Some more group photos, any ideas? Graham family from Glengarnock

[gladys cutajar]

Is this photo any better?

The units my family were in are

Private David Graham G Coy Cameron Highlanders ( with British Expeditionary Force)

Sergeant James Graham Ayshire Imperial Yeomanry

Private Anthony Graham D Troop 3rd Service Squadron Ayrshire Imperial Yeomanry

Private John Gracie or Graham K Coy Scots Guards

Private Robert Graham D Coy 4th Service Brigade Royal Scots Fusiliers

Private George Graham Argyle and Sutherland Highlanders

my Great Grandfather had 6 sons serving.

Regards

gladys

PS I have found another halfbrother William and a newspaper article stating he had 7 sons serving. Help.

[headgardener]

Interesting. There's a Scottish connection here, several scottish uniforms showing in the top left-hand group photo.

Can you enlarge those cap badges in the central photo? Doesn't look like ASC to me, more like a yeomanry group? Need a close-up in order to give an authoritative opinion.

Can't make out what's the guy's arm, by the way.......

[SFayers]

Doesn't look like ASC to me, more like a yeomanry group?

I wondered if it was Suffolk Yeomanry in the second photo - though the dimensions of the cap badge don't look quite right (at least from the scale of the photo), they look a bit too 'big'. A close-up of these chaps might help.

cheers

Steve

[CT-Guards]

Last photo look like riders to me with them trousers.

[gladys cutajar]

Last photo look like riders to me with them trousers.

Thank you all. Will try to enlarge features.

Gladys

[headgardener]

Just spotted another of your posts re; Graham family. Did you say that one of them was in the Ayrshire Yeomanry?

I said I thought that some of these pics were of a a scottish yeomanry regiment, and Ayrshire Yeomanry is what I think the cap-badge is on the central group of 4 men, and on the studio portrait.

Try to get some enlargements up. Let's take a closer look. Also the badge or insignia on the arm?

Edit; Wasn't the Ayrsh. Yeo cap badge a big eagle-winged motif, almost splitting the badge in 2? I'm feeling a bit rusty on my cap-badge ID-ing this morning, and I'm at work so I don't have any reference books. Help us out, someone............

[Jonathan D'Hooghe]

........also having a quiet day at work!! The Ayrshire badge is a big winged badge with what looks like a phoenix's head in between.

[gladys cutajar]

four soldiers with truck

[headgardener]

Yep. Ayrshire Yeomanry. Both pictures.

The men in the studio portraitr are wearing 'RP' armbands, meaning 'Regimental Police'. I'm guessing that thet're with a home service battalion here in the UK or Ireland. 1916-ish?

Edit; looking more closely at the second picture, I'd say that we can't be sure about it being Ayr Yeo.

[max7474]

The top group one is definately Ayrshire yeomanry. They stopped being Imperial in 1908. There are sereral versions of their badge. It is not clear when they changed over but the first design in 1908 was without scrolls. I attach a picture of one for comparison. Sometime after 1915 a second version with title scrolls was added. there were subsequent variations involving a change of wording. You might have both early versions in the picture.

Edited 6 January , 2019 by max7474

[max7474]

I don't have the second pattern badge but this is the WW2 one. The only major difference is the ordering of the titles. The wings and arrangement of feathers are noticably different between the first pattern badge and later ones. I suspect that you fellow seated front right as you look at it has the scrolled badge with the larger wings. The back left certainly has a first pattern badge in comparison.

[gladys cutajar]

Thank you for your help everyone.

Do you think he is an Earl of Garricks own? He looks too short to be a Graham.

Regards

Gladys

[gladys cutajar]

This one is of Brigade Bombing School Beccles

Gladys

This young soldier I think is a territorial. T & Ayrshire.

Gladys

[gladys cutajar]

Soldiers with rifles

[gladys cutajar]

could this be Robert Graham D Coy 4th Service Brigade Royal Scots Fusiliers?

[high wood]

He is certainly wearing a Royal Scots Fusiliers cap badge.

[headgardener]

could this br Robert Graham D Coy 4th Service Brigade Royal Scots Fusiliers?

The 2nd button on his tunic is blackened, which was an unofficial 'badge' indicating that he was mourning someone who had been lost in the war. Were any of Robert Graham's relatives killed/died during the war?

Do you think he is an Earl of Garricks own? He looks too short to be a Graham.

Yes, Ayr Yeo.

[headgardener]

This one is of Brigade Bombing School Beccles

Gladys

This young soldier I think is a territorial. T & Ayrshire.

The young soldier's shoulder title reads 'T/Y/Ayrshire' which stands for 'Territorial/Yeomanry/Ayrshire'. So, again, Ayr Yeo.

The larger pic is a mixed group from various units. A lot of Lovats Scouts (part of the same brigade as the Ayr Yeo at some stage - they're the ones with the diced cap-bands).

[gladys cutajar]

The 2nd button on his tunic is blackened, which was an unofficial 'badge' indicating that he was mourning someone who had been lost in the war. Were any of Robert Graham's relatives killed/died during the war?

Yes, Ayr Yeo.

Yes, two brothers. David Graham C Coy 2nd Bn Cameron Highlanders. Killed 10 May 1915. Aged 21 yrs. Menin Gate. Panel 38 & 40.

George Graham 1/5 Bn A & SH. MM. Killed 4 August 1918. Aged 22 yrs. Boisgulluame Communion Cemetery extention Seine Maritime France. Hope to go to France one day.

Robert's date of entry is 6.6.1915. One month after David was killed. Because there is only one black button could we assume this photo was taken between 1915 & 1918. Probably just before he was sent overseas. Thank you so much for all your help.

Gladys

[headgardener]

Because there is only one black button could we assume this photo was taken between 1915 & 1918.

Are you asking whether a soldier would wear one black button per dead relative? It didn't work like that I'm afraid, otherwise some poor fellows would have had to blacken all their buttons..........

[Waddell]

This one is of Brigade Bombing School Beccles

Gladys,

Good to see you sorted out enlarging the photos.

Interesting photo. Yes there are some Lovat Scouts in the photo, additionally one or two of them look to be Scottish Horse (another Yeomanry regiment). Their bonnet dicing is of a different pattern, as are there cap badges and collar dogs. The man on the left in particular, with the three buttons on the cuffs of his tunic appears to be Scottish Horse.

Wish I could add more. I'm not sure how many Home Service Brigades would have been trained in bombing?

Scott

[si168]

Great Pics,

The Ayrshire Yeomanry is my local regiment. They still have a TA centre here.

[gladys cutajar]

Thank you everyone. I still have quite a few more photos to come.

Gladys

[gladys cutajar]

this is my Grandfather James Graham 2/1 Ayrshire Yeomanry. Back left. He appears to have stripes.

Gladys

[gladys cutajar]

I am wondering if this could be Robert Graham Royal Scots Fusiliers (have posted a picture of him earlier) and His brother David Graham Cameron Highlanders. The photo was taken at a house which appears in a lot of family photos. I think it is Lockend Farm Glengarnock where they used to live. left soldier has something on his arm. I know from a newspaper article that David was about 4 inches taller tham David.

I have a couple more which I think could be David following

Regards

Gladys