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bowiewhist

Uniform identification: Cavalry

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bowiewhist

This is my great Uncle Charles Jones who may have been in the Royal Welch/Welsh Fusiliers, given that he was born in Denbighshire - however I can't find any records for him and wondered if anyone out there could narrow down the field for me from this picture.

Many thanks for any help you can give regarding the regiment, rank, date etc.

post-60230-066092700 1288826090.jpg

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Old Owl

This is my great Uncle Charles Jones who may have been in the Royal Welch/Welsh Fusiliers, given that he was born in Denbighshire - however I can't find any records for him and wondered if anyone out there could narrow down the field for me from this picture.

Many thanks for any help you can give regarding the regiment, rank, date etc.

Hi and welcome to the forum,

This is a very tough one! He is almost certainly a Private or Trooper and could be Cavalry or Yeomanry. It is unlikely that he would be an Infantryman being on horseback, the two do not really go together?

I'm sure that someone with a little more knowledge of the types of uniform etc. may be able to date the photo, but please don't hold your breath!!

Good luck with this,

Robert

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FROGSMILE

This is my great Uncle Charles Jones who may have been in the Royal Welch/Welsh Fusiliers, given that he was born in Denbighshire - however I can't find any records for him and wondered if anyone out there could narrow down the field for me from this picture.

Many thanks for any help you can give regarding the regiment, rank, date etc.

Perhaps he was a Denbighshire Yeomanry man, as they later became a battalion of the RWF. He is certainly dressed and mounted as one would expect a Yeomanry man to be in this photograph. He appears to have a 1903 bandolier on and a Lee Metford bayonet at his waist.

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SteveE

I think it's going to be extremely difficult to identify a unit from the photo, it doesn't look as if there's enough detail evident. It's likely he was Cavalry/Yeomanry but equally he could be part of the Infantry Regiment's Transport section.

Based on his Denbighshire location and a possible Royal Welsh Fusiliers connection? I'll throw this man in as a possibility;

Medal card of Jones, Charles

Corps Regiment No Rank

Denbigh Yeomanry 35 Serjeant

Royal Welsh Fusiliers 345002 Serjeant

Date 1914-1920

Catalogue reference WO 372/11

Regards

Steve

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4thGordons

He appears to have a 1903 bandolier on and a Lee Metford bayonet at his waist.

Agree on 1903 Bandoleer but I am not sure I can say from this copy of the photo that it is a P1888 bayonet (which is what I assume you mean by Lee Metford bayonet) It looks to me as though it could just as easily be a P1903 bayonet.

In fact if I had to bet, given the rough outline of his rifle (which looks to me to be an SMLE) that is what I would bet on.

Chris

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reese williams

The saddle appears to be a Yeomanry pattern saddle rather than the 1902 Universal Pattern of the cavalry.

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JulianB

Excuse my possible ignorance but would a mounted / cavalry / yeomanry soldier actually be issued with a bayonet ????

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shippingsteel

Dating back to around the time of the Boer War, the Yeomanry were classed as "mounted infantry" and as such were issued with rifle AND bayonet.

Cheers, S>S

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JulianB

Thanks, I've learnt something !

So the man is not regular cavalry ?

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FROGSMILE
On 04/11/2010 at 00:22, 4thGordons said:

Agree on 1903 Bandoleer but I am not sure I can say from this copy of the photo that it is a P1888 bayonet (which is what I assume you mean by Lee Metford bayonet) It looks to me as though it could just as easily be a P1903 bayonet.

In fact if I had to bet, given the rough outline of his rifle (which looks to me to be an SMLE) that is what I would bet on.

Chris

I have a P 1903 bayonet right in front of me and at first I thought the bayonet in the photo to be too short, but looking again you are probably correct. By 1914 the Yeomanry should all have been equipped with the SMLE as you say.

Edited by FROGSMILE

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Chriswendy
On 04/11/2010 at 00:06, SteveE said:

I think it's going to be extremely difficult to identify a unit from the photo, it doesn't look as if there's enough detail evident. It's likely he was Cavalry/Yeomanry but equally he could be part of the Infantry Regiment's Transport section.

Based on his Denbighshire location and a possible Royal Welsh Fusiliers connection? I'll throw this man in as a possibility;

Medal card of Jones, Charles

Corps Regiment No Rank

Denbigh Yeomanry 35 Serjeant

Royal Welsh Fusiliers 345002 Serjeant

Date 1914-1920

Catalogue reference WO 372/11

Regards

Steve

This is my great grandfather 345002 charles jones he was from Plasbennion  penycae  he was married to Sophia jones  

 

Just now, Chriswendy said:

This is my great grandfather 345002 charles jones he was from Plasbennion  penycae  he was married to Sophia jones  

 

He was killed 27th of August 1918 

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Chriswendy
On 03/11/2010 at 23:59, FROGSMILE said:

Perhaps he was a Denbighshire Yeomanry man, as they later became a battalion of the RWF. He is certainly dressed and mounted as one would expect a Yeomanry man to be in this photograph. He appears to have a 1903 bandolier on and a Lee Metford bayonet at his waist.

He went to South Africa 1901 for about 9 months and was medically discharged then re enlisted in the TA s in 1902 Denbighshire yeomanry  until his deth

30599_156681-00264.jpg

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FROGSMILE

That fits perfectly then, thank you for posting. 

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Stephen berki

chriswendy you say this is your great grand father from which of his children is your grand parent thanks

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DavidOwen
1 hour ago, Stephen berki said:

chriswendy you say this is your great grand father from which of his children is your grand parent thanks

Stephen

Chriswendy has not logged in since  2017 so I suggest you send them a private message (click on their name and select message) that will then send them an email to their registered email address.

David

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Steven Broomfield
On 04/11/2010 at 12:58, JulianB said:

Excuse my possible ignorance but would a mounted / cavalry / yeomanry soldier actually be issued with a bayonet ????

 

Although this thread has been a little on the Norwegian Blue line for a while, I have just seen this.

 

The answer is 'no' ... well not before late 1914. Bayonets were not issued to cavalry (and, I assume, Yeomanry) until the Great War was under way. The 11th Hussars, for example, received bayonets in late September 1914, and then only a squadron's-worth. Despite being trained to fight (very effectively) as mounted infantry, it was not thought they'd have to lower themselves to hand-to-hand stuff so it wasn't until the trench fighting on the Aisne changed ideas that an issue was made.

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Toby Brayley

As Steven has said Cavalry not until 1914. The majority of the Yeomanry however were in the M.I role and are frequently seen with bayonets prior to 1914, usually, if SMLE equipped, the P1903 bayonet. 

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