (Capt.), TFWM (2Lt. Glam. Yeo.). First Theatre, Egypt, 4.3.16. Address: Trevelyn, Cardiff Rd, Dinas Powys.

Classic entitlement for the TFWM.

All the best

Dave

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Steven Broomfield

Also don't forget those men who went to India in 1914 with the TF. My wife's maternal grandfather, a Private on the 5th Hampshires, was awarded a TFWM. he was a pre-war terrier who volunteered for Imperial Service. he celebrated his 21st birthday in the Suez Canal, but wasn't involved in any war-fighting until after 1917.

Men of the Wessex Division and the 1st and 2nd Home Counties Divisions were most likely to have been awarded this medal.

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